Hi!- And a question for everyone already happily relocated

I don't know why you, Floella, took my posting so personally - perhaps it was because it followed directly after yours? It wasn't meant as criticism of yours. As you say, you actually posted some more insights rather than  just the usual climate / cost comparisons. But then you succumbed to the usual arguments - and since the OP as usual has posted once and disappeared (not surprisingly) I don't mind carrying on with this pointless discussion either!

You posted some "facts" regarding comparitive costs, so let's analyse them: not everyone pays £2,900 UK council tax (even in 2017); not everyone pays €420 IBI in Spain. Fact: my sister-in-law owns a 4 bedroom detached house with large garden in Merseyside and pays around £1,600 council tax; friends in Torremolinos own a detached 5 bed villa with a tiny garden and pay €2,500 IBI. My sister-in-law pays around £1,000 per year for water (not metered); our community in Torremolinos has a similar size garden, and pay about €3,000 a year just for water to irrigate it. So what does that prove?

Let's face it, anyone who can comfortably afford £2,900 council tax (and can afford to eat / drink out regularly in the UK), probably won't be too concerned about comparitive living expenses. If they can't afford it, they'd downsize or move to another part of the country, but moving to Spain isn't likely to be the solution. At the other end of the spectrum, someone who doesn't own their own home and is reliant on a UK state pension (& maybe other benefits) alone, will struggle to survive in Spain. And as I mentioned before, unless you're one of the rose-tinted spectacle brigade who believe that because they're British they don't have to pay tax in Spain (either ignorance or deliberately flying under the radar believing they'll always get away with it because Spaniards are stupid), a couple on basic UK state pensions alone will probably end up paying over €1,000 a year income tax, which could well cancel out any saving on the much highlighted council tax comparison.

The OP knows already that booze & fags and some other things are cheaper in Spain, but also knows that basing a move abroad on that alone is probably not smart. Anyway, enough on that....your shot!

Roberto.    Your right, the amount of council tax stated on here must be the absolutely top whack for the region they are in.   My council tax is about what your stating in your post and we are in a highish band in our locality.    We should be telling the truth about things.

So to recap.   From personal first hand current experience.

UK.   Council tax 1585.00.   

Gas and electricity combined per annum.     £960.00 (80per month).

My car Road tax £40per year.  Car insurance £212.00per year

food spend per week around £70 if we are a bit extravagant.   

Eating out.......three local restaurants to walk to, Italian is approx £22 for us two before 7 and add around 10% after that (including a couple of drinks)

So being honest, it’s looking cheaper over here from those figures.   Worth doing a direct comparison anyway for the OP.

Roberto, where do you get the a couple on basic UK state pensions alone will probably end up paying over €1,000 a year income tax from?
Basic UK tax is £116 a week or, if you retired after April last year, £122 a week. On the higher rate that is £6344 or €7100. The Spanish tax allowance for over 65 is €6700 a year plus which means tax would be 19% on €400. In addition there is a general allowance of €2000 per person regardless of income and a married person allowance of €3400 for the first taxpayer so that is well over that 400 euro difference.

So, even if both are earning the new higher rate then there is no way you would pay any income tax on that pension, let alone a thousand euro a year as the minimum allowance for a retired couple would be €20,488 and the pension for two on the higher rate is only €14,210.

Simply doing individual returns and ignoring the married person allowance would also be well under the rate on which tax is paid.

My husband receives a government pension from UK which is only taken into account for assessing the tax rate. I receive an NHS pension which I declare here and we both get the UK OAP, hubby at the max 116 a week and me at only 85 a week as I spent a lot of time in Germany. Between us we get (after UK taxes) €32,000 a year. On that our joint tax payable in Spain last year was less than 200 euro.

Dec 8th..14.40...Just returned from shopping and after scanning the pedantic responses from folk who believe only they write the truth...decided life is better served supping a cup of tea whilst relaxing in my idyllic Spanish garden as temperature is a mere 18c.....bliss

Please don't miss your boat...windie ✋🏽

Mariedav.   

Why is there a threshold of £6700 pa and then a general allowance of £2000 pa.     is the 2k something that is an added extra that may take off you sometime?     I’m wondering why they don’t just allow £8700 pa.  

plus a married persons allowance of 3400: between two.  

Does that stay after one expires, are you still marrie as a widow/widower?  Does it include same sex couples etc?

so 8700 plus 1700 would be 10400. Each as a married couple.    

In the UK it’s now 12500 each so there is still quite a difference.   I’m assuming not many people leave to stay in Spain on just a state pension.   

Some important points there I think.  

Roberto

"- and since the OP as usual has posted once and disappeared (not surprisingly)"

Reading a through a few topics on EOS there seems to be a lot of these.

As a relatively new member myself I can see why this happens.

Not many different posters and those that do  reply end up bickering amongst themselves then you get the irrelevant drivel. 

It has made me question why I bother but I am giving it a chance for now

Not sure what you mean Dazzo.   The banter between people very often brings out the important information.   It looks as though it is on this thread anyway. 

The OP should be getting some 'real' information here, not the salesmanship from estate agents and TV channels.

theres lots of posts for dog food and Gardner’s that don’t have any banter at all.   

Tell your experience and maybe it feeds into the debate?

Briando55 

I have shared my experince o n living in spain

Yes there is some good banter but why has the new member who asked the question come back

As said I can understand why and they are not the first to ask a question  then never return and it the same few members who respond on many topics

briando55

Obviously questions you'd have to ask a gestor or solicitor. Merely pointing out that someone (or a couple) on a UK pension only would not pay any taxes in Spain. Those are the figures from my tax return as provided by our solicitor.

I would, however, imagine they do apply to same sex married couples as Spain was one of the first in the EU to recognise them, some 9 years before the UK did.

And I do know the marriage allowance is not as simple as just adding 3.400 to your limits. You take it off the combined income after personal allowances have been deducted.

No, I don't know why the General earned income allowance of €2000 is not added to your basic allowance as it is regardless of income and is fixed and includes pension income.

There is also an additional low income allowance which is worth €3,700 if you earn under €11.250 and €3700 pro rata on income between that and €14250 with 0 above that figure. So you say the UK allowance is £12500 but the Spanish one of 6700 plus 2000 general allowance plus a low income allowance of 3700 comes to €12,400 if you are on a low income like a pension.

So it's not as simple as applying UK systems to the Spanish system.

But you won't pay tax on a basic UK pension. And we won't pay tax on ours this year as the amount in euros is less than last year due to the lower exchange rate.

And the lower cost of living (which it is), the sun (which is a big factor) are not the only reasons we stay here. I like the laid back way of life even though the Spanish work longer hours than they do in UK. I might seem a bit hypocritical pointing out that if you live in mainly Brit expat area then it would be pointless coming here as I do live in one but it seems a lot less like it than huge communities full of Brits. We have several large towns nearby which are a joy to visit (if only they'd pick up the dog mess) and sitting outside a restaurant with a wonderful coffee and tapa in December really makes it.  

Hubby speaks very good Spanish, me not so much although I do understand a lot, just can't seem to find the words when replying and struggle with the grammar (he learned his in his 30s, for me at approaching my 70th year I find it hard to remember why I go upstairs sometimes let alone conjugate irregular verbs in my spare time) but he enjoys sitting in the park and chatting to the old guys or joining in a conversation outside a local cafe over coffee (€1 for his espresso and €1.20 for my cafe con leche or cortado). We lived in a village in UK for over 15 years after he left the army but we have  got to know more people here (of all nationalities) than we ever did in UK. Probably because we were both out at work all day.

Anyone who wants to come over and live here can join the hundreds of thousands of Brits who have already done so and who are enjoying it.

Although I would agree that living on a basic pension would not allow you much leeway although you could live on €1200 a month (if you are both on the new higher rate) if you didn't have expensive tastes or buy exotic imported food like baked beans. 

Yep, OK, think I may have got my figures wrong. May have been thinking about my own circumstances too much; I know I'd pay less tax in the UK than Spain, but everyone's circumstances are different, and I just thought it was worth mentioning as something that should be taken into consideration when making life-changing decisions.

Anyway, nobody so far has mentioned the most compelling reason for moving to Spain - no need to pay the TV licence 

(Of course, you may want a VPN instead, but the saving should still be enough to buy a few more cortados in the sun!!) 

Thought everyone in Spain had a dodgy box.   😳

Thought everyone in Spain had a dodgy box.   😳

We haven't got one, let alone three.

Ha.  Sorry.  Dodgy wi fi 

As mariedav mentioned there is the obvious appeal of slower pace of life and people having time to stop and chat. Just like the 50's in UK. Most noticeable at this time of the year when here the UK mentality of panic shopping for Christmas just doesnt exist.  

Considering everyone and their dog has a car it is amazing , with exception of E15 and main city centres, how devoid of traffic most of the roads in my area are. 

Digi box !!!!! Dodgy or not..if it is for Sky Briando then didn't subscribe in UK so definately not required here because, for us, 8/9 months of the year outdoor living , until bedtime, is the norm.

Over a certain mature age Roberto believe tv licence payment isn't required.

Hi everyone- no don't worry, I havent disappeared!

we went to visit our son and his wife over the weekend, so I didnt have the computer! Im used to forums where you maybe wait a week to get a response- I'm surprised how active this one is.

What you've all said so far is helpful. Finances wise, Im confident we'll be able to handle it. I have a few investments that we try to life off, a reasonable amount of savings, and quite a lot of money tied up in the house, if we were to sell. (sorry, I hate talking about money) if we were going to go for it, We WERE thinking of renting first, to get a feel for the lifestyle. we're very cautious people like that. No Sense throwing ourselves into it with no way back.

Language wont be an issue either. We both like to learn languages for fun, and between us can have manageable (if badly pronounced) conversations in 6 languages. adding another won't be too hard.

We have a few friends in Spain and we were thinking of moving nearby to one/ some of them so that a) they could help with the process, having done it before, and b) to help stave off the loneliness. 

Of course we care about the family, but we're hoping to be relatively near an airport. All the kids live reasonably far away- its a few hours- and we figure that a few hours by car is about the same as a few hours by plane. a days travel is a days travel, at the end of the day. We have friends in our local area, too, but we've up-sticks and moved before- we had to for my job about 30 years ago. We weathered the storm quite well, and reckon we could do it again.

I asked because we havent had that HOOK, that feeling that something jumped out and said "right, thats it, thats why were doing this". Its kind of... Weve been often, seen the lifestyle, and we want it for ourselves, we do. Someone had a wonderful story of their husband sitting around the coffee shop with a cortado, just talking and letting the day go by- that's what we want. Not to be surrounded by people always having something to do or somewhere to go, just relaxing and enjoying life. You hit it right on the nose, floella. And were both healthy at the moment (touch wood), and we'd like to keep that going, which we know spain is great for. there are a bunch of reasons why we should make the move, or at least dip our toes in the water, but no big emotional pull, if you get me. A decision like this shouldnt be like a sum- add up all the parts and EUREKA, your off! you need to FEEL that its what you want. Thats what Im curious about. For you who are already there, maybe you saw an advert that suddenly got you curious, or maybe you went on holiday and just suddenly felt 'this is how I want to live '. Maybe you read a book and felt it. What was that tipping point, the emotional hook, the thing that just made it feel 'right'? 

We'll probably go ahead with a small rental regardless, and hope we feel something while we're over there. Im just a little curious, and a little hopeful that maybe we could take your advice on that front. Its just not the sort of decision we want to do like a sum- we know the maths works, but thats no good if it doesn't feel good.

I think if you canvassed everyone who has moved to live in Spain from UK and elsewhere in Europe you would find top of the list would be the climate. It’s a very strong ‘emotional hook’ as you called it. A good climate enables you to so many things, impossible in the colder, wetter parts of Europe. As you age a good climate provides an incomparable and priceless feeling of well-being. So for me who spends half the year in France the hook is climate, quality of the people and cost of living in that order.

Hope your ‘hook’ gets stronger.

RR....2004, and as recent retirees with a passion for gardening we felt life passing us by.  

Over the course of a year England is fortunate if it has 2 months of dry sunny weather in which we could enjoy our hobby. Adding into the equation the desire to design and organise the build of our own house.

Although Italy was our first choice the 10 year planning rule is a nightmare we decided instead to explore what Spain had to offer.

Took a year to find the village we now live in. It's not picture postcard but both husband and I felt immediately at home.

And that was the start of our adventure that, whatever happens in the future, neither of us has any regrets taking up the challenge.

Won't deny it didn't have its hiccups and however much thought and planning one puts into relocating, even in UK, there will always be a " Why didn't we think of that" ,moment.

IF the day comes you should feel the same RR , that's the time to follow the dream. Until then best to remain visitors.

RR

I think I would trust the views of your friends in Spain - what a great source of knowledge you have with them