La Caixa refusing to pay out on life insurance.

Hi everyone, I hope somebody may be able to help me here. I will tell the story very quickly and if you need any more detail to help me please ask.
My Mother and Father moved to Fuerteventura in 2000, in April 2015 my Mother passed away.
She had a life insurance with La Caixa bank, because my Mother had not written a will they refused to pay out so we got a solicitor involved, the insurance was only for 6000 euros, just enough to pay for funeral costs.
My Father came back to the UK to live after the funeral and myself and my Sister have been dealing with the solicitors.

We have paid out for the following items over the years

certificado últimas voluntades a Madrid tasa                         3,70 €
petición por MRW                                                                  17,03 €
envio por MRW                                                                      25,00 €
certificado de seguro de vida                                                 3,70 €
notario declaracion de herederos abintestato (2 testigos)       273,20 €
notario aceptacion de herencia                                                200,00 €
impuesto de sucesiones                                                           0,00 €
peticion por MRW                                                                  42,50 €
envio por MRW                                                                      23,56 €
poder POA                                                                              59,53 €
certificado derecho inglés                                                       300,50 €
traduccion tres certificados de familia                                    160,50 €
traduccion certificado de derecho inglés                                85,60 € 
Total                                                                                    1.194,82 €             

Abogado / Lawyers fees                                                         1.498,00 €

After all of this the bank agreed to pay out once we had provided them with "un certificado de titularidad de la cuenta corriente"  for my Fathers UK bank account.
We believe this translates to Certificate of Ownership of the current account this does not exist in the UK and dsespite sending bank statements and even a signed letter from the bank saying the account belonged to my Father they are still refusing to pay, I think the Solicitor has also now given up as they are not responding to any emails.
The last bit of advice they gace was that my Father should fly out to Fuerteventura and open up a bank account !

I know its not a huge amount of money but it is the principle now, the bank is obviously finding any excuse not to pay out so any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Mark

It is just a further example of cowboy land Spain. The bank know exactly what game they are playing.

Isn't this one of those prime examples where you put a 'Denuncia' thingy on the bank, or you can't, worth checking I would have thought as it seems everytime something goes wrong in Spain up crop these.

How do you put a 'Denuncia' thingy on the bank or anything else whilst living in the UK without going to great expense? The bank know it and it’s all part of the game.

Next ploy will be mother must come to the bank herself (even though she is sadly dead).

I am afraid the 6,000 euro has been donated to the bank Christmas party fund.

How do you put a 'Denuncia' thingy on the bank or anything else whilst living in the UK without going to great expense? 

Well I would say if the poster wants anything done about the missing money then they will have to get on a flight to Spain to sort things out, maybe for one last time,  from what I have read on here these 'Denucia' thingys are done by the police, or as has been said a thousand times ask for a complaints form, another thing that seems to cure everything, if you can indeed do these on a bank, having never had any reason to use one but I am sure some would know if this is possible...Or just sit back and let it go.

Have a look at this website it may help

http://www.tumbit.com/how-to-guides/articles/163-how-and-where-to-complain-about-my-bank-in-spain.html

Good Luck

Mark

Maybe a day out or get the managers name and ring him every day, see who gives in first.

Spanish Banks and insurance companies are notorious for not paying out life assurance claims. In fact my bank manager confided to me once that having life insurance is a waste of money because they will forensically examine the contracts to find fault and avoid paying out claims. They will also make you or your dependants jump through hoops for years until you give up.

It’s entirely wrong but that is unfortunately how it works. They happily take your money but the flow is only one way.

Rather than a Denuncia, perhaps you should ask the bank for a Complaints Form, all companies must provide them and take it with your evidence to the nearest OMIC office normally situated around or in Town Halls.

Probably a good idea hugh and worth trying, but would OMIC have the skill and knowledge to unravel the trickery and deceit of the bank.

😂 UK & US Regulators don’t have the expertise to regulate the trickery of Global Banking and Insurance as they employ those who don’t make working for the Financial Goliaths so, no OMIC won’t have the expertise but just sometimes it makes those in the wrong sit up and pay attention if an investigation is likely.

Other than that, expensive litigation.

It's too easy to get sidetracked and think the worst in these situations.  But you need to take the request for a "un certificado de titularidad de la cuenta corriente"  at face value. 

Denouncias and Complaints forms are premature and may delay what should be a simple process.

Clearly there is a communication problem, so start by telephoning them and asking to speak to someone who speaks English.  Explain the sitation and possibly provide a copy of a joint bank account in your mother & father's name which may suffice. 

If not get them to tell you what they require.  All communication should be in writing and try to keep communicate with one individual to build a relationship.  If they only reply verbally, confirm back to them in writing, with your reply. 

You have to view the situation from La Caixa's viewpoint - they have asked for a "un certificado de titularidad de la cuenta corriente" which you have not provided.  You have then tried to bully them and involved a solicitor, but still not provided a "un certificado de titularidad de la cuenta corriente ". 

They are not going to be intimidated.  Their procedure has not been followed.  The fact that you might struggle to provide the bit of paper they need has to be dealt with.  If anything you need an interpreter, not a solicitor.

You need to understand the mindset of the individual.  For him it's a simple tick box exercise.  It is absurd for anyone to suggest that "all Spanish banks and insurers are notorious etc"...absolute nonsense.  They will pay out when their procedure is followed and they receive the evidence they need to justify payment, not before! 

But you are going off at a tangent.  If you treat them with a little more respect and respond to their queries properly you will have the claim paid.  I don't believe there is an alternative. 

Perhaps acer you have not read the OP.

''After all of this the bank agreed to pay out once we had provided them with "un certificado de titularidad de la cuenta corriente"  for my Fathers UK bank account.
We believe this translates to Certificate of Ownership of the current account this does not exist in the UK and dsespite sending bank statements and even a signed letter from the bank saying the account belonged to my Father they are still refusing to pay, I think the Solicitor has also now given up as they are not responding to any emails.
The last bit of advice they gace was that my Father should fly out to Fuerteventura and open up a bank account !''

I don’t disagree that correct processes have to followed and ticked off but in this case has the OP NOT stated that copies  of statements along with a signed letter from the bank already been provided?

Yes I agree someone needs to intervene or communicate for the sake of clarity but did the solicitor not already do this?

It is possible letters from a British bank and/ or statements therefrom are not recognised without being notorised....as is everything is in Spain. People forge everything these days..even bank drafts !! ..so HOW is a Spanish bank to know if something is genuine? 

So surely the easiest solution is that the father of OP do as requested and come to Spain to sort it.

Floella

Don’t you think you maybe jumping to your own conclusions here. The OP has not stated that the documents have been rejected with a given reason. He just states they have been ignored. Perhaps the OP could comment.

I'm not going to argue this at length.  But if I was a clerk at a bank/insurer and requested a document but in response received a solicitors letter I certainly wouldn't jump to issue a cheque.  They have their procedures which must be followed!  They need to be able to justify payment to their bosses.

A positive but polite response is needed to get matters sorted. 

Kavanagh - I suspect the OP jumped to the wrong conclusion and I suspect his conversation was limited.  If you go in with preconceived ideas that all Spanish insurers and banks are going to stonewall and don't want to settle the matter you're unlikely to succeed.

The training and technical levels of most insurance company staff is very poor these days.  It's a call centre mentality, they need to shift paper quickly but don't know how to deal with anything unusual.

You are wrong about trying to wriggle out of the claim - it's a miniscule amount and they would prefer to pay it immediately, it's more trouble than it's worth.  But they want their bit of paper, or a pukkah explanation to sanction payment.  Hence the need for a conversation and clarification, not solicitors, denouncias, or complaint forms.

Kavanagh, I am jumping the gun!! WHAT.... for stating the claimant should take the advice GIVEN from a trained solicitor and go to Fuerteventura to sort it because the proof he has from UK isn’t working.

Suggest you re-read your own posts and some of the ridiculous options you suggest before criticising others.

Acer we only have the OP statement to go on and he has not contributed to the thread since. So maybe a wind up, who knows. Unfortunately Spanish banks, through their own efforts, have a gutter reputation of trickery and deceit.

As far as I know the British Embassy UK or Spain can certify many documents if requested (for a juicy fee of course).

Kavanagh - you say " Spanish banks, through their own efforts, have a gutter reputation of trickery and deceit".  Previously you included Insurance Companies in this blanket condemnation, I wonder why the sudden reprieve?

Do Spanish banks really have a "gutter" reputation?  I have an account with La Caixa and I'm been amazed by the good service.  A year or so ago I emailed the local manager on a subject on a Sunday, intending it to be opened the following day, to receive an immediate helpful reply.  The manager and assistant manager speak perfect English and are always available on a walk-in basis. 

I dealt with Spanish insurers as well as others from many countries all over the world for many years in a professional capacity and never found they were much different to UK insurers.  IMHO as a professional they are better than most.

I feel it's almost offensive to use such unsubstantiated derogatory comments, particularly as they are unable to respond.  You do seem to have a bit of a downer on most folk, that I certainly do not share.