Smoking in Spanish restaurants

floella

Hi again!

Just found  this link as well which makes an even bigger joke of the whole question...

So the whole thing started with the EU...and finished with them as well it seems.

Hypocrites or Heroes...you decide.

fb

 Thanks i will......i am off to the beach for a ciggy.........

I am absolutely fed up with treading on people´s fag ends on our beaches!! The council tries to clear up but inevitably many are missed.

Let´s be perfectly honest Georgia, you, as I was, are an addict. I too, would give all the arguments for smoking. Let anybody try and dictate to me back then!! Everybody smoked, my parents, my doctor, aunt´s and uncles, all my favourite film stars. You were a bit of a wimp if you didn´t smoke. I was so proud when I could inhale smoke without choking!!

I quit some 23 years ago, by choice, which was prompted by holidaying with non-smoking friends for two weeks but unfortunately was one of the small percentage left with a lung disease that I did not find out about until some time later.

It is a foul habit, I sincerely regret any harm I may have caused others in the past.

I am now squeaky clean and only hope I can experience a long and enjoyable time in this country.

Thanks . Just thought I would highlight this for the people who think we should DO as they SAY..and not as they DO

Petrsonally  find cigarette butts is  the least of my worry when I walk on a beach because they don't stick  between the toes like lots of other yukky  disgusting stuff. Outlaw chewing gum comes to mind  !!

Wish I wasn't but am a smoker. However like many other 3nd class people I know I am VERY considerate in restaurants, other peoples houses  and even in my own when I have non smoking visitors.  Was brought up NEVER to drop litter so end up with pockets full of crumbled tobacco !!

One reason I moved to Spain was because I could smoke outside "in comfort". even though smoking will NEVER make my house or myself  as dirty as the pollutant from cars.

When the squeaky clean person on any web site can prove they do not have a habit or hobby that others might  find disgusting,  injurous to the health of others, costs townhalls thousands to clean up after or the health service millions to repair then I will bow to their wishes.

Have a nice day everyone

pilgrim

well done for being honest. The denial from smokers about just how bad smoking is, by encouraging it , ie having dedicated smoking bars and clubs, beggars belief.  I do have sympathy. If you so addicted that you would defend something that you know is destroying your health, and others making their similar 'choice' then perhaps it really shows how hooked you are?

The other attitude that banning smoking is anything to do with a 'nanny' state or if you want it banned you must be the sort who  ''doesn't t take risks'', also shows how the addiction = denial thing works.  Myself and other friends have always been in to, scuba diving, marathon running, parachuting, mountain climbing, getting drunk now and again etc.  Yes, these are calculated risks that we choose. and not everybody's cup of tea, but they mean keeping fit, eating a reasonable diet and looking after your body. In other words we can live to the full, because we don't smoke. I have teenage kids, and wan't their  'choice' to be leading a full life with full knowledge of just how damaging fags can be. I'm not against risk, far from it, i'm against anyone slowly deatroying their health and those they come in to contact with or influence to become a fellow addict.

I can hear smokers saying 'how hypocritical'  it's alright for him to take risks, but because he doesn't like smoking he wants to spoil our enjoyment and tell us what we should do.  I would agree with you if lung disease/cancer reality wasn't so extreme. The irony is that smokers really don't have the 'choice' they value so highly. They have been robbed of that by the addiction!

Excuse me !!!.What proof do you have Goodstich44 smokers cannot also enjoy , and in fact DO, these pursuits?

As for "getting drunk now and again" well that's not a risk but crass stupidity because drunks are no longer in control of their mental state  and  reading your posts that is something I wouldn't have thought you ever to be.

 I think this debate is straying from the point that certainly i was making.

Firstly,i don't smoke on the beach,that was a joke aimed at goodstich when he told me to "stick my head in the sand and continue smoking" i thought the best place to do this was a place full of sand, hence the joke.

Secondly i understand that smoking may kill me and i agree it is a dirty habit but as long as i don't infect anyone else,which i don't ,it is my decision.

What i can't understand is that people think it "Beggars beleif" that we have bars that people can smoke in and if we dio then any self repecting minor that may stumble past this den of eniquity may turn to the darkside.

The point i was making a long way back on this thread was;...we have b ars in Spain that you can smoke in, we also have bars in Spain that we cannot smoke in, therein lies the choice,whether you are a smoker or not then you still get a choice,smokers do not stand outside the doors luring children in with promise of some puppyt dogs or sweeties.

How many times have you heard a smoker trying to convert anon smoker???? and suggesting its good for you?????

I drive past two brothels with my children every time i go to the airport, i have never heard them scream "Daddy Daddy please let us go in....."

IGoodstich-

Jumping out of planes eh,that may damage your health seriously,i would hope my children do not hear about this as i would not want them to be influenced by your addiction to danger.

to summarise....Yes smoking is bad but if anyone chooses to do this without affecting anyone else then we should be allowed.......not be controlled or dictated to....

Choice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Completely agree Georgia... people who fought and died for Freedom of Choice must turn in their graves .

floella wrote

''As for "getting drunk now and again" well that's not a risk but crass stupidity because drunks are no longer in control of their mental state  and  reading your posts that is something I wouldn't have thought you ever to be.''

floella

It's a shame you feel the need to throw that cheap insult  at me. Surely you don't need to reduce this interesting debate to a slanging match?

Do you really consider that having a few drinks to many drinks now and again, is crass stupidity, or anything remotely as dangerous as the potential risk of smoking?, Likewise parachuting and most other sports.  Yes, there are smokers who take part in all sports, but the huge and long term risks are still there. We all know it ruins health, as does regular heavy drinking. Moderate drinkers are nothing like as likely to develop serious heath issues to themselves or others.

If you are an addict, what 'choice' do you have?  Are addicts by nature not slaves to the addiction until that addiction is broken?

Of course we should have 'choice'  IF that choice doesn't influence or effect anyone else.  I would think those who have died from smoking related disease would indeed 'turn in their graves' at the thought of choice meaning that smoking is the choice to make?

georgia wrote

'What i can't understand is that people think it "Beggars beleif" that we have bars that people can smoke in and if we dio then any self repecting minor that may stumble past this den of eniquity may turn to the darkside.

georgia

as you admit, it is a dirty habit. It is also an expensive life threatening, health destroying addiction. If we at least agree on that, do we wan't to encourage it, or try to persuade people not to make the 'choice'  to start?  Places like clubs and bars attract those who want to have fun, want to enjoy life, have a good time etc. If fags are are as good as handed out on a plate and seen as acceptable as part of 'the good night out in a cool place' '  then the vulnerable and the young, who are mostly by nature rebellious are bound to be far more tempted than if the fags simply were not there, in the same way as any drugs not being encouraged. 

It's our choice, do we encourage addiction, or try and make it a dirty word as we are trying to do in the uk?

It was not a cheap insult  but an honest reply that getting drunk was a calculated risk.  I was not imposing my will, just explaining,  and continuing the debate.

My being near a person who is even mildy intoxicated is as an abhorant experience for me as it is for you being near a smoker . Am I insulted in your preaching about it to us, no.  Plus the latter can sometimes be a threat because, unlike cigarettes, drinking changes ones personality...even moderate drinking. Whatever that maybe !!

Addiction comes in many guises .Something however only we smokers admit to having.

Off to my other addiction now ...shopping.

byeeeeeeeeeeee

Floella said 'unlike cigarettes, drinking changes ones personality'. Whilst I have to agree that drinking changes personalities I say that smokers personalities change if they cannot get their next fix fast enough.

We have various friends in Spain who smoke & Georgia is a friend who smokes  but I don't include him in this post as I don't need the hassle it may cause (OK with you, Georgia )

We've found that often, whenever we go out, the smokers in our company are not often concentrating on the chat & are rather twitchy for want of a better adjective, wondering how they can manage to have a smoke. My husband was the same before he gave up over 5 yrs ago. I got to know him SO well & often said 'just GO, have your smoke' .... he loved a Hamlet cigar actually, having given cigarettes up years ago.

Thankfully most of our friends who smoke are courteous & will wait till the end of our meal before leaving a non smoking restaurant to have a cigarette. (We then have to spend ten minutes so they can catch up on the chatter).They are courteous enough not to put us in the position of telling them we won't permit smoking in our homes, although we used to have one set of friends who both lit up without asking if we minded in our home & then, when we asked them not to smoke, told us to open a window ! Needless to say we aren't seeing them these days. That was an insult.

Karensun & her OH have been to our home in Spain &, as she said, she is courteous. Even when out for a coffee with her & sat outside I've heard her say something like ' I hope no one minds but I'm going to have a smoke'. Just to say I haven't a megga issue with people smoking unless it affects me & I progressed from giving Karen an empty cola can to put the ash & buts in to buying an ashtray which lives outside on the terrace ready for the next smoker, maybe Georgia, to use it. I do accept people enjoy their smokes.

Regarding me not going into a smoking restaurant or bar of COURSE I don't go but I have been caught out especially when our nearest Spanish restaurant, Manolo's which Georgia & others will know of on the CV895, which we walk to that had changed from smoking to non smoking then back to smoking & we'd started eating before realising just after they had changed to smoking. Manolo's do have massive extractor fans, it wasn't obvious. Won't make that mistake again.

morerosado

yes, some of my best friends smoke, and i could preach 'till i'm blue in the face and it wouldn't change anything.

I just couldn't back anything to encourage it, and i will always back any action to reduce the suffering it causes, just as much as i would encourage anything that backs good health. If everyone did that it would save a huge amount of suffering and wasted life.

I realise that's just my personal feeling.

An interesting debate which will never end and from somebody who witnessed his father die aged 52 from lung cancer, and he smoked from 16 when he joined the navy, and my mum died 28 years later from smoking related disease but has never touched a cigarette I think I can see both sides and to me I say its up to the person to do what they want...i will take action for me dependant upon what they do ie move away if they are near me.

However Goodstich44 said

'Do you really consider that having a few drinks to many drinks now and again, is crass stupidity, or anything remotely as dangerous as the potential risk of smoking?,

I think you might reflect upon this statement as I have never known or heard of  a driver under the influence of smoke killing anybody on the road

I think you might reflect upon this statement as I have never known or heard of  a driver under the influence of smoke killing anybody on the road

I have! Depends what they were/are smoking, of course?????

yes of course ..silly me  ..thought we were talking about tobacco not class A to C drugs!!!!

pilgrim

yes indeed.  Weed smokers I know are also cigarette smokers.  

JC1

well you could turn that around and say ' i never saw a drunk give anyone lung cancer?

As you know more than most from very personal experience, the pain and misery caused by fags, it's interesting to hear your view. Both your parents lives were cut short, and worse still your mum's  from 2nd hand smoke. As you say, drink/driving is another killer, and one which i'm sure no one here would condone?

The difference as i see it,  is that drink in moderation is harmless to you and those around you. A glass of wine with a meal, a Sherry at xmas, a glass of champegne to celebrate etc has no comparison to the effect of fags. In fact there is evidence to say beer or wine in moderation may even be a health benifit?

The whole argument on here seems to revolve around choice. I have no problem with that, but since we are all very aware of the very real misery fags can cause, surely we would do what we can do reduce suffering as we have done by making  drink/driving unacceptable. There is no excuse for it, but fags, a similar huge killer (if somewhat slower), we can find plenty of excuses for not banning, because we call that addictive killer  'choice'.

I think the UK has got it about right on fags. The choice to smoke is still there, but the dangers are also well documented. I guess education is all you can do in the end, then as a democracy it's only right for individuals and society to decide.

I stopped smoking a couple of years ago and am totally on the side of the smokers here.  It was MY choice to quit. Not some overbearing power mad person telling me to quit.

Freedom of choice is everything.

Something that we sadly lost in the UK on so many fronts.  One child gets hurt by a toy and the whole lot are banned?

I love the fact that the Spanish can choose whether or not to allow smoking and believe that the same should have happened in the UK.

I use restaurants that are smoking as well as non smoking.... like someone said way back...  I have probably done the damage anyway having smoked from the age of 14.

Laury

Oh... and a footnote...

Smoking AND drinking kills.

My stepmother has just died in a house fire at the age of 80. She fell asleep after imbibing a few tots of whisky and her cigarette fell and started the fire.

Laury

LauryC, so sad to hear about your Mum, hope you're getting over it (bit silly to say that, you never will, I know).

I wasn't going to jump back in on this debate as I've seen the animosity it causes on other sites BUT before everyone jumps in and says how dangerous smoking is and causes house fires, chip pans and grill pans cause more fires in UK than anything so please don't say you want us to ban chip pans as well.

Electrical faults are next on the list and one was caused by a cat being sick over a TV and shorting it out.  No, I don't advocate banning all TV sets or, indeed, cats.  I am just pleased that  I have the choice in Spain to enter a pub and smoke if I want to, just as non-smokers have the right to enter a non-smoking pub or restaurant.  I still avoid restaurants where smokers are mixed in with non-smokers.  By all means, have a nice meal but please go somewhere else to have your fag, well away from those who are still eating.  It's all well and good to say you only light up AFTER your meal but if had a euro for the  number of times people at other tables have lit up whilst I am still eating, well......I'd have about 10 euros, I suppose.

And jumping in the old car to get down to the supermarket for the shopping......Good God, people, are you trying to kill us all?  A 7 mile trip in a petrol car (5 miles in a diesel car) puts more grunge into the atmosphere than a 20 a day smoker will do in a lifetime!  Does this mean we should all stop driving?  Oh, and that horrid stuff the car pumps into the atmosphere does affect me, as well.