What are lawyers doing to address the delays in the Justice Administration System?

Dear Goodstitch,

the puzzle with you, apart from your coyness over money, is your regard for your lawyer.

you say you recognise the insanity, you may even recognise the bigC but you enthuse over "your" lawyer.

is he something special and brilliant as you describe?

can he see through the insanity that we all see?

how is that special?

has he an explanation for the delay on a ten second consideration?

it seems to be he is more concerned over what business fees Maria is getting than anything else.

time to tell all, I think.

Regards

Norman

normansands

the truth is, i'm not sure about my lawyer at the moment?   On one hand I don't feel I have been ripped off or intentionally lied to by my current lawyer, but on the other hand like most lawyers they seem happy to work within the system that fails to give 'real'  justice due in my case to them accepting excuses by judges for a two year delay that lead to the developer going bust. Also when i mentioned to them recently that I thought I should have a case because I was never supplied a BG, the response I got was that litigation would not be advisable, because it's unlikely we would win in court?. 

These reasons for not getting justice are certainly not acceptable. The unreasonable court delay is obviously very wrong as it ruined our chance of getting the money we were awarded in court. Not being provided a BG., is also very wrong and against the law, so why shouldn't I have a good case?. 

  Just how much blame I can put at the feet of my lawyer, verses blame on the system itself for the corruption that governs the success of any lawyer in cases like mine in Spain is still unclear at this time?.  My lawyers would say they have done the best they can within the system, but as the system clearly doesn't work for those wronged, then why has it not been challenged by all lawyers?

I  have to conclude that it's because it's part of the accepted corruption in the system or because they still get their fees anyway, perhaps both?. One thing for certain, it's bloody wrong which ever way you look at it, and I won't accept it, but I won't litigate further until I feel confident that 'being in the right' will provide justice?

Goodstich I think you probably speak for many as the insecurities are still not being resolved. Lawyers have to recognise that they will have to address these issues as they won't go away, and they will lose business (and respect) if they don't do something about this.

We all have to come together on this.

Dear Ads,

you really don't get it do you................you should most certainly read the book.

lawyers only interest is the bottom line, spanish lawyers clearly don't give a fig for Brit respect, rather the reverse.

you must get it into your head that you cannot rationlise the bigC, accept it and live with it like the Spanish do, they would rather have a fiesta than a riot?

It seems that Goodstitch is getting the message at last.

I wonder how much the message cost?

Regards

Norman

I am of the school of thought that the route to change is not always confrontational but to rationalise, to look and strive for workable solutions that don't compromise us, to look forward and not back.

I'm a great admirer of Mandela....... and a quote that springs to mind by one of his supporters is thus

"While we will not forget the brutality of apartheid, we will not want Robben Island to be a monument of our hardship and suffering, we would want it to be a triumph of the human spirit against the forces of evil. A triumph of largeness of spirit against the small minds and pettiness. A triumph of courage and determination over human frailty and weakness. A triumph of the new South Africa over the old.........."

I know you are angry. So am I. We just deal with it in different ways.

Each to their own.

normansands

I don't think it's quite that clear cut?.  We can't expect everyone to share our perception of corruption, or what to do about it?  Spain is a different culture with a very different history. As you say, they don't  have the stomach for protest against corruption as we do in the UK. We have to at least try and understand their view though, and by that I don't mean defending what's clearly wrong, but I mean in some ways working with them to try and make them see our point and change a way of life that's been accepted as 'normal'. If we just label everybody and everything as corrupt and hopeless we can't really expect a reasonable response.? My lawyers have told me they agree with much of what i'm saying about the corruption and understand my anger, but I do think they feel somewhat powerless to do much about it without change from the top?   You might say that's just  a cop out from my lawyers?, you wouldn't be alone!!, and  this is where my uncertainty lies, but I believe there is some truth in it.

Bye the way, I think Ads has very much 'got it' but don't expect us to all see things quite the same way. As long as we respect each others opinions that's ok.

Dear All,

sorry it is too "clear cut" for anyone...............I will try to..........

everyone to share our perception of corruption,

they sold something that was not there, imaginary, emporer's new clothes, with full lawyers connivance and facility.

my perception................criminal corruption, what else, try again...........no sorry nothing else...........failed, very clear cut.

they agree with much of what i'm saying,

much ? how much? what is not to agree? the black could not be any blacker whatever weasel words are used.

I am afraid that if we all wait for Goodstitch's lawyer to do something or wait for Spain to have a "Mandela moment", we are in for a very long wait indeed.

CORRUPTION IS CORRUPTION, FRAUD IS FRAUD AND CAN ONLY BE PERCEIVED AS SUCH NO MATTER HOW YOU TWIST THE VOCABLURY

ADS PLEASE READ THE BOOK

Regards

Norman

and your solution to recovery of monies  is.........

normansands

of course corruption is corruption by any other name, but as much as we know it and accept that it's completely wrong in any of it's many forms it takes in the Spanish property industry, we have to consider the way others percieve it, and percieve it in relation to those who have been cheated. I think many of us cheated are seen by Spanish people as greedy oppotunists with too much money who took a reckless gamble and lost?, so with that and corruption being more acceptable in Spain, I don't think most of the public in Spain are behind us?. The Spanish lawyers know the reality as do the judges and the Spanish government, but we still have to somehow get those people to make the changes that would provide 'real' justice for those who have clearly been wronged. This is why I feel we in some ways we have to try to work with those who have the power to force change, because we need them to see the reality of how their system has wronged us before they are likely to act, if they will act?.  If all negotiations, petitions etc fail, then we have to rely on pressure from the UK government or the EU, and we know the answer we get from them ''we can't interfere in another EU countries business''......, and what a farce that is when we are clearly supposed to abide by EU regulations!!

I don't think there are any clear answers yet, but we can only try all avenue's open, and if they fail look for other ways?

Dear All,

Maria tells us plain and simple........... but Mr Flores, Goodstitch's "brilliant" lawyer refuses an action based on Bank Guarantees, saying it is not worth pursuing. Not an easy thing for a hungry trader lawyer to do.

Goodstitch thinks Spain regards him as a greedy speculator who deserves to be fleeced. Both he and they have a point in that he did not lose that much and has long since recovered financially, so much so that he can afford to litigate as well (not cheap).

He now agrees with many in the UK that the EU is a farce and may even agree with many of the population and the runaways that the UK's multi-cultural policies are a nightmare of crime and Mafia imports from a very corrupt world.

It is even said that Spain tself has not escaped the various Mafia national groups, CDS is supposed to be riddled with it.

Ads has not got time to read the book on lawyers, she is busy actually trying to drive herself insane by attempting to rationlise the totally irrational, now to include Goodstitch's farce as well. That will be a long job in itself never mind recompense.

Maria has not even got time to report all that has gone before.

Too much for this old chap I am afraid.

Regards

Norman

Norman

It must be very painful to think of a world in such a negative light, to think the worst of folk, to conclude on such bold generalisations, to have such little hope in mankind. I wish I could lift your spirits and spare you this anguish. Life is what we make of it and if at some point things work against us, we have to turn it round, to believe that we have the capacity to do so, so long as we can rally good honest folk to our cause. Nothing comes easy in life but to give up hope is to allow those who have done you and so many other innocents harm, the ability to perpetuate their wrong doings.

If you don't mind I would now prefer to focus on ways to solve these problems, to continue dialogue with those genuinely willing to look for solutions.

I wish you well.

 Started a Facebook group and waiting for a blog-site to be prepared and start the campaign

Many thanks Maria. Please keep us informed of opinion and debate and most important how you all hope to speedily address the stranglehold on the true application of justice for all your clients.

It's much appreciated.

Dear Maria,

good stuff, keep it up, hope you get some Brit help to assist.

Please don't be offended by my generalisations on lawyers, there are exceptions and the book I want Ads to read was written by a truly brilliant and humane lawyer.

It is a matter of British shame that no one has taken up his work following his demise, disgusting really.

Ads, I may be bitter but have no sifgnificant anguish, though that could change quickly if any of my loved ones were badly affected by the mess we are in. We all have to face our own realities and at 73 my options are limited.

I am protected by my locale to some extent but am not happy with what I read of the downsides of our over liberal policies to the influx that has and is occurring.

I really do not want to finish in a country with mosques on every corner, ghettos and non-integration, no thank you, that is not what I was and am still prepared to fight for.

When I read of young shoolgirls, assuming honesty and integrity as a norm, being seduced and drugged into Packistani brothels in Birmigham my blood boils and I am ready to take up arms again.

Let us hope that our two young multi-millionaires in Downing Street will do something useful in this regard.

Regards

Norman

maria

good to read that. Let's hope you get a positive response, and soon?

For those interested Maria has kindly responded on another thread to my question

Does this article imply that the Bank of Spain would ultimately become liable for Spanish Banks' debts?

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSL367565020081103

Perhaps someone with greater financial knowledge can explain, or perhaps Maria or Keith can advise what would happen in the event that the Bank against whom we make a claim gets into financial difficulty?

as follows

" All debts will be assumed by whoever takes charge of the financial entity."

Dear Maria,

As I queried on another thread, when are the Government going to establish a proper compensation structure for all innocent individuals who have been drawn into this web of deceipt and corruption? Bank Guarantees, illegal builds, developer abuse, justice mal-administration….. we are not just talking of a few cases here.

 It is an obscenity.

Is there anything more you can do within the legal fraternity Maria (and others), towards establishing a campaign for fast tracking ALL instances of these abuses affecting innocent clients? For instance, can your campaign be structured into relevant sections calling for a compensation structure to be swiftly established from Banks assets (BG claimants and developer breach of contracts since they are presumably intrinsically linked), abusive local councils  (illegal builds), government coffers (Justice mal-administration)? Only then would this continuing nonsense be stopped and those responsible truly be made accountable.