How Spain has changed in 10 years....??!!!!

 Yes camposol - the whole idea of entitlement is what has got the UK in the mess it is to some extent.  I do not believe in universal state benefits full stop!!

Im not only talking about house taxes Im talking about income tax... and before you say you dont earn enough in State Pension to pay income tax I have news for you.  The onus is UPON YOU TO PAY YOUR TAXES-- got to a Fiscal Rep who will tell you what you have to pay and to whom... or he will do it for you. SORRY... no excuse. Like Road tax it is your responsibility to inform Suma.  Your Fiscal rep can be hired on a retainer for approx 80 - 100 euros a year... it is worth it because he can also save you money and advise you in all matters financial here in Spain. If you are not liabloe for tax he will tell you.. but at least then you are "legal"

Treat this country as you would want "THOSE PARASITES" back in the Uk to treat ours

Good set of responses from forum members.

Camposol- like Bri I will not be claiming a state pension and believe me as someone who worked for 30-years in the City have paid an awful lot of taxes but also made enough to make my own way in life without the need for benefits from a government. I hope the government use my non taking of a pension to benefit the needy.

Also I'm NOT emmigrating - I'm an Australian citizen (have to join the longest Q at LHR each time I travel) and am returning home to enjoy my retirement and be laid to rest in the land of my Mum and Dad. At least Oz is not blighted by the levels of government debt that the UK and Spain are. As a Western Australian we are doing OK with the World Bank predicticting good growth in 2012.

As Bri says there are opportunities in Spain and people have to get the timing right and sometimes be brave.

The UK (as they continue to devalue sterling) and Spain will find a way out of the mess. The Costas have a good climante - but not as good at in Perth WA - and as such will always be able to attract the less well off retiree and families looking for the 2-weeks in the Sun. As somome who has spent the last 2 winters in dubai I've been suprised by the numbers of UK retirees who are renting here - but they seem to be the better off with private as well as state means.

I'm leaving for WA at the end of the month but will be back for the Ashes series ans as a fan will be a supporter of good Cricket no matter who wins. Not sure that will be the case when the series is played in Australia.

Hope all goes well for the people who follow their dreams - as a young lad spending his mornings in the Scarborough Beach surf and evenings in the books - I know that dreams do come true. You just have to believe and try your hardest.

Hope the cricket is as good tomorrow as it was today.

David

 I second that - it has picked up!!!   Why is it not in 3D??????  really enjoying the football today in 3D (thought the standard of play is poor)!!!!!!!

D_B_S  You're lucky you have the option to emigrate to Australia.  I've never been, but would like to.  I think thouigh that I would still choose Spain to live in full time, with all it's problems.  One thing we are probably all in agreement with is that the UK is becoming a hell hole!

DonLochnagar - just to correct your last post - I'm NOT emigrating - I'm returning home.

No luck involved just a lifetime of long sometimes very long hours, travel and hard work. To come out of the City sane after 30+ years is an achievement (well I think so as many of the people I know are dead of have REAL depenency problems).

If you are thinking of relocating look at all the options. The UAE is thriving - not for everyone as it has many problems, but for the people who are willing to work hard it will reward. Look at Australia better climate than Spain, Government returing a surplus, growth at 4 or 5% (at least it's positive) good wages, average in WA - sorry it's my state so its what I know- at 88K AUD.

Look at all the options Canada, US and South America all worth a look.

Granted travel to the options I have listed are longer but you'll find thet are Happier places.

David

D_B_S  Sorry wrong choice of word, mind you WA can't have been that great when you've be away from it earning a crust for the last 30 years.Why didn't you work and live in WA?  I think one of the important things about Spain, is their attitude to life.  People laugh about their laid back 'manana' culture, but as far as i'm concerned, once I get my 'Spanish head' on, I find it very attractive.  Would I want to live in Dubai?  Not with the way the world is going.  If the West start a war with Iran, the ball's on the slates, as we say in Scotland and my preference would to be in Europe.

Well Well Well

Earlier today I only asked a simple question about a Spanish holiday home sale OFFER and if I shouod accept it. What do we get, a load of speculation from all over the place. Well it's Sunday and that's a quiet day in Spain. Also I bet you expats are all bored stiff. pissed. arguing and freezing cold in your poorly insulated/damp Spanish houses.

What you are missing is the central heating the UK homes can give. It's minus 6 deg outside now but lovely and warm inside and if you return to UK without much money the State will assist you via BENEFITS (as they do with ALL the Immigrants)

So Cheer up and think about coming home to Vote in a RESPONSIBLE Government

I have to make a decision soon and I believe you have made my mind up for me

 Yes papa, but to be fair, the thread had been started by georgia some time ago and was going strong before your post.  And it is a no brainer - if you have been offered that for your home and you want to sell of course you should take it.  I am looking at properties which are a minimum of 60% down on 5 years ago - and still waiting for them to go further!!! 

DonLochnagar, not saying WA, Oz or Dubai is the best place to be just saying people should look at all the options be open to them. It could be that the distance or the lack of opportunities are not for you or others but at least they would have been considered. Especially in the current gloomy European economic climate.

I was a surf bum from WA who was good at maths got a place at Oxford granted a good degree and was asked to stay for a PhD. Went back to Oz to do national service where the government sent me to Vietnam for a couple of years as a Special Ops explosive specialist. Survived came back to the UK and completed that PhD. Whilst at Oxford met my wife (also a Ozzie) who was undertaking medical studies.

We both were offered good opportunities in the UK so stayed. family came along and since the UK has some of the best education in the world stayed. Daughters have done well and moved to Switzerland and US so now its our time - and thats back home.

People just look at all the options and stay open minded - if Spain is for you that's a good place to be.

David

Earthquake in Spain this AM  Did you all feel it and has anyone experienced any damage

 1.  The earthquake was 10km S of Rojales on the CB.  A 3.5 which made my bed shake rather a lot at 05:48 this morning.  No damage, though.

2.  I must be in the minority of the posters on here.  Have been coming here for 12 years, usually for 2 weeks at a time.  A few years ago, I took early retirement in UK with the view to coming to Spain.  However, I found it impossible to sell my house in UK so we came more frequently to Spain for 2 or 3 months at a time.  Finally sold my house in UK (not taken a loss but certainly a lot less than it went on the market for at first.)  However, We now live here on a permanent basis and find it marvellous, thank you very much.  My house is a well built, warm and comfy abode.  Admittedly, my first flat 12 years ago was one of these "build em qwik and flog em to the Brits" type.  The house, however, has well fitting doors, double-glazing, an air-con/heating through ducting from an inverter which gets the whole place lovely and warm.  Just as cosy here as ever was in UK, thank you very much.  Oh, and it's only just got cold.  Last week we were out sunbathing on the porch with the temp guage pushing 25 as it was all over Christmas and New Year.

3.  Maybe living on the coast is different to inland but, in that 12 years, it's always been a lot quieter in Winter than in Summer.  No more and no less in this area than it ever has been.  The roads have improved a bit though not the driving.  Restaurants around us still have to be booked to guarantee a table, even in the depths of January.  That is, providing they are good and have good service.  For example, one Chinese restaurant quite close is lucky to get 4 people in a night.  Another one a couple of blocks away is packed every night and definitely needs booking at weekends even though prices are similar.  Shops open and close quite regularly but they always have done.  There just isn't enough trade to keep them going during the winter months.  Some seem to open for a month and then fade away.  There are more people coming to live permanently on our community and it seems someone else moves in every other week.  Brits as well as other nationalities.  In fact, only one couple have moved back to UK in all that time and the general concensus is no way I'm leaving.   

4.  Prices.  They have gone up but that is mainly due to the pound falling.  Prices, apart from utilities, have gone up nowhere near as much as they have in UK (except for items from UK, of course).  Utilities have not increased as much as UK (I don't want this to sound like a UK v Spain post but have nothing else to compare).  Electric is 15c a unit here, just dragged out my UK electric bill and it was 20.4p a unit up to so many units then 14.3p a unit after that.  Water in UK, if you're not on a meter) is going up to an average of £440.  Internet in UK looks great but you need to add on the line rental and VAT to those headline offers.  Also only available in towns with competition.  My BT bill in UK, in a village, was £168 a quarter which included bog standard broadband and free calls at weekends so where this £16 a month offers you see come from, I don't know.  Plus you generally have gas bills in UK as well let alone the £1440 a year council tax, £260 a year road tax.  Car insurance has rocketed up in UK as well.  For someone of 61, driving a small 1,8  MPV, no claims for over 10 years and doing less than 6,000 miles a year and the last charge was £370.  Breakdown cover was not even included in that.  Petrol in Spain seem to go up every week but about the same in euros here as it is pounds in UK.

5.  I feel no sense of being ripped off.  The Spaniards pay the same as I do in a supermarket, the same as I do at the garden centre, the same as I do on the bus and in the bricolaje.  The only rip offs I come across are (sometimes but rarely) from Brits offering to fit aircon, kitchen units, do plumbing or whatever.  I am lucky in that I have found an excellent (Brit) guy who has contacts with lots of Spanish workmen (the Brit has been here for 17 years) and puts me in touch with them.  I have had excellent work at excellent prices (for me, not them) on aircon installation, plumbing work and other items.

6.  The "black" money economy, so prevalent 12 years ago, seems to be disappearing, especially on house purchase.  The Valencia government are cracking down on the cowboy builders, the backhander mayors etc.  It seems a bit tough but they are also enforcing rules which were overlooked for so many years.  Bad news for some but will certainaly improve things for people buying now.  

7.  Yes, it's difficult now to sell a house in Spain and has been for almost 4 years.  My flat went 2 years ago for half the price I paid for it 12 years ago.  I wouldn't sell my house now regardless of what it is, or isn't, worth as I am here to stay and loving it, thank you very much.  I have completed all the paperwork I need, I have great neighbours who help each other out but aren't in everyone's back pockets all the time, a lovely garden with colourful flowers and plants all year round, a very (very) relaxed way of life and eat out a couple of times a week (the only fly in the ointment is that the only local bars are Brit ones and I can't stand the Sport on telly, karaoke blasting, John Smith selling, English speaking only bars) and the good Spanish bars are quite a distance away.  

8.  What has changed is the moaning Brits.  It's great where I am but, going into Torrevieja, I seem to be surrounded by those constantly moaning about the service in Carrefour, the MDD going up from 4.99 to 5.99, the fact the Spanish won't speak English to them unless they're being ripped off, the number of immigrants in UK (Ironic or what?), the pound going up (or down) etc etc.  And all from people who try and circumvent the system in Spain by driving English registered cars, getting their TV from illegal re-broadcasters (and Sky in UK was £44 a month without the film channels, by the way), not registering as "residents" and so on.  

So, no, I don't find it all that different from 10 years ago except that I, personally, think it is getting better.  My money certainly seems to go a lot further now I'm not paying £600 every month in bills.  My wife's health has certainly improved (gone are the arthritic pains and twinges in the bionic knee), I am far more relaxed just wandering round markets rather than the frantic dash to Tesco's every week and i certainly don't miss the 10 mile commute to work every morning and back every evening.  It's not just the weather, it's----well----it's everything.  I hope I'm not alone!

It's great to hear that you are very settled in Spain enjoying a confortable and pleasant quiet life. I have been there 5 times a year over a period of ten years and  agree with all the points you have mentioned . We don' really need the money from a sale but it's time for us to sell up now because we wish to see many other places in the world and our teenager grand daughters prefer more lively places now. also we believe if we kept the house on we would feel obliged to keep on going there, otherwise as you know everything deteriorates and the gardens get overgrown etc

We will of course visit Spain again and stay at hotels in various towns that we love wandering in.

Continue to enjoy your time out there  best wishes. 

Bobaol, my feelings exactly, I can't wait to get out here full time.

 Things do change...just thought i would add some humour....made me chuckle..

Nelson at Trafalgar 2012 

Nelson: "Order the signal, Hardy."

Hardy: "Aye, aye sir."

Nelson: "Hold on, this isn't what I dictated to Flags. What's the meaning of this?"

Hardy: "Sorry sir?"

Nelson (reading aloud): „ England expects every person to do his or her duty, regardless of race, gender, sexual orientation, religious persuasion or disability.' - What gobbledygook is this for God's sake?"

Hardy: "Admiralty policy, I'm afraid, sir. We're an equal opportunities employer now. We had the devil's own job getting „ England " past the censors, lest it be considered racist."

Nelson: "Gadzooks, Hardy. Hand me my pipe and tobacco."

Hardy: "Sorry sir. All naval vessels have now been designated smoke-free working environments."

Nelson: "In that case, break open the rum ration. Let us splice the main brace to steel the men before battle."

Hardy: "The rum ration has been abolished, Admiral. Its part of the Government's policy on binge drinking."

Nelson: "Good heavens, Hardy. I suppose we'd better get on with it full speed ahead."

Hardy: "I think you'll find that there's a 4 knot speed limit in this stretch of water."

Nelson: "Damn it man! We are on the eve of the greatest sea battle in history. We must advance with all dispatch. Report from the crow's nest, please."

Hardy: "That won't be possible, sir."

Nelson: "What?"

Hardy: "Health and Safety have closed the crow's nest, sir. No harness; and they said that rope ladders don't meet regulations. They won't let anyone up there until proper scaffolding can be erected."

Nelson: "Then get me the ship's carpenter without delay, Hardy."

Hardy: "He's busy knocking up a wheelchair access to the foredeck Admiral."

Nelson: "Wheelchair access? I've never heard anything so absurd."

Hardy: "Health and safety again, sir. We have to provide a barrier- free environment for the differently abled."

Nelson: "Differently abled? I've only one arm and one eye and I refuse even to hear mention of the word. I didn't rise to the rank of admiral by playing the disability card."

Hardy: "Actually, sir, you did. The Royal Navy is under- represented in the areas of visual impairment and limb deficiency."

Nelson: "Whatever next? Give me full sail. The salt spray beckons."

Hardy: "A couple of problems there too, sir. Health and safety won't let the crew up the rigging without hard hats. And they don't want anyone breathing in too much salt - haven't you seen the adverts?"

Nelson: "I've never heard such infamy. Break out the cannon and tell the men to stand by to engage the enemy."

Hardy: "The men are a bit worried about shooting at anyone, Admiral."

Nelson: "What? This is mutiny!"

Hardy: "It's not that, sir. It's just that they're afraid of being charged with murder if they actually kill anyone. There are a couple of legal-aid lawyers on board, watching everyone like hawks."

Nelson: "Then how are we to sink the Frenchies and the Spanish?"

Hardy: "Actually, sir, we're not."

Nelson: "We're not?"

Hardy: "No, sir. The French and the Spanish are our European partners now. According to the Common Fisheries Policy, we shouldn't even be in this stretch of water. We could get hit with a claim for compensation."

Nelson: "But you must hate a Frenchman as you hate the devil."

Hardy: "I wouldn't let the ship's diversity coordinator hear you saying that sir. You'll be up on disciplinary report."

Nelson: "You must consider every man an enemy, who speaks ill of your King."

Hardy: "Not any more, sir. We must be inclusive in this multicultural age. Now put on your Kevlar vest; it's the rules. It could save your life"

Nelson: "Don't tell me - Health and Safety. Whatever happened to rum, sodomy and the lash?"

Hardy: As I explained, sir, rum is off the menu! And there's a ban on corporal punishment."

Nelson: "What about sodomy?"

Hardy: "I believe that is now legal, sir."

Nelson: "In that case................... Kiss me, Hardy."

Papa, as I was sitting in the warm, spring sun having my lunch, I thought of you in your centrally heated house costng a fortune to keep warm and a smile crossed my lips!

Well lucky old you Don... here nr San Miguel it was below freezing on Friday/Saturday. even icicles in the garden

Since Saturday it has hovered around 6 to 7 degrees and today warmer but wind bitterly cold... my heating has been on full blast. and costing me a small fortune if Iberdrola have anything to do with it. Dont tell me it doesn´t get cold in Spain !!!!!

. near me they are building the largest desalinisation plant in Europe (I believe)  

& all the others the Psoe commissioned are running on 'maintenance ' regime only . The cost of producing the water  is in excess of its resale value as there is an excess of water. Should have stuck to the original plan of oipoing it down from the North. Oh I forgot that was the PP's plan . & that's the problem with all politicians.

Papa , I'd snap there hand off at that price.
 By the way , returning under retirement age UK citizens cannot receive benefits until they've been back in the country 2 years !  Anyone who manages it probably hasn't told the truth. That was the up to date info supplied to my wife 2 weeks ago.

Don

Are you in a LEGAL build ?

Goslopez

I don't live in Spain I have a house in UK  and  confortable pensions so don't need to wory about claiming benefits I'll leave that to the immigrants and Lazy people