Solar Power on Communities

Hi Everyone, at Golf Gardens Miraflores II in Riviera del Sol, we are looking to install solar power to heat our pool and also run the garden and garage lights. We have already identified 4 sites on the complex where panels could be installed without being an annoyance to residents and now need to find a reputable supplier to guide and advise us through the costs and installation.

Our administrator has suggested a company in Ronda, but i get the feeling it was someone they found on google rather than having any practical knowledge of.

Has anyone investigated this yet for their own villa or community and got any comments or companies on the Costa del Sol that they are happy to recommend.

or any other advice that may be useful to us or other communities looking to do the same thing?

thanks

Ian

Hi

I work for a MCS certification company NAPIT in the UK as a renewables inspector

If the install your talking about is of a commercial size, it may be worth looking at a UK based company to do it, we have set standards to work to and I'm guesing the quality on the whole will be better than a spanish company.

Is this just solar thermal or are you looking at PV as well?

Prices of kits have come down a lot over the last 3 months due to the tarif changes so may be cheaper to source materials over here too.

Any questions give me a shout

Regards

Johnzx

I personally dont think that this comes as a change of use, more a change of supplier.

We are putting it to the community at the AGM, so we will see what happens, the costs initialy look prohibitive with 30k - 50k  euro's for pool and garden lighting.

looking for some quotes at the moment

Promada,  you asked for any other advice.

You said

We have already identified 4 sites on the complex where panels could be installed

By sites,  I assumed you meant on community property,  otherwise I cannot imagine where you might be putting them.  If at p[rfsent that is open to the community that would seem be a change of use.

David Searl said, putting a door on a corridor which only gave access to your front  door would be included, as too, changing a parking area into a garden. 

 I've never used them myself but I've head good stuff about Prism Solar.

Justin

How is it going to heat the pool?  I have heard not so good feedback on that, saying that it only heated the top 2/3 inches of the water.

We have solar panels at our house just for the hot water but when you need it the most, ie., during winter, it's not that effective.  It only warms the water in the winter, it doesn't actually heat it.

It's a bit ironic that the panels work best when you need them the least 

Justin

We have a large piece of land owned by the Town Hall plus some undeveloped land owned by the developer on our Urbanisation, could that possibly be used to place banks of photovoltaics funded by and supplying all the communities, how far away can you send power?

We have already identified 4 sites on the complex where panels could be installed

The 4 sites we have identified are on the top of two portal/lift shafts (4mtrs x 4mtrs), a disused plant trough (6mtrs x 3mtrs) on top of a rocky escarpment and on the side of the rock bank (10mtrs x 10mtrs) none of these positions affect any passageway or change any usage of the community in any way.

 Ill be happy to give advice here, what is it that you would like to power exactly?

we are looking to possibly heat the outdoor pool 20m x 15m and also the garden lights on the community. not sure of the caperbilities so if poss would look at portal and garage lights that are all on low voltage timed sensors.

i will try and get some more details.

pictures of the community are on our website www.golfgardensmiraflores.co.uk and also if you do a google image search for the community name golf gardens miraflores II

 Ok well the lighting wouldnt be too much of a problem, using low wattage lights, however heating the swimming pool is serious business, and in my opinion not really a good idea using conventional solar panels. There are solar panels for swimming pools that do a good job, and may extend the use of the pool by a good 3-4 months (of the brave) but they are quite ugly and work best placed near the pool;

http://detectenergy.com/solar-wind-power-2/solar-swimming-pool-heater/0AXM0tTcBg&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=187&sig=113540840097653646785&page=1&tbnh=133&tbnw=126&start=0&ndsp=18&ved=1t:429,r:3,s:0&tx=72&ty=72

using the panels to do both the lighting and pool heating would be too much load, youll spend a fortune and not really get desired results, also bear in mind in summer, you want the pool to cool off in, with solar panels it can reach very high temperatures in summer, think roman baths, unless you turn them off!

Hi all

Without a full site visit (photos tend not to be good enough) it is difficult to put together a proposal/quote

However when you have full plannng permisssions in place, consider the following-

You have a few options you could have both thermal and pv linked to some sort of buffer tank which could act as a boiler for your pool which you run lighting from a bank of batteries, or have separate systems, or pv on its own.

With the sun being available 300+ days a year pv will work most of the year.

If you are serious about this project put together your plans with the permissions required and I will put your proposition some of our members (installers)

When you have dialogue with them arrange a fair way for them to come over to spain for them to do full site visit and go from there

If you need to check my company out go to www.napit.org.uk

regards

With respect, there are outfits here in Spain that peddle solar pool heating and pv kits. These are designed to be installed by any competent DIY'er or plumber/electrician. Have a browse around the spanishsolar site for example

Hi all

With respect, I see professional plumbers/electricians who do a terrible job with regard to installing pv and thermal on a weekly basis.

I'm pretty sure their is a tariff system in Spain for solar power.

So there must be a set standard for installers to ensure that regs and quality issues are met

DIYERS doing this type of work scares the hell out of me, I've seen the results

Anyway, good luck to all involved

Regards

I'm a little surprised by Justin's post 06 Mar 2012 18:53 after solar h/w heating installed here (Baza, Granada) a year ago. Installation guy advised backup heating so we fitted small electric h/w heater to solar circuit which has been switched on for about 2 days during that year. OK, no sun = little solar heating, the solar tank's not small (200l) and only I use h/w (including washing machine feed) but I'd say major advantage -- even for big family -- is the backup system (when rarely required) is heating water that's already at well above the exterior feed to the house (town, well, etc) temp -- sometimes frozen here -- and therefore a considerable cost saving although calculating just how much (return on investment) is difficult.

On other hand, installation guy advised against PV when mains power supply available (my case) because, not least, cost of backup generator and/or bank of batteries which -- for reasons Justin points out -- are needed in winter to power a "normal" home. However, there's a lady near here without mains supply who had PV installed with a panel she can manually orientate, and I understand her backup gen's never been used.....  But a big family?

Hi Trowell1 - If you choose carefully you can find good independent PV and Solar Thermal (hot water or pools) technicians in most areas of Spain to install your internet purchased kits - we local guys are trying to make a living and there is little need to blanket "diss" us Sir! My outfit  provides comprehensive kit installation instructions in english and spanish languages.

I advise my clients to look for a plumber/elecdtrician with the extra "add on" solar certifcates - from memory they are called a T1 and S1 most of them have bothered to go to night school fpr the requisite traing if they are worth their salt IMHO.

Yes there is a Feed In Tarif in Spain - it is being reduced as we speak though and there is a terrible fuss about that.. Personally Spanish Solar is not homologated for grid connected systems (you try and get spanish homolagation if you are not spanish Gunga Din!) So I confine myself to autonomous installations, acting as an agent for a spanish chum for grid connected ones- but as I said those are getting less attractive as time goes by.

DIY'ers are a fact of life - we live with it and make sure they have access to advice by email and phone - if they wabt to save that last centimo it's their choice - personally I change my own vehicle engine oil and paint my own woodwork - do you?

Regards

P

Hi popeyesol

I am not dissing anyone.

I am trying to give information to someone who has asked for some.

Just stating how things work in the uk, a contractor under MCS accrediation should design the system, supply the components and complete the installation to a set of standards issued to them.

the result is that the installer is responsible for every part of the job.

I am sure that are good/bad  plumbers and electricians in Spain as there are in the UK, this system is to make sure that the customer is given some confidence with a decision that they have made to who completes their install.

Thats All

I tried to paint my pvc windows with engine oil and ended up with a right mess!

You would be wise to get a quote from a UK-based company to compare with your local quotes.  The majority of companies here charge a ridiculous mark-up on equipment - there is 'making a living' and there is ripping people off with mark-ups of 200% or 300%.

Don't pay more than €60/Kw for solar water panels, or more than €1.6/W for solar PV.

We are Spanish agents for a major UK supplier and would be more than happy to provide branded UK sourced equipment, installed by UK qualified engineers (holding current UK registration), at half the cost of the over-priced systems in Andalucia.

We believe that solar power is one way that Spain can help get itself out of the mire it is in - cover every roof in Andalucia with panels and sell the resulting surplus of energy to The North - but only if companies stop ripping people off.