Tv programmes re buying in Spain

Have just watched " Place in the Sun  " as recorded Sep 2014 and was horrified to see a prospective buyer was shown property at Mazarron CC and Camposol when , barely 2 months later, on Nov 25th and Nov 13th 2014 respectively both communities had meetings to discuss their many "still" ongoing problems including non issue of Habitacion certificates and water bills.

Have always wondered why so few people bought and now I know it is because the programme is trying to get people to buy without bothering to check legality. We all are aware not to buy from a " man in a bar" scenario but one would assume that, if not the sellers or REA's,  the media would act ethically and act within the law.

Apparently not.........

Well it's nothing new though is it, seems like everyone wants to sell you a property which has one thing or another wrong with it so why not a network television show.

I do often wonder when watching shows like that if they realise the reality of what it is they are looking at.

That said there has to be something in it for all these people to come over for a week and find their ideal, perfectly legal property. I envy that as we have been looking for nearly a year and still no go.

Human nature takes on a lot of guise's, suppose you had a house for sale, which had been on the market for ages, as I am sure many have, and it was, say, missing some of the co called supposedly needed documents, you get a buyer, they want the house, pay the price, they don't ask, or make any mention of these said items, solicitor says nothing about them....Would you take the risk of losing the sale by telling the buyers this?

Place in the Sun is a TV show, no more no less, it has no obligation to tell any one of any legal problems, this show costs pennies to make as apposed to many thousands for a TV drama, and the Place in the Sun know full well that most people go on the show for what seems to be a weeks free holiday with no intention of ever buying.

I know a well known TV presenter who does a "Builders men from Hell" and "Exposes Crooks" types of show, shake his hand and you would be well advised to count your fingers, another "Car Dealer" TV personality tells the TV world about buying cars, seems to forget he was a pinch away from going inside (2 years) for clocking speedo's.

Just because these property programmes come under the loose heading of entertainment I disagree that they don't have a moral obligation to the prospective buyers , irrespective if they signed up only for a free holiday, or viewers. Is it any wonder people are wary of buying in foreign countries when it seems conning others is par for the course. 

Baz1946, Spanish law states only properties with all paperwork can be offered for sale. If a seller is missing any documentation house can't legally be sold...as far as I am concerned that's end of.

Starfox, don't give up, there are many more legal well built properties than illegal  ones. Problem is the owners of the former are not desperate to sell at give away prices.

Correction, nowhere in  Spanish law does it state only properties, with all paperwork, can be offered for sale. If a seller is missing any documentation house can't legally be sold

The thorny topic of the COH problem has been there for many years, I have articles going back years saying do not complete without one, but many people did after paying money and completed so that they did not loose their money

The situation lawyers us that they work on the basis of disclosure, if you don't ask the question then they don't have to tell you and still buyers simply use a lawyer that is recomended by the agent

Yes The Notary has an obligation to check the deeds and debts on the property but not the existance of a COH

Don't forget that these programs typically work wth a local agent and yes I agree TOTALLY that they have an obligation to protect the interests of the buyers, they are supposed to be experts after all

Floella

How can the TV show have a moral obligation, the TV show is only showing people these house's, and the area's they are in, they are not estate agents? Imagine the minefield of legalities if this show were to get into the legal side of Spains house sales, also if they told every one of the problems you could have in buying in Spain, would they have a show. Its up to the buyers to do all the correct and proper searches if and when they buy, which as I did say hardly any do. 

Estate agent's cant offer for sale a house without the legal paper work in place, so it has been said on here a thousand times, but we all know they do.

Also if its illegal to sell a house with missing paperwork, and by what is told of on here that thousands have no correct paperwork in place, yet are being sold over and over again. Honestly now with the amount of houses in Spain for sale if everyone waited for the correct paperwork what would be sold?

I do understand where you are coming from but the real world is the one that everyone has to put up with.

Floella-what horrified me about last nights programme was that both the buyer and the presenter seemed to be sneering at Camposol

Why was there no mention of the many amenities that Camposol has and MCC has none of them.

Where do the residents of MCC flock to when they want to get money out, go for a meal, take their pet to the vet,buy groceries, join a social club, buy household goods, etc? Why, Good old Camposol of course! Their so smart urbanisation has nothing, plus the fact was never mentioned that on top of IBI, there are community fees to pay, unlike on Camposol.

so the prospective buyer had once visited Camposol, and was so horrified that there was an unfinished road, that she never got over it and cannot wipe this horrendous memory from her mind.boo Hoo!

That woman wouldn't like anything. She made an insulting offer- I'm glad it was refused.

No C of H - I care not one jot. Eventually all will have them.no problems at all with selling/ buying properties here!

Water bills? Back payments sorted now.

You don't know much about Camposol.

It seems as if You 've been watching Homes from Hell and it has warped your judgement !

"there are many more legal well built properties than illegal  ones. Problem is the owners of the former are not desperate to sell at give away prices."

Very good point. The sooner potential buyers (and estate agents) accept this, and the fact that the so-caled "bargains" out there maybe aren't such bargains after all, the sooner the market might return to some semblance of normality. Meanwhile, if you want to throw your hard-earned away on a pile of cr4p, just walk into any bank and tell the first employee you see that you want to buy a bargain property. They'll be only too happy to do what bankers do best ;-)

If in Spanish law houses without CofH cannot legally be sold then it is obvious that these same houses cannot legally be offered for sale. So just a play on words. If people want to buy ,then so be it, just don't want to read future threads where it's all gone pear shaped.

baz1946, if this show, where the presenter acts as a middleman to broker the deal, has no need to be  morally obligated then I am at a loss for words.....surely I am not alone in thinking that everyone should be morally responsible regardless of who or what they are, but hey ho, I am sure that if I said the queen was a woman you would argue the toss. Lol.

Campo, although I know your urbanisation and , if you recall, have  previously mentioned it wasn't to my liking but agree that what was said about the place should have been cut. Totally unnecessary. 

Dont know MCC but do know that your urbanisation has everything and more for folk to live out their dream of a permanent holiday atmosphere and know folk there for whom it is utopia. Just not for me.

I am just amazed that a program selling dreams and often mentioning the need for caution should itself not feel the need to be morally accountable. Am wondering now if they are themselves getting backhanders from unscrupulous agents as in my area of Murcia there are so many wonderful legal properties for sale who could do with this form of advertising. 

( just in case it crosses anyone's mind...my house isn't on the market)

I am sorry but a property without a COH can LEGALLY be sold, it happnes every day if the week, ths break no law of Spain, if as there is in many parts of Spain, the servyces are connected a buyer wouldnt even know about a COH, it happens every day in Spain

Let the buyer beware

baz1946, if this show, where the presenter acts as a middleman to broker the deal, has no need to be  morally obligated then I am at a loss for words.....surely I am not alone in thinking that everyone should be morally responsible regardless of who or what they are, but hey ho, I am sure that if I said the queen was a woman you would argue the toss. Lol.

Floella.

Where am I arguing the toss with you?

I have seen these shows and fact is most don't buy, just seem to go for a cheap holiday of sorts, one Lady presenter on these shows is Jasmine Harman, now please tell me what makes her an "Expert" on these house sales or legal stuff, she is a presenter, TV and Radio, Journalist, she started her career as a fitness trainer and went on to other things like many do, that don't make her any type of expert in the sales or legal side of Spains houses.

She introduces viewers to house's that she has found via estate agents, believe it or not..To make a TV show... and works for a TV company which owns her contract, the only moral part she has in this show is presenting these house's in the best light for TV viewers to watch, and for someone who tells the TV company they want a home in the sun, after that her job is done. This is absolutely nothing at all to do with being morally responsible, using that word as you use it be very careful you don't tell someone of a, what you perceive is a good restaurant in case they eat in the place and get a food bug...Are you then "Morally" responsible because you recommended the restaurant.

The presenter "Brokers" the house sale by only showing the house not making sure that all the legalities are in place, don't you think that the TV company make sure that the so called buyers sign a disclaimer before any viewing, or impending purchase to avoid any court case's against the TV company should any proposed deal went wrong.

Yes, I know the Queen is a Woman and a very fine one at that,  and I also know that as nice as these TV presenters come over on screen they are still just that..TV presenters,  you probably don't know this but when the show is over they have nothing to do with the so called purchase's again, until maybe a follow up show comes on.

Quote... Provision 19 also establihses that the deed for the end of work will need the verification by the Notary on the existence of the First Occupation License and therefore deeds for the completion of the purchase business and transmission of ownership rights to Consumers cannot be granted without First Occupation License. In short words:  no house can be acquired without that license..unquote

It may happen everyday in Spain but the above is via Maria and according to her one cannot legally buy a property without the certificate. So I am very perplexed to now read that apparently one can.

Dear Baz, please read what I write...I am dissing the show and the moral duty of its property finders who are listed in the credits. Not the presenters who I am now upset to read never gets to go to the house warming party on the rare occasion of a sale !!      Haven't had dreams dashed like this since realising Santa wasn't real...... Lol.   That was very mean of you.

There seems to be more than the usual number of "horrified" folk on this thread, for different reasons.

Floella, first off half of MCC have Habitation certificates, so how do you know that the property shown was without one?  Secondly if you are "horrified" by that you must have closed your eyes to a whole lot worse of bending the rules in Spain that will no doubt continue for many, many years to come.  Whatever we say, it's part of the culture.

Camposol - you say you are "horrified" by the write-up of your name-sale urbanisation.  I agree it was a bit insulting and the fact that the negative comments were repeated many times made it worse.  The programme was very poorly edited.  They must have repeated that the BOF who was making the purchase was getting divorced 20 times, why?  At one point there was a comment that Camposol represents tremendous value for money, but not to everyone's taste, which is fair enough.  But I guess of the two horrified people on this thread I side with you.

If anyone missed it and would like to be horrified or insulted it's on http://www.channel4.com/programmes/a-place-in-the-sun-2015/on-demand/59662-008

Dear Baz, please read what I write...I am dissing the show and the moral duty of its property finders who are listed in the credits. Not the presenters who I am now upset to read never gets to go to the house warming party on the rare occasion of a sale !!      Haven't had dreams dashed like this since realising Santa wasn't real...... Lol.   That was very mean of you.

Well, considering that you wondered why so many people are not buying in Spain due to this type of TV show it's no wonder that you have had your dreams spoilt. And yes you do sign a disclaimer exonerating the show from any, and all comebacks should things go wrong...It's a Puppet.

The TV company makes a very popular TV show and because they don't fully explain the legalities of buying in Spain so to you thats the reason why so many people are not buying in Spain, now who has had dreams shattered then.

Try this on for size then...The UK recession...The UK jobs loss...Spains worse recession...People who moved to Spain and cant get work...The drop of the Euro...The so called problems with Spains tax system...Every turn thousands of negative comments on how Spain works...And on and on...The list is endless if you were to check things out. Not due to the results of a TV show.

Why you cant even see what has been pointed out, and proved, and on many occasions at that, from one poster especially, Camposol, that house's really do sell in Spain with no H/C, to you they don't so thats it then!...The whole Spanish house selling thing doesn't happen... to say the least.

And contrary to popular belief Santa is real, I saw him in Carrefore Christmas time filling up his trolley with Elvis  pushing it, suppose now you will tell me that didn't happen either. 

Can say with utmost honesty Acer that have never witnessed or indulged in any bending of the rules from the moment we decided to purchase here . The way Spain works is well documented and so the people we dealt with were told, before any negotiations began, that unless something is 100% legal with a paper trail of proof we would walk.  Three times we did so , once after being dumped in Bedar !!! after realising the Brit and German REA's we were dealing with preferred to line their own pockets in preference to listening to us.

Its not because we are squeaky clean as, like most, have paid cash for small services rendered, but refuse to line someones pocket with loads of cash just to save them the tax bill that will inevitably, one day, land on our shoulders.

Maybe that actual MCC property was totally legal Acer I was only highlighting  the written minutes of the meetings held by both urbanisations  Nov 2014 whose objectives were to get owners voted onto Mazarron council because of the many problems re legalities on the urbs  regarding water and licenses etc  that need sorting.

Baz, you have been and gorn and dunnit this time.......my dreams are not only totally shattered by what you have written but then you crush me totally by writing Elvis Lives.....

My grandmother is going to give me hell  when I tell her that a forum pal saw Elvis pushing a trolly in a Carrefore at Christmas.......

ps .....any chance you tell me which one it was......please 

Floella, all I was saying was that IMHO your "horror" was a bit OTT.  In Murcia there are thousands of properties w/o Hab Certs, so the authorities cannot enforce the law that is imposed, or semi-imposed, in the other regions.

But it is great that some people are REALLY trying to put matters right rather than just talk about it.  There is a political party recently formed, the CDIP (Camposol & District Independent Party) formed to try and win seats in May 2015 elections with "Hab Certs for all" as one of their key objectives.

But in reality it's likely to be a long term struggle and for the time being it would be wrong to over emphasise the situation, as in practical terms, for the time being at least, it really doesn't matter.

Baz, you have been and gorn and dunnit this time.......my dreams are not only totally shattered by what you have written but then you crush me totally by writing Elvis Lives.....

My grandmother is going to give me hell  when I tell her that a forum pal saw Elvis pushing a trolly in a Carrefore at Christmas.......

ps .....any chance you tell me which one it was......please

The Torrevieja one my dear girl.  one Santa with one Elvis, now your not trying to tell me they were not the real thing but just happy folk dressed up as, are you?.

Anyway not that it matters seeing as to how long it's taken you to be convinced that house's really do sell in Spain with no H/C. 

And spoil others illusions......Baz.......As if I would dare........x

Those programmes should be reported to Trading Standards for telling porkies. They give totally unrealistic rental predictions.