Bad news in Spain!

David, it's good to hear some one sees my thread for what was intended, a light hearted pop at Norman with no malice intended. (the fact that most repilies ignored the opening post says alot)

I also agree that perhaps Justin should look at the justice issue on the site as it does seem to raise its head on numerous posts that are started on totally different subjects. Sooner or later members are going to stop posting, there just will be no point risking another hijack.

I also agree that the seriousness of the issues are being some what diluted and some of the posts are so long and self indulgent they are at best hard to follow, and at worst not worth reading (please don't slag me off, it's just my opinion)

There is also the risk of loosing the support of some of the EOS members who may well sympathise but in truth there are other things going on in Spain. 

So come on Justin, let the rest of us have our say without fear of hijack, and to the hijackers please start and stick to your own posts where those interested can indulge and take part and those less interested can read, take part or ignore.

 On Sky News today and the Hourly loop is a reporter in Madrid due to the public sector workers strike today.

With the incoming Austerity cuts and Spains serious financial problems, we could face another Greece here.

Will this be good or bad for foreign buyers????

Sorry guys if it appears that this is taking over the thread....not my intention at all. I was just responding to other postings and following through with some observations and facts.

I think you misunderstand my request for a separate section as I and others were concerned that many of the threads relating to justice issues were hidden and fragmented under chit chat (some became aware of them accidentally) so we were hoping to bring them together under one section which ironically should appease those of you who perceive our observations as "hijacking".

I'm sure you are aware that many of us are equally frustrated by the growing justice issues that we need to bring to others attention and that our aims are not to aggrevate but to be inclusive as we all struggle to rally support and work out effective ways of finding solutions to some terrible injustices occuring in Spain right now.

Anyway I trust that you understand my intentions are honourable and that one means of solving this problem might be to potentially draw the various justice issues together - to gain an effective lobby group and keep everyone informed of progress where applicable and likewise to highlight new issues that require attention.

I hope this is not perceived as self indulgent.

Oh my! I always miss the controversies.

Right - onto far more important matters. I am wearing a pair of shocking pink 3/4 length jogging bottoms. But do they make my bum look big?

LOL - it's ok... the old man has just said yes... so I have some business to attend to which involves my stiletto and the space between his eyebrows! I'll leave you all to it.

Elle xx

Oh Elle ... how dare he?? lol

Not so sure its bad news for Spain when one of your stiletos end up embeded into your OH's head, but it sure is bad news for him lol!!!

I don't know if you've moved on from the original theme of the thread, but I would just like to add my support to those who are tired of the good news threads being hijacked by the 'justice' lobby. Yes we have every sympathy, and would support you where possible, but if every time someone starts a thread on something positive, you jump in and ruin it, we will start to get sick of it quite frankly.

There are plenty of ways to get your point over without preventing anyone else from enjoying and sharing their positive experiences. How would you feel if people incessantly hijacked the proper 'justice' threads etc, with outlanding stories of happiness in Spain. Respect the threads which people post in good faith, and everyone might get along better.

For the record, we bought an old Spanish house on a square in a mountain village and evreything is fine. We have amazing views, cheap food and drink, friendly locals, spanish culture, and we're only 15 mins from the beaches.

Well said otivar2010

So now this thread is being hijacked by those who think the good news threads are being hijacked........ I thought the title of this thread was bad news in Spain?

Well it's good if people begin to understand the distinction. Maybe if people respect the intent and subject matter of each thread, things will rub along nicely.  I suspect some selfish types won't be able to resist though - we even had negative comments about the fact you get good cheap prawns in Spain.

Something fishy going on there........ sorry couldn't resist!

Hi ads

just to compliment you on your earlier post. For those who don't know my story, I could have completed, but the property was nearly two years late, half contract size with no LFO and other problems. Why would anyone advise competing on that?. Yes I have nothing now, but that is because I acted in the correct way, and didn't stoop to the level of Spanish law. For some people to say we should have completed however badly breached our contract was, is completely missing the point. We can at least hold our heads high and sleep at night, knowing we kept our dignity and self respect, and have simply been cheated by low life liars working within a corrupt system. We need to beat them not join them!

now back to thread        .......oh yes by the way, so many fishy things

I may be wrong in law here but morally I totally agree with goodstich.  It would have been horrible to complete on something that obviously was not what was paid for and, it would also seem, not even legal. 

IMHO you must keep fighting this.  It took me 6 or 7 years but I eventually got my problems sorted out even though they pale into insignificance compared with those problems!  Yes, the system does need changing and people (builders, lawyers, developers, agents, et al) need to take responsibility for what they are doing.  In my case, I was totally lied to by the agents who told me I was signing for the deeds to my flat only to find out that I was simply signing POA for the solicitors (part of the agency group) to deal with it.  Unfortunately, my grasp of Spanish may allow me to buy things in shops and restaurants and even carry on a conversation about day-to-day things with Spanish speakers but it does not get me through "legalese" especially when a lot of it was in the Valencian dialect, anyway.  

Hopefully the flak coming from the EU to Spain regarding this will tighten up the rules and justice will be served (but, like everything in Spain, eventually seems to be the watchword).

 It may see hard to believe but the laws have tightend up on a mssive scale.

I know this is no compensation for the people cheated in the past but if you work within the system you now see a huge change in laws and measures put in place to protect people.

In some cases lawyers,Notaries,agents and bank managers are now so overly cautious and pedantic that it seems unbeleivable that it was so lapse in the past.

All problems we are now seeing are from the past and causing a huge ripple, it has been noticed and measures have been actioned to put things right.

bobaol

yes, the fight goes on.  8 years this month, and despite winning our case against the developer following a two year court delay, that only passed sentence weeks after the developer went bust (coincidence eh!) like so many others cheated, no sign of justice?.  It seems our only chance (apart from being somewhere on a creditor list, that we are told could take 5 years to sort out with no guarantee of anything?) is action from Europe, but what chance when they they tell us they won't interfere with Spain's justice system.

Part of Europe?, not when the shit hits the fan. Without some sort of mass protest or threats to subsidies, I think we are stuffed?

Good to know that the laws are tightening up as Georgia has identified, but sadly mass protest, honest publicity (not hype) AND threats to subsidies are required so long as the magnitude of these injustices remain outstanding.

Isn't it ironic that it has come to this, as all of these things will do no favours to those honest folk who endeavour to work within the law in Spain, but because the government refuses to face some uncomfortable truths and remedy the problems they are indirectly hurting their own people. It's so short sighted and pathetic that I just pray that the movement for justice grows sufficiently swiftly to gain a speedy remedy, so as not to add to Spain's woes. Another irony is that we wish no harm to Spain but that we have no alternative but to follow this painful path, and hope that by doing so we will spare a future generation from the stress and irreparable economic harm caused by their actions,  which accompanies abuse of this nature.

Stay strong Goodstich.

Wouldn't it be nice if the subsidies Spain where due from the EU were paid directly to the people who have been effected by their negligence! Maybe then the powers that be would do things differently in future. I think what ever they do in the future is too little too late and what a shame that will be for the people of Spain. Nobody ever hears of good news but bad news travels fast and sticks!

My Spanish neighbours tell me that they and all their family and friends are all fed up with this government and are desperate for an election, so who knows.

Why should the ordinary Spanish person suffer because of the corruption and fraud of a small minority.

 Most people who have lost money here have been at first defrauded by their own countrymen ie. English agents.

They then signed documents in a language they did not understand paying inflated deposits.

Ignorance, greed and stupidity played a great part in their misfortune.

Some 70 year olds ,yes you Norman, thought they would get mortgages which they would

pay for by rentals.

Stop blaming the Spanish and take a hard look at yourselves

controversial I know but how much whining can we put up with.

It never ceases to amaze me how ignorant of the facts most people are. It is not only British people that have been duped by yes English, Irish, Welsh and Scots agents but the Spanish themselves by their own together with Russians, Dutch, German, French etc etc need I go on.

To say these people are ignorant, greedy and stupid just shows how much you know about the 'real spain'.

Do you watch the spanish tv? or read the Spanish newspapers? Have you seen how many spanish have been duped by their own? Did they get all the paperwork? Yes of course but it was forged in many cases by corrupt mayors and officials who we see in the press and on the TV being arrested day in and day out.

Did the Prior's act stupidly when they asked their solicitor to ensure all documents were in order and that they had their building licence? No they didn't.

Was their mayor promising something that he couldn't and didn't have the authority to deliver? Yes, he was.

When Anthony Banderas bought his piece of land and built a home near to his parents in southern Spain ( he is a native of that area!) obtain permissions and build his home, think that there would ever be any question of it being illegal? No he didn't

I could go on and on but to be honest I think that people who have views like this who haven't even lived in Spain for 2 min's should go and educate themselves. I would be interested to see if you feel the same way once you have lived here for some time and spoken to people who have invested their life savings here, I doubt it.

I don't normally respond to individual comments by ill informed people but after sleeping on this way I feel I should.

where the hells Norman?

KP

I have lived and worked here in Spain for 12 years.

speak the language and i am quite aware about what has gone on.

your presumptions are wrong.

however,my comments are directed at the few who post on here

who take no responsibility for their actions at all.

and wallow in any negative comments about Spain.

Not all Spaniards are corrupt and a large majority of all nationalities have bought

property in Spain without any problems at all.

if you read other postings people are getting their deposits back through the courts.

After the recent MPs expenses in England we are in no position to give lessons

on morality and corruption to the Spanish