What is happening with AIFOS ? ?

Hi,

We are some of the unfortunate ex-clients of AIFOS, and we were wondering if anyone can explain how does it come that........

1)  We "won" our court case, but....... did not receive a penny.

2)  We already had an "embargo" in place to recover owed money, but due to Aifos going bust, it was cancelled.

3)  AIFOS goes bust and we are adviced to join the "Creditors List",  which we are patiently awaiting for the outcome.

As far as we believed AIFOS was finished ? ?

You can imagine our surprise to find that AIFOS had stand number SP13 at the "Place in the Sun Live" at  London, on the 11th 12th and 13th of March 2011.

Are they allowed to carry on trading ? ?

 If they are still trading, then does your embargo not stand on any monies/assets still owned or generated by the company? Why has it been cancelled if there were still assets (liquid or otherwise,available to be sold)? A lawyer needs to explain this process to you in detail.

On the other hand might this be the Banks/administrators selling on properties (assets), under the existing name of AIFOS?

Is this how the administrators recoup monies to be ultimately paid to creditors?

The question still remains however, why your legal embargo was cancelled if assets were still available. Perhaps your embargo allows you to be classed as a preferential creditor once the company goes into administration (but still lower preference than the Banks?) Again a question for the lawyers.

Presumably Banks take preference in any monies recouped and thereafter other creditors receive a proprotion of the remainder (if there is any remainder!)

As an alternative, If legitimate cases were brought against the Banks (where appropriate proof has been established as per Keith's petition text ), then is this not a last option legal route to recoup monies from the Banks that appear to be taking preference?

To comprehend the processes, everyone would benefit from a simple clarification of the procedures involved in this case where a company (AIFOS) are supposed to have  gone into administration and whether the administrators have the right to continue marketing under the original company name of AIFOS? Also an explanation is required as to why an existing legal embargo is cancelled at the point of administration if there are still assets available to be sold.

Perhaps Maria or another law firm can clarify this for you?

Hi ads,

I have mailed our Lawyer for further infomation on this matter.

Regarding the "embargo" we were told in July 2009, when Aifos began the Administration Procedure,....." that we would NOT be able to execute the frozen assets, having to wait for the Creditor's General Meeting decision".

With regard to being a "preferential Creditor", we have been told that there are four types of Creditors.....

1) Privileged Creditors (Secured Creditors)  ie.   Banks, Social Security and employees wages.

2) Ordinary creditors  (purchasers who litigated and have obtained a final ruling on their case)

3) Subordinate creditors.

4) Contingent Creditors. 

Cheers

 Thanks belucky

By final ruling, does this mean a judicial resolution has to be in place following any developer appeal? In other words clients with outstanding cases awaiting a judicial resolution following developer appeal will not be classed as privileged creditors? There is some confusion about this depending on who you talk to.

Hi ads,

When we "won" our case in Jan.2009, AIFOS's Lawyer did accept that they owed us the money and they agreed in writing before the Judge, who made the Judicial Notice, to pay us within two months, but this was all lies, although we were told that there would not be any appeals.

As I understand it we are classed as "Ordinary Creditors"  and not Privileged Creditors.

Hope this helps......Cheers

belucky/ads

we are also classed as 'Ordinary Creditors', so behind all the privileged creditors.  I'm waiting for clarification of our situation from our lawyer but fear we will once again be the victims of the lies and deception and lack of regulation that is the Spanish justice system.

Good morning to you all,

What a minefield of legal wrangleing for consumer rights and protection for the return of hard earned cash deposited with these despicable promotors and their henchmen.

They have no shame when it comes down to giving up the millions of euros they have squirreled away for their forced retirement after conning their victims with the corrupt practices that they have employed to convince purchasers that their money is safe buying their products.

They are good at it they even convince and hoodwink the judges and the courts that they are innocent and somehow continue trading and keeping their ill-gotten gains by pleading poverty and that they are also protecting the company and their faithful employees.

It appears they cannot give up the good life and are promoting the leftovers of their "Place in the Sun" portfolio to the next generation of victims taken in by the glossy brochures and videos of the good life.

Yes! Just watch all those scenes of glorious beaches, golf courses, horse riding, fantastic hillside villas overlooking the sea and mouth watering gastronomic restaurants. The narration promises of how safe your money and investment is in their hands.

I wonder if a television company could make a programme titled "Cowboy Promotors in Spain?"

I have not copy and pasted the information in this link. Just have a long read and read it again. The opinion given here may raise some hopes for victims of these warranty abusive clauses in some contracts.

The only downside to this information is that you must ask your lawyer if it is correct or not!

http://www.white-baos.com/articulos.php?lang=en&a=32

If the link does not connect copy and paste it into your browser.

Good luck

We paid letras on 2 apartments of Aifos in Mijas.  When we asked our original solicitor in Fuengirola, Antonio Lopez Alvarez, about bank guarantees he shrugged it off and said Aifos did not provide guarantees and that they were such a big company that in the unlikely event of them going bankrupt, their land and other assets would be enough to cover the return of the money we paid.  Well hindsight is a great thing and we were very naive and we believed him.  It is obvious now that the solicitor was in cohoots with the estate agent and possibly Aifos as well.

Since then we have changed solicitors and are now represented by Maria.  We have won our case against Aifos but have to wait in line with the other creditors.  So Maria and her team are now bringing a case against the bank.  She said that even though we didn't get a bank guarantee the law still applies.  However, the bank will obviously strongly contest the case because if they lost it would open the floodgates.  But it does at least bring some hope that we may eventually be refunded.

As regards the previous comments about Aifos still trading - it is the same in England as in Spain.  If a company goes bankrupt, that's it, they're gone and creditors only get what the liquidators realise from the remaining assets.  But if they're in administration, the purpose of that is for the administrators to try and run the company to see if they can pay back creditors from trading profits.  That's the theory anyway!

Does anyone know if there has even been a Creditors meeting for Aifos ? 

We have received no update at all from our Lawyers on this and iit is my belief  they

have simply given up. I cannot say I am surprised that Aifos had a stall  and I sincerely hope no one else

is as stupid as we were by giving them  a single penny. At least now you only have to stick the word

Aifos in google and there is enough links given to make a judgement on what sort of people you are dealing with.

Aifos Arquitectura y Promociones Inmobiliarias SA is under creditor´s meeting situation since 23rd of July 2009

Hi Maria,

We are in exactly the same predicament as johnmfranci5 and we are aware that AIFOS has been in this position since 23rd July 2009,......... but what we want to know is.....

 What happens next ?

Is it usual to take this length of time, it's nearly TWO years ?

Are the people in charge of this procedure supposed to give periodic progress reports ?

Cheers

 Belucky358:

Did you have a Bank Guarantee? If you did not, which I guess, I recommend you to use action 1.2 against the Bank which received your deposits. This is a more effective and proper action in your case.

Best,

Maria

Maria,

Are there no legal time constraints in place for these procedures, or are the administrators given an indefinite time to resolve this situation?

Perhaps you are saying that these creditor meetings are ultimately a foregone conclusion anyway, as purchasers have very low preference and are therefore very unlikely to achieve return of their monies via this route?

How are those who had embargoes or preliminary enforcements in place prior to the developer going into administration classified? Presumably they too are sufficiently low preference to be ultimately compromised by this procedure?

Don't purchasers who have no BG's have to first identify if they have the required bank documentation to hand before they commit to this Bank claim route? Perhaps It would be very useful for them to have a standard checklist against which they can understand the Bank claim route and thereby decide if this is a viable legal solution for them, before commiting to this alternative claim process.

For instance, for those who struggle to find the information about where their monies were deposited, or are denied this information from their law firm, wouldn't it make sense for them to proceed straight to a negligence case against their conveyancing lawyer's insurance? Or perhaps that is too simplistic?

Hi Maria,

You are correct we do NOT have a Bank Guarantee.

Are you recommending that we should abandon the AIFOS Creditors List ?

What information do you have to convince us to change over to action 1.2 ?

Are you saying that the AIFOS Creditors List is a waste of time, since nothing has come out of it for nearly TWO years ?

Cheers

Hi Maria,

You are correct we do NOT have a Bank Guarantee.

Are you recommending that we should abandon the AIFOS Creditors List ?

What information do you have to convince us to change over to action 1.2 ?

Are you saying that the AIFOS Creditors List is a waste of time, since nothing has come out of it for nearly TWO years ?

Cheers

Maria

I would also like to know the answer?. I am in pretty much the same position as belucky. If we were to try and get our money back through the bank route with no BG, while at the same time being Aifos creditors, how will the courts see this?  Could the two actions run at the same time and both be successful?, and how can we be confident that the bank route will be any trustworthy than our current action?.

 Even if we win our case against the bank, does that guarantee we will get our money back in to our own accounts?, or does it mean years more waiting while the banks find a way of not paying their debts, much like Aifos and Spanish government have done?.

 Hello Beluck358:

I do not recommend to leave the presence in the creditor´s meeting but  honestly, there is no much to be obtained from there. Credits are classified very unadvantageously and the results very poor.

Taking into account that the legal order has provided for this off plan buyers to be safeguarded ( which are very forcely considered creditors in the classical sense of the concept), through clear systems of Money Guaranteeing... why should then hold the burden of going througn the nightmare of the creditor´s meeting.

It is not fair. And actually Law has provided for better solutions and guarantees for these people.

Law 57/68 sets a guarantee mechanism for people who risked big amounts of money against a plan. And made financial institutions risponsable ( provision 1.2 of Law 57/68) on verifying on the existence of the Guarantees.

Defense for people like you need ot be performes, as a matter of justice, within the ambitum of the legally reuired protection and protectors.

Creditor´s meeting does not protect  you at all!!

Maria

Maria

If we try and get our money back through the banks, how do we know that  the bank wont just try and say it's Aifos's fault that we don't have a guarantee?, or that it's the lawyer fault at the time of signing the contract for not making sure the guarantee was written in to the contract?  Can we be confident that the banks will have to accept responsability for us not having a BG and give us back our deposit?.

When we won case in court, we were able to show that our money had gone in to Aifos's bank account, so does that make our case strong?. If I felt confident of winning our case against the bank, then of course we would consider taking action, but how can we know if it's worthwhile?. The UK agent (OVP), the UK lawyer at time of signing our contract (UK Conveyancing)  and of course our developer (Aifos) have all gone under, so if the bank wont pay up because they dont consider they are at fault we have no other company still in business to claim from.

Has anyone actually got their money back from a bank yet, when they didn't have a BG?. 

Goodstitch well put.

This is precisely why we are now waiting to see what happens with BG (or none) cases having already wasted many 

pointless thousands of euros on a Lawyer to pursue this who now appears to be no longer interested.

After all if if Aifos can get away with endlessly ignoring court judgemetns then why not the Banks ?

Unless strong action is taken againt Spain by the EEC or UK government I cannot see any oif us ever getting anwhere with this.

I would even favour the UK breaking off all diplomatic relations with Spain over this issue given that many hundreds of UK ciitizens have been systematically cheated and robbed by the Spanish System. Given that Spain contributes nothing to the EEC never has and never will I cannot see why the UK just witholds its EEC contribution as a protest until we are all refunded. Somehow I cannot see our own greedy corrupt politicans ever agreeing to that.

Sadly our policitans are completly gutless and aewfar more interested in pursuing pointless wars in other countires than looking after the interests of their own citizens.

I wish Maria well with pursuing the Banks and I may one day try this route should many others get some success.

Is there a timelimit to this action?

Have you written to MEP Marta Andreasen about this? (She is collecting evidence).

Have you provided evidence to Keith and Suzanne's petitions?

Have you checked if you have the necessary evidence to follow the Bank claim route?

Is a legal professional willing to follow a negligence claim on your behalf against the conveyancing law firm (if still in business) if the bank evidence is not available?

Are the Spanish government going to address the problem of abusive MAJOR delays in the legal system to ensure this action is ultimately worthwhile?

Will the Spanish Government adopt protectionist measures that may inhibit successful claims against their Banks (not remain independent from the judicial process).

These are just some of the vulnerabilities that sadly remain.