Waiting for a sentance from the court

No I mean it appears you have not been provided with a legal Bank Guarantee (through no fault of your own I might add). Much depends on your own specific circumstance whether you can regain your monies, so the best advice is to seek good independent legal advice. But please be aware that many consider any legal route as a lottery these days, given the major delays within the justice administration system that appears to compromise the innocent purchaser at every stage of the legal process. There are also some who query the consistency of judgements from the judiciary and their political impartiality. Only you can decide if you are prepared to take that risk and incur further financial outlay in the process.

Having said all of that Keith is doing a great deal behind the scenes to effect accountability from the Banks, but it is early days on that score, so in the interim it's essential that all those caught up in this scenario provide him with their evidence. He is not just fighting for his own group action against a specific Bank, but for all those who have been denied their legal rights according to the laws that were established to protect offplan purchasers. Acquiring the evidence is crucial to the campaign to making the Banks accountable and to gain reform of the Spanish Justice system that at present does not appear to provide adequate consumer protection.

I agree with your earlier statement that everyone in Europe should sign Keith's petition if we are to make those responsible for these abuses truly accountable. It's essential that not only those stuck within the Spanish legal system should support this petition with their evidence, but that all those who recognise the abuse as Keith has painstakingly identified in his petition and questionnaire, should also demonstrate their support just by signing the petition. www.bankguaranteesinspain.com

I personally think it's the least we can do given his genuine commitment to this cause.

 Rambi: you fall into the category of lack of Bank Guarantee

Thanks to you both, ads and Maria,

I reather tend towards Keith Rule's belief that the receiving bank of the deposits is responsible for ensuring that the bank guarantees are issued, are legal and are sent to the client immediately the funds were received. This in my case has not been done.

Thanks for the advice.

 Please sign the petition.  We need the strength of numbers, it costs nothing and will only work with your support. By acting together the hard work of Keith Rule will not be wasted.

I must say this is a very comforting thread and also a very big pat on the back for Keith - well done!

After reading this thread i got thinking about my own situation and, although i seem to be getting some success through the courts system (an embargo granted on developer's assets), i thought it would do no harm to explore other avenues for claiming deposits back.

So, when posters talk about deposits are they talking just about deposits or deposits and stage payments?

Also, in my situation, i'm pretty sure that i paid my deposit and stage payments direct to the developer (Aifos, yeah i know :-( ), would this rule me out of attempting to gain recompense from the banks (as others have done so on here)?

Thanks,

Paul

Hi Paul,

I'm not the one to answer your question.

But my feeling is that chasing the developer is a waste of time. He will dispose of his assets and there will be little left to pay anyone. After all, you will come down to the bottom of the list, after the court, the lawyers,the banks, the employees, the sub-contractors, the suppliers, etc.

I could be wrong but my feeling is to follow the money. The banks.

Sorry to 'Pee on your Bonfire' but this is what Keith has been saying all along

"Also, in my situation, I'm pretty sure that i paid my deposit and stage payments direct to the developer (Aifos, yeah i know :-( ), would this rule me out of attempting to gain recompense from the banks (as others have done so on here)? "

As far as I understand this, any Bank that knowingly took monies relating to offplan deposits falls under the remit of Ley 57/68 law, so the developer's Bank should be accountable in this case (or any Bank that ultimately took your deposit and stage payments). Is that correct Maria?

Rambi - Thanks for your support for the Bank Guarantees Petition.

Paul - yes deposit and stage payments.  You say you paid direct to the developer Aifos.  Did you pay by Bank Transfer direct to the developers Bank Account?  If you have Bank Transfer receipts showing the payments clearly referenced as deposits for a property/plot then you may have a case against the bank who accepted those deposits.

Each case needs to be reviewed and there is certain other information/evidence that can strengthen a case.

But the starting point is to have evidence that the Bank (normally the one funding the project/developer)  actually received the deposit/stage payment funds either directly from the purchaser or via a third party such as an agent or Lawyer.

Kind regards

Keith

Hi Keith,

I cant remember exactly how i paid the deposits, to whom and with what reference. However, i used HIFX and they are sending me statements of all the transactions that i have made through them, so hopefully they will show beneficiary account details and maybe payment references. Either way, i paid through HIFX or my spanish bank account, so should be able to trace the details, i hope.

Thanks again for all your help and good luck with the petition (i filled it in, btw),

Paul

Thanks for your support Paul.

We need as many people as possible, affected by Bank Guarantee abuse, to join the petition.

Kind regards

Keith

Hi Keith,

Have you read the article in the Daily Mail dated 29/11, regarding a British family being pursued by a Spanish Bank for negative equity ,which may result in them loosing their home in the U.K.

It makes me wonder about European Laws, when over the many years that I have been trying to recoup my life savings from Aifos I have always been told that my circumstances are not covered by EU Law and therefor they cannot get involved. During this time I have corresponded with many M.P.s and M.E.P.s and my latest reply from a Mr. John Dalli, a member of the European Commission stated that he regrets to inform me that the issues related to property sales fall outside the scope of EU legislation and thus outside the scope of any EU organisation or network. In the absence of Community competence these cases are regulated and enforced at national level. He then advices me to refer my case to the Instituto Nacional del Consumo in Madrid, (this is the Spanish equivilant of the UK Trading Standards)

I am aware that the law works in mysterious ways but being a layman it appears to me that there is one law for the Banks and another for us.

Please keep up the good work, it is much appreciated.

Kind regards

Hi belucky358

Yes I have read the article.  It is a complex issue and we do not really know the full facts of the case.

What is concerning is that the Spanish Bank seems to be using the EEO to 'fast track' the claim against the UK property.  Also the article says that certain procedures regarding the EEO appear to have been overloooked.

You are certainly correct when you say that there is one set of rules for the Banks and another set of rules for the consumer.

For years the Spanish Banks have blatantly disregarded the requirements of LEY 57/68 with regards to Bank Guarantees and the protection of off-plan deposits.  The Banco de Espana - the Supervisor of the Spanish Banking System - has, by their own admission, been aware of the lack of professional due diligence and negligence carried out by the Banks & Savings Banks whom they supposedly 'Supervise', but has done very little about it.

However, when I, as consumer and a victim of a Banks negligence (CAM Bank), make a complaint to the Banco de Espana they force me to follow a very strict complaints procedure, which just delays the process.

The whole system regarding complaints to the Banks & the Banco de Espana etc is very much in favour of and for the protection of the Banks and totally against the consumer.

As a victim of CAM Banks negligence there is no opportunity for me to 'Fast Track' a complaint, let alone 'Fast Track' a legal procedure against them!  So yes, there is one rule for the Banks and another for the Consumer.

I am sure they hope that by putting so many obstacles in the consumers path, most people will just walk away and lose their off-plan deposit.

But......all victims of Bank Guarantee abuse should never give up the fight.  LEY 57/68 grants us 'Inalienable Rights' (caracter de irrenuciables) for the protection of our off-plan deposits.  The Banks, Savings Banks, Banco de Espana and the Spanish Government must be made aware that we will fight until those rights granted to us by their own Spanish Laws are upheld in full.

Kind regards

Keith

We all know the answer Keith, It's not what you know in this world It's WHO you know. I will fight this injustice for as long as I draw breath. There must be a way of breaking the banks defensive wall, brick by brick if needs be.