spains appeal gone

Justin

well said, a well balanced post indeed. Like you, I think there are some great things about Spain and some awful things as well. If it wasn't for the weather I wonder how many would prefer to live there to the UK though?   Both have many faults, I would say thesilent majority are probably those who bought off-plan in Spain and didn't get what was promised but are making the best of it.

The ideal way would seem to be 6 months in each, but we can't all do that, and I wouldn't want to live in Spain permenantly after what we have found of the system.

you pays yer money.................

A couple we know had a place in Spain, a fabulous old house in the old town of Frigiliana. They also had a house in the UK. Husband 's job was one he could do anywhere in the world providing he had a telephone and PC. When he retired, they sold up in Spain & UK.  Their intention was to live permanently in Spain.  But after spending a year travelling...they have now bought a property in the UK and rent in Spain. They said they can rent a far better villa than they could afford to buy, and after 3/6 months just lock up and leave.  They paid €2000 for 3 months rental, 3 bed/2bath + private pool....during the high season!  He said he will not buy now. It's more cost effective to rent and no ties.

I'm a generally sileny majority and didn't buy off plan.

We bought our rundown finca four years ago and spent two years with builders doing the reform and fencing and patios etc etc.

Came out to live full time last November and have NO regrets whatsoever.  We have had a lot of grief with builders but that can happen in the UK.

Seeing sunshine most days in winter and summer lifts the spirits no end, regardless of temperatures.

I honestly believe that many people who return to the UK only remember the good things there and see the bad things here.

On their return, I think it highly likely that the bad things in the UK will rear their head again and the good things in Spain will be remembered.

Soooo..... I think you should keep your options open for when the cold, rain, crime, yobs, prices, rates, taxes...... etc...   drive you back to Spain. lol

Laury

Hi all

We did not buy off plan either, We bought our first house in Spain 12 years ago and have lived here in the campo for the last 5 years and would not want to return to UK.

The cost of living has risen here mainly because of the fall in sterling against the euro. Things like Council tax. car tax and petrol/diesel are still cheaper here as are the fruit and veg in the local markets.

The main difference is the general pace of life. In UK everyone is so busy rushing around. The driving has become much more aggresive (almost like Spain then) and it sometimes seems that people have no time for each other anymore. At least in Spain I can stop for a coffee and not feel guilty that I am not achieving something vitally important.

Last but not least we have the weather. OK, it is hot in Summer, ( that is why many people return to their home country during July/ August) but we do not need the heating on all year. My daughter told me only last night that they have had the heating off for only 2 or 3 days this year as it has been so cold in Yorkshire. At least we can visit the port during February and enjoy a coffee sitting in the sunshine  on the Paseo.

As Laury says many people only remember the good things about the Uk. Perhaps it is a case of "the grass is always greener on the other side".

Jean

Justin

When circumstances permit I will live full time in Spain Currently my wife has her Mother in a home and she has the responsibility as her brother has gone to Menorca

I may find that I do not like it full time,who knows but I will certainly give it a go

But I do understand that some do not find that it is for them 

Dear All,

well said Justin, but you cannot stop the spinners spinning and the knockers knocking.

human nature it seems has to do both, they cannot just spin without knocking or knock without spinning

and of course there is the absolute need to forever publicl justify your choice to oneself, that is essential.

however here in East Kent we are parched and burnt, the visage is blotched with sun damage, the paddocks are dust and we are feeding winter hay.

subsidence has raised its ugly head again.

but still the sea is cold and the evenings outside restricted.

we are blessed with multiple eateries with meals for a fiver

council and police services are £2,000 per annum and more

the accursed dogs are under control, generally and the crap is cleared

petty crime is drug related and extensive

Councils are a growth industry of petty restrictions with Planning an abomination, little Hitlers abound in office hours and "waste" has a new meaning.

the little Hitlers don't come out at night to tackle the nasty brutish people who are doing damage with the dangerous stuff

no one, without exception, understands the forms for anything, it all has to be decided by committee or court with form fillers a new profession

but some things really are easier on the net

simple souls, like me don't even understand the recycling

but the EU is to blame so is Spain any better?

the six/six sounds good until an isolated idyll is found

good luck with whatever you choose or can manage.

Regards

Norman

Hi norm

what are you smoking?........and can I have some please?

Norman.

Are you alright today, or have you been joining in the crime scene in your area.

Perhaps you should take a little more water with it.

It might be me but cannot seem to understand what you are trying to say.

Pat

Dear All,

thank you for your concern

no, I am not alright, apart from the drought, sunburn and petty council officials, I had to meet a loss adjuster yesterday who was in intensive claim denial mode.

I therefore had to listen to complete rubbish for more time than I have left for such things. Most trying.

It merely reinforced my view that perhaps professional corruption is the greatest crime in the world today and is not confined to Spain and Spanish lawyers

I don't smoke, it is far too dangerous here at the moment anyway, so please send your sympathy in liquid form as the weather is predicting a long balmy evening into the night.

Regards

Norman

 Spain has changed massively from my early days here,some for the good,some for the bad.

Things are definitely not as cheap as they used to be,but,many of things we buy now were not available a few years ago, a rogue bottle of Heinz ketchup used to be high on the list for visiting friends and relatives, now we just pay over the odds for it here.

Work was easy when i first arrived,now very thin on the ground for many.

There was a lot of 30 somethings moving here with their children for a better life,when times turned hard they longed for the security of home(often social security!!) and went back.

The predominant age group now moving here is back to the retired or early retired.

The weather is great as we all know but it wasn't high on my list list of convincers to move here,you do get used to the heat but the mild becomes colder each year......

I always said that when Spain was infected by the UK's softly softly,nanny state,PC,you can't say that,all are welcome........state of mind, then i would leave here.

I actually think if the UK was how it used to be i would still be there and i know so would many others, which begs the question, is Spain so good or trhe UK just a terrible compromise.

I actually hear what Norman is saying!!!!!!

I came here for the social and Family values to bring children up that are allowed to play and run free without The H&S brigade and the PC mob smothering them to death,just remember, PC was invented to control your thoughts and speech and Health&Safety to control your actions!!

Anyway, some things are better here than they used to be and others just frustrate the hell out of you.

Spain still comes out tops for me..............!

georgia

'PC mob smothering them to death'? , .......'health and safety to control your actions',    

What a load of tosh!  You really are in cuckoo land if you think that all areas in the UK are like that. My kids play outside, go to the park. I cycle and run in the town and counrtry without fear. My kids go to a supurb state school with discipline but freedom of thought, and in all the dealings i've had with commercial and residential property in the UK i've never had a problem, and sleep well knowing we have regulation and justice that more often than not works!

As for the weather?, well its 24c here today, and i'm just about to cycle home in a T-Shirt, then go and watch my daughter play football for our local womens team, but this heat is rare, and yes i'd love Spains long sunny days and warm nights.

It's not perfect here by any means, but it's really not that bad, and i've learned to appreciate that all the more since my Spanish experience. There are also things I love about Spain of course, but they are losing their appeal with all the other crap going on!

We have beeen in spain for nearly two years, the ordinary people are lovely, but the corruption that exists especially in the buidling trade is unbeleivable.  Our builder is currently under investigation for fraud and deception, but is still trading and still trying to swindle people.  I have very little faith in the legal system which just seem to support the corruption.  Saying that I was recently in Uk and talking to relatives, they are struggling to pay bills, worried about their jobs  and the levels of crime are rising dramatically.  More and more horror stories are emerging about filthy hospitals and medical blunders

I guess that if you live anywhere for a long period of time, you can look back and say this has changed that has changed not always for the best, and the cost of living is always rising, and of course the euro against the pound plays a big part, but thats the same the whole world over, currencies go up and down and it just depends on what currency your paying in.   I doubt if we will stay in this particular area ( more to do with the builder)  I think we will stay  in spain for the forseeable future.  spain either works for you or donst, but at least you gave it ago and its better that sitting in UK in 20 years time saying "I wish I had........".    If you do go back to UK, good luck to you and I hope it proves to be everything you want it to be.

.  

Hi 2 every 1

I live in Bulgaria and I'll be coming over 4 a week in October.I did live in Spain "Oliva" for nearly 3yrs and left 4 personel reasons..regret,regret.Both my partner and I are thinking about living back in Spain.The reasons mainly are that social life..and I dont mean out on the --ss all the time, are fairly uncommon hear in the village where we live.There is a large town"Yambol" about 20mins away,and its nice but its just not the same as nipping down 2 Denia,or up 2 Gandia 4 a coffee or 2...I'm afraid to say the brits here leave alot to be desired...what I've done,what we've got and all that.The thing is if you've got a few bob in the bank you would look like a Branson over here in some of the villages,and I don't like that attitude..Oh and if you think its expensive to shop in spain,try the large supermarkets here..Billa and Kaufland..yes they are german and I think they are getting there own back on us..The things that are cheap are council tax "£8.00" a year..yes 8 POUNDS...water is very cheap and electric is fairly cheap too.By the way the house we live in is a 2 bed detached with about 1500 sq.mtrs of land.In the 8mths we have been here petrol has steadily crept up to £1.00 a ltre eqvlt...and goods in the shops,as I said are already rising.It is nice though when your neihbours come round with plants and local fire water that they all brew here...in general most Bulgarians are very nice people...So why do I want to leave..I'm still in love with spain I think...See you in October

Steve/Christine

Dear All,

am I going soft or was that a nice balanced post without spin and knock.

thank you

Regards

Norman

The UK is a wonderful place, or was until all the current problems started. We are being ruined by the PC brigade, Health & Safety stupidity, soft touch government,  lack of a useful police force (generally because of the above reasons), aggression wherever you go, overcrowding, no respect........I could go on, so why would anyone who made the break really want to come back.

I can't wait to leave the country that I once loved. I have worked hard all my life, paid my dues and was looking forward to planning my retirement. That all changed because of the state of our once great nation, so I have changed my plans and will not be staying to see the total destruction of all things British. Growing up in the 50s and 60s was tough but fun and I do believe that is the main problem in the UK today. It's not tough anymore, it's all too easy and therefore it is no fun.

I may be getting old but I still want some fun and will be going to Spain for mine. 

This all goes to prove that in Spain or the UK you get good and bad in each!

I don't recognise the picture painted by the last post so it obviously depends on where in the UK  you choose to live (or Spain for that matter).

Plus it depends very much on your outlook in life, how tolerant you are of different perspectives, etc etc.

I tend to be fairly tolerant in the main but what I find objectionable (and feel vulnerable)  is when you observe obvious  injustice, turning a blind eye to consistent malpractices etc.

Each to their own however.

ads

I don't recognise the picture painted by TJL either.  I'm sure in some rough or overcrowded areas this goes on but I think that could be said of any country. It sounds more like justifying a change of lifestyle to me, or not living in a reasonable part of the UK?

TJL

 If PC means not being racist, not being cruel to animals, having equal rights for women, having a minimum wage, having a regulation, legal and justice system based on at least some common sense etc etc, then bring on the PC!  Probably the biggest gripes about the UK are the government, immigration and the increase in violence?.  They are no doubt areas of concern that need attention, but all countries have their issues to deal with, and Spain certainly has its fair share!

As ads says, it's each to his/ her own. What I have learned, is that the things i've always preffered about Spain, (apart from fab weather and space) like the easy going slower pace, the feeling of a lack of rules and reg's etc, has a dark flip side. When you need common sense regulation or justice, or integrity in legal issues that we take for granted in the UK, they just are not often there. Fine for a holiday, but for day to day living i'm not so sure?.  I guess it's what's important to each of us, and we all have the choice and should respect that in each other.

 "i don't recognise the picture painted by TJL either.  I'm sure in some rough or overcrowded areas this goes on but I think that could be said of any country. It sounds more like justifying a change of lifestyle to me, or not living in a reasonable part of the UK?

TJL

 If PC means not being racist, not being cruel to animals, having equal rights for women, having a minimum wage, having a regulation, legal and justice system based on at least some common sense etc etc, then bring on the PC!"

Goodstich,what part of the UK do you live in its sounds Euphoric!!!????, seriously though could you tell me what town you live in??

Hi georgia

Euphoric?, well i certainly didn't used to think so, i've always been very critical of the UK in the past and even suprise myself by being positive about a country with many known faults. It's all relative though isn't it.  Had I not found out the hard way the corrupt, unregulated and downright cruel system to humans and animals Spain has in many ways, I would probably still be be complaining about the UK's faults?.

Perhaps it's age?, perhaps i've been lucky in the UK?, but I've run my own business for 20 years with all the issues that brings, and I've bought, rented and sold commercial and residential property for the business and home, and have relied on the integrity of many people, which i've been able to do, mainly  through regulation and law. Of course i've had problems , but nothing that couldn't be sorted out in a reasonable time frame by those who know right from wrong!

I'm well aware of the UK's faults, but most of them can be avoided by being straight with people and using common sense, and using a body in place who's job it is to defend those wronged., not something i've found in Spain without having to resort to a lawyer (and don't start me on that one!!) 

I live in a large village just outside Northampton.

I didn't want to start a political discussion and agree that there probably are some ares left in the UK that are less affected by those things I previously mentioned. Tolerance was also said to contribute to your opinion and I agree, but living in the South East and working mainly in the London area there is only so much you can tolerate, what with overcrowded roads and public transport etc.

I would disagree that I am trying to justify my move as I always intended going but now I just want to go that much sooner .

I want a quiet life with less stress, warmer weather (rain or shine) and definitely less aggression and aggrevation. That may sound very simplistic but I can dream.