Letting in Andalucia, experience from elsewhere

Big A

All of us who have done a little research on the internet know it is all out there, but of course one has to go and find it and not expect to be spoon fed.  Ignorance in law is no defence !

John

A more helpful answer might have been to include the links to all this available information, my experience is that there is plenty of information out there, most of it needs sifting through to find the relevant parts that apply.

There would not be so many people confused if the information was easily available, maybe some HELPFUL Brit who has already 'trodden this path' could make things easier for those who don't know.

 , The attitude of 'your on your own mate' seems rather churlish, hopefully there are people out there who are of the thought process 'we are all in this TOGETHER'.

Randolph, I apologise for the unhelpful response from Johnnx, I can assure you that he is not representative of all Brits.

Big Al

I've always found the Abaco website to be a excellent source of tax information both for residents and non residents

I got the link from the Andalucia.com site. There were also postings regarding May being the deadline to register.  Chica 56 who seems to know what he is on about replied

None of the information above is accurate. THe law has been passed, just, but it is not in the BOJA yet and needs to be published there. Then there are 3 months from that date within which you can get the property registered on the Register. However I have read that the people responsible for the Register have said the Register will not be ready until May....

If a property requires structural Works to comply with the law then you get a year to do this in........but its only a year for structural works

Every property needs a licence of occupation (first or second) to go on the Registry and all bedrooms are required to have AC, as well as the living room. 

There are exemptions, including rural property. 

As there are stated to be 80000 properties in Andalucia then I fail to see how they will manage to register all those in such a short time frame.....especially as the actual application process and forms are not even available yet......

I agree with the need for the law but the time frame is ridiculous, hope its not another licence to print money...

As I have been trying to point out - all  the info  I can find  is contradictory and confusing. I plan to wtihdraw from the rental market until all is sorted out. It is far too easy to fall foul of the rules, even when trying to do your best.

Thanks Big A. I think John only sees that I have broken the rules. I was trying to explain how easy it was to be fall foul even when doing our best to comply. I certainly did not do it to save money - it cost me more paying the Modelo 210 AND the UK tax! Must admit it is a tad galling to be told what I did wrong when I've admitted it myself and was just trying to explain how I made the error. 

Randolph - Sorry, I didn't mean to put the fear of God into you. No need to overreact, don't pull the plug just yet. Wait and see what others are doing, gather more information, then make your decision. I didn't for one minute intend to suggest you are corrupt, and rest assured, I imagine the vast majority of non-residents (and a good few residents who really should know better) are probably in the exact same boat. 

John is correct (on most things most of the time, so respect/credit where due, folks) in that the so-called "non-resident" tax is not actually a non-resident tax at all - think of more as a second home tax. If you are non-resident in Spain, then by definition your property here must be a second home. When I owned more than one property, I had to declare them and pay "imputed" tax on them when filing my annual declaration, so don't think it's non-resident or foreign owners being persecuted! John is also right in saying that all the necessary information is available for anyone who bothers to look for it, and for those who can't be bothered or who simply don't have a clue where to look, then use a professional gestor for goodness sake! (hint: don't trust informationm on websites of lawyers/financial advisors - it's often out of date or simply wrong. One of the most reliable sources of information I know of is a rival site to this so I can't mention it other than to say it gives a good insight into all Spanish property matters.

In fairness, this imputed tax does certainly appear to be a way for the govt. to collect from all those second property owners who are deliberately hiding their rental income, and I've no doubt that one of the main motivators behind the regulating of private rentals is to force these black economy landlords into the open in order to boost tax revenues. But I wouldn't worry too much about them trying to collect back-tax. The administration involved would be overwhelming, and they would have a hard time proving what your real income has been in past years, so relax, take your time, and see what develops.

On a side point, I find it intriguing that Spain seems to lose much of it's appeal to foreigners, the more it adopts customs and practices that those same foreigners accept as normal "back home"! 

I would like to clarify for people like Big A.  I am not here to earn a living.  The time I spend, like several others, is to help people who cannot or do not want to pay for advice.   I also have a life outside this forum.

I already give time on a voluntary basis every week to help people and have done so for 17 years.   If I have info immediately to hand, I will post it, but sorry I am not going to trawl the internet every time (and it is quite often) someone who cannot be bothered to make the effort for themselves, wants help.

PS   I have just come from the foreigner resident’s office of my local town hall where I was assisting them re probelms which non-Spaniards face.  I translate, on a voluntary basis, information  they publish for the attention and assistance of non-Spanish speakers.

Johnnx

It is highly commendable that you help others when possible.

When people ask questions on this forum they are looking for people that may be able to help them, the questions are not usually directed at any individual.

It would propbaby be more helpful if individuals who cannot help leave the responses to those who can, I refer to you recent reply below:

Big A

All of us who have done a little research on the internet know it is all out there, but of course one has to go and find it and not expect to be spoon fed.  Ignorance in law is no defence !

The idea (I assume) of this forum is that it is a place where people can go and 'share information', not ot be told 'go and look elsewhere', surely that type of response makes this forum surplus to requirements.

Just a suggestion, if you cannot offer any help, why not resist the temptation to wear your keyboard out?

Big A

BigA. Thanks for your suggestion.  I trust you will excuse me if take notice of what you say in proportion to the posts you have made asking for help (and criticising me) in relation to number of posts I have made supplying help.

This message was last edited by johnzx on 12/02/2016.

AARRRGGHHHHH!!!!!

Just gone onto the website Roberto suggested- the one to do with 'insight 'and  'Spanish Property'. Even they are confused.

ie on the opening page it says 

'The law was published on the 11th of February, so the three-month deadline ends on: 11th of May 2016. As from this day onwards, this new Decree will come into force.'

If you click onto Holiday Rental Laws it says

Due Date: Owners can register from May 2016 on the Registro de Turismo de Andalucía. They will have three months to register, before the Junta de Andalucía have warned they will issue fines.

Please note the 'from'

Does anyone have the definitive answer.????

Thanks for the advice Roberto. I agree that back taxes are unlikely to be issued - it's the fines that really worry me. 

Andalusia’s Holiday Rental Law was officially published in the BOJA on the 11th of February

In compliance with this Decree and with Law 13/2011, of Tourism in Andalusia, landlords will have a three-month deadline to register their properties before the Junta de Andalusia as from the day this new decree is officially published in the BOJA (Andalusia’s official law gazette). The law was published on the 11th of February, so the three-month deadline ends on: 11th of May 2016. As from this day onwards, this new Decree will come into force.

Entry into force of the Decree: 12th of May 2016

Unless the obligation for air conditioning/heating which enters into force on the 12th of May 2017