Builder's supply of water and electricity

I have my escitura and there is a clause whicjh states that the builder must supply water and electricity at his expense until the urbanisation is completed and I get my certificate of first habitation.

About half of the properties on the urbanisation have their escitura but the the others have not due to various issues such as loans against the land etc that are outstanding.

The builder has taken it upon himself to form a community and appointed himself president.  There was no election or meetings.

The builder is now asking for 200 euros per month for water, electricity and rubbish disposal.  This started in Nov 2008.  Water and electricity will be turned off if anyone does not pay.  Most people paid the money as they cannot be without water and electricity.

The residents decided to form their own community and have appointed a Spanish management company.  The papers should be signed shortly.  The residents decided not to pay the 200 euros payment for February.  The plan is for them to negotiate directly with the utility companies for the supply of water and electricity.  We know that the builder has not being paying the water and electricity companies for the supply and they are threatening to cut him off.

The water for the whole urbanisation stopped last week and the builder said that the water pump had broken down and he could not afford to have it repaired unless the residents paid the 200 euros.  After 4 days without water the residents gave in and paid the money.

I hope that the new community will soon be formed but I have my doubts about the builder ever signing the relevant papers for the handover of responsibility.  He is still demanding 200 euros despite saying he will sign the papers for the new community.  He has a complete disregard for the law.

Becaise of the clause in my escitura I contacted a solicitor who said there was very little I could do other than start a legal challenge which could drag on for years and be very expensive.

What can we do in these circumstances.?

PaddyW

The law in Spain regarding the supply of builders water and electricity is taken very seriously in Spain with big penalties for builders who fail to live up to their obligations

If you search this forum you will be able to find a thread for another development in Campoamor where the builder threatened the same action and the consiquences of his actions, his immediate arrest by the Guarda Civil, it is taken that seriously

You don´t have to go thorugh any lengthy legal process simply go to the local Police statuion as a group, ideally with a translator and denounce the builder and they must take immediate action but you must do this ASAP

I would suggest that the lawyer isn´t being quite as helpfull as he could be or is he perhaps connected to the builder

It is nothing to do with having an Escitura as it is simply the law, no COH and the builder must supply FREE OF CHARGE utilities 

It will be difficult to get any connections without the COH and you would be better chasing the Town Hall to establish where that is in the system first.

Remember when you are adopted your SUMA Tax will be backdated which covers your rubbish collection and I know its 2020 hindsight is great but what lawyer allowed somebody to complete on a property with no deeds and a loan or mortgage showing, is it the same lawyer that is advising you now

Don´t just take my word for it look at the other thread as the builder will just bully and rely on peoples ignorance and failure to act

Just in case here are some of details form the other thread 

Hi

I live on CAMPOSOL sector D35, about 3 months ago MIGUEL( the camposol site manager) rang my doorbell, and demanded I pay 100€ within 24 hours or he would cut off the electric! and the same amount be payed monthly until Iberdrola connected us. I told Miguel that what he was asking was ILEGAL,  He replied YES it is, but can you manage without electric? Obviously we cant and for the next 2 months we duly paid the 100€. During this time we contacted local solicitors, who advised us that what Miguel (or Grupo Masa) was doing was totally illegal-----BUT-----  If masa cut of our electricity, with the industrial action of the courts of justice, it  could take months or years to get us re-connected!!!  I share this experience with HUNDREDS of people in the same situation. In a ideal world Miguel would be prosecuted !! For demanding money with threats(EXTORTION) and for illegally charging for BUILDERS SUPPLY electric

Many thanks To Mr Roy Howitt, The help he has given us is unbeleivable, we took his advise and 9 of MASAs "victims" went to the Guardia and with the help of our translator swore out denuncias against Miguel Torrinto (site manager & director) for demanding money by threat (extorsion) and illegally charging for builders supply
Electric & water, the news that 7 ( yes 7 ) poli

Up to date news! Costa Almeria news are going to publicise this for us , including passing on the message to their Spanish newspaper colleagues.on the local front The Camposol Courier  (Camposol Residents association) are going to feature this story, in the Courier due out 1st June. The more the merrier
ce cars came to his office today and took him away
We are eternally gratefull to Mr Roy Howitt for his invaluable advise and support
Bob Smith
he original post and the result which was featured in the Alimeria News

I spoke with our interepeter today,  (Fiona Green) she told me she had received a phone call from a lady on Camposol, who had her electricity cut off, Fiona advised her to go to MASAs office and inform them, that as denuncias had been laid with the guardia, unless they immediately restored her electric, she was going to the guardia to had her name to the list!   When she returned home, the electric had been restored. Our biggest worry was that had we been cut off, how long would it take to get it restored??
Well now we know!!
 

inspectahomespain wrote

The law in Spain regarding the supply of builders water and electricity is taken very seriously in Spain with big penalties for builders who fail to live up to their obligations

If you search this forum you will be able to find a thread for another development in Campoamor where the builder threatened the same action and the consiquences of his actions, his immediate arrest by the Guarda Civil, it is taken that seriously

You don´t have to go thorugh any lengthy legal process simply go to the local Police statuion as a group, ideally with a translator and denounce the builder and they must take immediate action but you must do this ASAP

I would suggest that the lawyer isn´t being quite as helpfull as he could be or is he perhaps connected to the builder

It is nothing to do with having an Escitura as it is simply the law, no COH and the builder must supply FREE OF CHARGE utilities 

It will be difficult to get any connections without the COH and you would be better chasing the Town Hall to establish where that is in the system first.

Remember when you are adopted your SUMA Tax will be backdated which covers your rubbish collection and I know its 2020 hindsight is great but what lawyer allowed somebody to complete on a property with no deeds and a loan or mortgage showing, is it the same lawyer that is advising you now

Don´t just take my word for it look at the other thread as the builder will just bully and rely on peoples ignorance and failure to act

WELL I'D JUST LIKE TO SEE YOU DO THAT IN ORIHUELA COSTA. It just doesn't work as simply as you say when everyone is corrupt.

I actually live in Orihuela Costa and I agree, especially if you are a TU customer but often people don´t use the systems available to them to complain

If people go to law they will win howvever you can´t get blood form a stone and if they have no money it is difficult howvever things are changing

I have a property near Villamartin and did win an action against a builder

Hi inspectahome I have read your info but am unclear on one point. Is the situation different if the Builder is in Administration /Concurso .Does this change things and would residents then be expected to pay?  Regards JA

This is a grey area as legally even in administration, which means they are still trading, the receiver has a legal responsibility to agree the payments of the builder which has been happening for example at some of the San Jose developments where I understand that the services are still connected and being paid for

It is quite complex as some utility suppliers will not connect up services without a COH so there are other examples where the builder stops paying for the utilities and the owners are left without power or water

Recently in Orihuela Costa when this happened the town hall stepped in an provided generators as they agreed the delay in the cOH were their fault

The fact still stands that if a company is still trading they, or their agents,  are legally required to provide utilities if there is no COH 

Thanks for that inspectahome .SanJose and their administration have demanded the residents at El Pinet pay the utility costs .Residents are now paying even though they have no way of securing meters and their own supplies as they do not have COH .How can the law be so grey it states quite clearly in the contract that the builder is responsible .How will these companies ever learn to stay with in the law if it is so lenient on those who persistantly disregard so many of the property laws .JA

The builders try it on and unfortunately people simply accept it rather than taking any real professional legal advice and yes you are right there should be no grey area

Leagally there is no way that they can prove or even breakdown the charge per owner as there are no meters so a legal challenge to collect the money would fail and legally they cannot cut off the supply

The administrators work for the builder to minimise the debt and produce a plan so that the builder can trade out of administration

What happens if te owners refuse to pay on legal grounds, has anybody tried to challenge this

No one  at ElPinet has challenged this as they have been threatened by the admin and SJ  with being cut off .There are a lot of people who live there permenantly therefore they decided just to pay.The way I see it the builder wins every time on all matters .

I would not touch the Spanish property market  again . I have visited Spain at least  twice or three times  a year for 40 years and I am so angry about all the property abuses I will not be visiting again .Many Brits will not visit Spain  as tourists this year due to the weak pound and the credit crunch and I just read in the Spanish press that Spain are glad about this as it will give them the chance to attract some "Quality tourists " Spain will never recover from the harm that has been caused by their attitude , their failure to enforce their own law  and their total disregard for the human  rights of  their own and other  EU citizens caught up in the in the property scandals   .Regards JA

This message was last edited by julie anne on 1/19/2009.

The problem is that too many people  just roll over and do not seek professional advice and don´t want to rock the boat, and just because they are dealing with a Spanish company they must be in the wrong, the British way I´m afraid

I have many examples where once a person knows the law and are able to make it clear to a bulder, that they know their rights that the builders have backed off.

In my own case the builder threatened all sorts of things so I took the lawyer to the builders offices and he explained my rights and everybody did not have to pay for builders supply

There is an excellent consumer support organisation at the Town Halls, OMIC, where you can formally complain about any business and they will investigate your case

I am not defending things but for every bad case of property abuse you read about there are thousands of successfull buyers enjoying their holiday homes and I wouldn´t write off the Spanish holiday market so easily and it is just a case of following the rules including, independant lawyer, get a valid Bank Guarnatee  and not to complete unless the COH has been issued

In my own case Spring and Summer bookings for my apartments are up on the same time last year, all new renters to me not returning clients but i real terms rates are down because of the euro as I am still charging  the same sterling rate, but with a number of bookings from France.

My business however which is property linked is very quiet

I also accept that there are parts of the system that are corrupt but I am seeing things change, VERY SLOWLY

The problem is that too many people  just roll over and do not seek professional advice and don´t want to rock the boat, and just because they are dealing with a Spanish company they must be in the wrong, the British way I´m afraid

I have many examples where once a person knows the law and are able to make it clear to a bulder, that they know their rights that the builders have backed off.

In my own case the builder threatened all sorts of things so I took the lawyer to the builders offices and he explained my rights and everybody did not have to pay for builders supply

There is an excellent consumer support organisation at the Town Halls, OMIC, where you can formally complain about any business and they will investigate your case

I am not defending things but for every bad case of property abuse you read about there are thousands of successfull buyers enjoying their holiday homes and I wouldn´t write off the Spanish holiday market so easily and it is just a case of following the rules including, independant lawyer, get a valid Bank Guarnatee  and not to complete unless the COH has been issued

In my own case Spring and Summer bookings for my apartments are up on the same time last year, all new renters to me not returning clients but i real terms rates are down because of the euro as I am still charging  the same sterling rate, but with a number of bookings from France.

My business however which is property linked is very quiet

I also accept that there are parts of the system that are corrupt but I am seeing things change, VERY SLOWLY

Great to read positive contributions.

Companies under Administration have same obligations on keeping the providing of water and electricity to owners.

What is the problem for your own connection?

Thank you Maria yes I think that we need more positive stories to counter some of the bad news

In my own case I don´t have a problem anymore as we now have our COH, 4 years after we completed and now have permanent connections. What happened was 2.5 years after completion the builder decided that he was going to start charging €150 per month and fortunately I had researched this, and we had a good administrator and we were able to stop this.

The important for us is that the advice we give is based on real practical experience of the Soanish system, I have successfully used the complaints form system and git results and I do complain when things are not right, like the Spanish people do.

I think that we do often focus on the negative things as there are thousands of brits who enjoy a happy and heathy life in Spain and thousands of holiday makers that will return to Spain, which will increase once the euro settles down again and if there is a poor Summer 

I am a great believer in Positive Mental Attitude and if you are down then it is seen and reflected in what you do and how you react to people, the sagging shoulders with your head down

I treat the rental of my apartment like a business and work hard on the presentation, facilities and customer satisfaction, treating itlike a business.

I have owned my property 5 years, can´t sell it, but because of the reducung mortgage payments I can afford to reduce my rates and still cover my costs. If I do sell it then I can sell it for less as the euro rate when purchased was 1.47

In my own case, due to the economic situation my new property snagging business is quiet, people are not completing and watching their pennies so I have started a  new service. The service advises people on how to get more rentals and provide a professional local information pack for renters which promotes the fact that Spain offers much more than bars, beaches

I am not trying to ignore the financial situation of many expats and pensioners and expect the euro to weaken agianst the pound  but after 5 years in Spain, which certainly hasn´t been problem free,  I am very happy with my life and  have no plans to return to the UK

Our buider in torreta III in torrevieja has charged all residents 300 for the connection fee to Iberdola when completing.  Surprise surprise though when Iberdola connected us to the systme (taking us off builder's supply) they also charged everyone a connection fee?  I don't understand when I queired with Iberdola they advised it was the connection fee.  So the builder has charged everyone for using his electricity supply.  Is this legal?

Hi Sunlake,

 when we was connected Iberdola charged us 150.25 euros for the connection  fee, but no charge from the builder, I would say that was illegal.

   Pat  

DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW WE STAND AS A TENNANT IN REGARDS TO THE OFFICIAL REGULATIONS IN RESPECT OF

BUILDERS TO SUPPLY ELECTRICITY AND WATER TILL THE ISSUE OF THE COH

THANKS