20 May 2016 11:24 AM:
Good to hear you are finally getting some where with this debtor. Sometimes in fairness it's not always all the banks debt. If for instance they take back a house that has a debt on it, they are actually paying for the previous owner who didn't pay. This can be because the previous owner are intent on not paying or because they are in difficult financial trouble and have no money. In some cases, the previous owners are having to settle Community fees and outstanding utilities before the final hand back can take place. We have one on our community where this is happening. If they can't or won't settle the debt this can hold the repossession back for a further time. Once the bank realises the previous owner cannot pay, the repossession will go ahead. Then the Community can apply to the Bank for payment.
Recently I have had 2 further success's one that has been re-possessed and the Bank has settled on what it is legally obligated to pay. This is normally good news as once they pay the debt they pay the annual fees by bank transfer to our account as the owners do. The other is a UK owner that we pursued using Eurofees in the UK court system obtaining a European court order. It did take 8 months but the case went to court and the Judge sign it off 2 weeks ago and the owner has paid in full including the costs and fees over 2.5K €. Why these people don't just sell as they never use the property. The paperwork to apply for the EC order must be in order, listing all the debt periods and amounts and signed off by the President at every agm and the owners name must be on the Nota Simple at the Spanish Land registry.
Don't give up, it takes time and a lot of effort by the President and Administrator but why should they get away with not paying when it's their legal obligation to do so at the expense to other owners who do pay in their Communities.
Thread: Unpaid Community fees
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01 Feb 2016 11:37 AM:
Antonio 1, I've glad my posts have been helpful. Any UK owners I would advise using a debt collection firm, we use eurofees, there are others of course. There are several options, The no win no fee option, paying the firm out of the settlement money and fees/interest agreed by the court. Pay a fee at the start and then if you win pay a smaller fee at the end of the court case. As far as I'm aware Spain doesn't have no win no fee type of organisations. You use an Abogado and go through the Spanish very slow court system. Do remember some people have just gone back to the UK or other home countries and they have nothing , they have litte money and you can't get blood out of a stone. Try to find out their UK address and write to them. It's useless trying to recover a debt from someone who has lost everything. As much as I don't like to give up, sometimes you have to. With regard to chasing Banks, you will need the services of your Administrator or an Abogado for which you Community will have to pay for. As said the Nota Simples are not always in the current owners name particularly if it is now Bank owned. I consider this to be unlawful, however as we know Banks can do as they please. Don't ever remove a debtor from your list of debtors, until the property changes hands at the notary as you might have a chance of recouping some money. Anything is better than nothing.
If your Community is now in the black, use your money wisely, put in energy bulbs for any Community lighting, use light saver devices or timers. If you have a pool discuss with your pool man/women if you can run the pump for less time during the off season, grass watering the same, it's not as hot over the winter months and Spain does get some rain. Our water bills have been reduced by 500€ over the 2 winter quarters and so another saving. See if you can get some owners to help with any community painting, cleaning that needs to be done, it's in everyones interest to keep costs down. Community insurance, shop around for a cheaper policy, when I took over I changed providers, upgraded our cover and saved 400€, it can be done. Good luck for the future
Thread: Unpaid Community fees
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31 Jan 2016 12:24 AM:
Community's need to find a President who has experience in business dealings. The President is higher than any Administrator and needs to be strong but needs the support of the owners. I'm lucky that since taking the role I've been able to turn our Community round, it hasn't always been easy. My first priorty was to get in as much money owed as possible, from this many improvements have been made. However trying to get people from many different view points to agree is difficult. I listen and then explain why we can or can't do things, many are not aware that it is not always posible to do things as if it is only you.I stick to the facts and now have the trust and respect of my Community, they don't have to be my friends or like me. Rules is rules on a Communty it really is that simple, Like it or lump it. The Community employs an Administrator who works to the President and the laws, if they don't work for your Community's interest get another, they all want our business. It will take years to turn round the Spanish economy, as for the corruption that will take even longer, even as I type yet more Spanish politcians have been arrested at the highest level, how Spaniards vote for these people is crazy. Don't let owners build up huge debts, set a limit and then go after them, once word get out that the community will take the measures to recover debts, you'd be surprised how others don't want to end up in court, whether it's in Spain or other European countries.
Thread: Unpaid Community fees
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29 Jan 2016 11:58 AM:
Maria's comment: The debt was not expected. I believe this is probably true although naive. The Spanish promoters/banks thought that the richer UK and other foreign national would flock to buy their place in the sun, which they did, emphasise on wealthy. However many were not so weathly and were somewhat lured by the notion and their greed that they could buy several properties on 100%+ mortgages off plan and either sell them at vast profit or rent them out to all the thousands of holiday makers and golfers. As anyone who still owns a place in Spain knows, this was the start of the endless buiding, where apartments and villas are crammed so close to each other that you can see and hear what their neighbours are eating and discussing. Why people ever bought such places of which thousands did, I will never understand. No -one I know would have bought a property in the UK of such design in current times, we all like some space and privacy. Then we had the crash caused by exactly this type of behaviour, with the average person/s, who thought they could become property speculators. Many owed so much money that Community fees were the last thing they worried about. The Community's suffered with the few trying to run what is in fact similar to a small business with overheads, paying for administrators, pool maintainance, Insurance etc. Now the Banks are allowed to not registered their repossessed property, or pay the fees which they should do. The laws of Horizontal property ownership are Spanish laws, which the Banks and many owners fail to adhere to. These laws which refer to "Commuities" were as some have said were brought in to regulate the large blocks of flats in the large Spanish cities, which probably worked, but for individual property owners that are bound together because they have a shared pool really was never thought through. Whether it will ever be sorted out, I doubt it.
Thread: Unpaid Community fees
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28 Jan 2016 12:29 PM:
It's surely up to the buyers Abogado to confirm that the property is debt free, otherwise the new buyer will be responsible for any debts outstanding. Any Abogado not advising their client correctly would be not acting in the correct manner. I would have thought the buyer would have come back against the Abogado for not providing basic advice. Some people buy through agents and don't use an one so could run into problems.
Thread: Unpaid Community fees
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