Security

             For what its worth,   I do not think that a permanent security guards covering the development 24 hrs a day is necessarily a good thing, it would always depend on how honest and dedicated the guards are, this would also depend how much they were paid.  This option is the most expensive route.

             The Ideal deterrent besides the ones mentioned by Davmunster and Max IE security cameras plus better locks. Is to have a security gate fitted at the entry into Don Juan,   I was told by a representative of Viva estates four & half years ago,  that this was supposed to be part of this upper class development, I guess not .  We have this type of entry into the large apartment blocks  where I currently live, it works well.   It does prevent vehicle access,  but I admit not access on foot, Its an option.

              Max will probably know if this is possible and how much it will cost.   All the best to all fellow Don Juanians? and a happy and prosperous new year.                                                                                                               

                                                                                                                                                       Bevron.

I agree with Bevron.  Gates at both entrances to the site whilst not fool proof would be a deterrant. Of course we then have the problem with opening devices to ensure they automatically are closed every time otherwise pretty useless.

However I think I would rather pay my community fees towards some form of security than a Sky box which I don't think is a prority at the moment. Yes I have Sky at home but I can live without English TV for a couple of weeks at a time. (I don't watch soaps anymore!)

With regards to the security issue here are my thoughts: There is only so much one can do. At the end of the day if somebody is determined to get in they will. 1. To have a full time guard as stated by Bevron may not be that effective as a) there is only so much ground he/she can cover b) how honest is he / she going to be c) if gangs with Kalashnikovs turn up what is a lone guard going to be able to do anyway? on top of that at a cost of €4000 per month or €20 per month per owner I think the maths do not stack up as this represents on average 20% of the community fees and if we are not careful soon the monthly community fees will double with €20 for this and €20 for that! 2. To have a fenced perimeter around the complex with automatic security gate at one or two entry points is a great idea but it still does not stop someone getting in especially with the automatic gates as most of them stay open far too long and allow more then ample time for someone to follow behind you. (This has happened in my friend's complex in Calahonda where it is secure gated and they have CCTV) a gang of Morrocans followed someone as they drove from town up to their apartment and as soon as they entered the garage (auto door) the gang followed them through and held them up at gunpoint!). 3. CCTV? Again if the gang do not show their face to the camera or have masks / disguises and have false plates / stolen car and then the camera isn't going to do much good! I think it would be far more effective to: A. Make sure all the communal & street lights (including the road at the back of Don Juan) are fully working and operational as these were not when I was there in October / November! B. Set up a neighbourhood watch (everyone looking out for each other) C. To do something about the ground floor levels of the blocks with the short walls which anyone can jump over. Perhaps to also have the secure gates (point 2 of above) giving the only point of entry to the complex. In either of these 2 items it is imperative that owners keep the gates shut (as quite often this is not the case in many complexes) as otherwise to have gates is pointless. Both of these items will involve a one of fee to owners and thereafter a small maintenance fee added to the community fee but it certainly would not be 20%. 4. For owners to ensure that they make their own properties as secure as possible. Max I have to differ with you on this one. In the UK we have dead locks fitted to the main doors and I remember once my mate locked himself out of the house we had to call a locksmith in the middle of the night he came and opened the door within seconds but he did state that my mate was lucky that the deadlock was not on (not possible as he had left the keys in the house anyway) as in this case even he would not be able to open / pick the lock. I don't know if these locks are available in the Spain but I think they should be. 5. Be street smart and be aware of your surroundings. 6. For those owners who are particularly concerned, install a professional alarm system in their apartments linked to the authorities at their own costs. Just my two cents worth!

Some interesting and divergent views so far! 2 brief comments. 1) Deadlocks in Spain seem to be surface mounted. We thought a mortice deadlock would be neater and brought one from the UK. Gordon said the door had 2 steel sheets embedded in it and it would be liable to split if we tried to "dig out" a hole to fit the lock. 2) The gates in Don Juan can be properly locked (so they can only be opened by a key. Many block's gates are open or pulled shut so they can be opened by putting your hand through and pressing the release switch - but what is the point in locking them at the moment when you can jump over the wall?

Hi i have just come back from don juan today and before i went i felt i would be scared as we are by the front gate and yes everyone does leave the gate open but we dont.We went out every time we saw the gate open and shut it.I must say the work men on site always used there keys and made sure they shut the gate after them.In my block it was the owners who left the gates open all the time.The low wall is a problem plus the door button at some blocks are easy to open as david has said.When we got to are apt there was a letter off a company fitting alarms to emergencies call centeres for 79euros and 10 euros a month.After my first day there i felt very safe as there was a lot of people around in are block and i think some are residents there and we got to meet everyone there.I have told people in our block when i am there i will check there doors and windows every day and have asked them to keep a eye on ours to everythink helps bye irene/peter

Just a note on the security systems (alarms) hooked up to companies who are supposed to respond, I was talking to someone in the security business and he said that when the alarm comes into their office that they leave it for about 15 to 20 minutes to respond so that the bugler's or who ever are gone as the security guards do not want to put their lives in danger. So its hard to know what system is the best.

I do think we should close off the low wall situation with nice ornate bars and a gate to the entrance.

Yes you are right  Davemuster we got a dead lock fitted to our door and when the lock smith was drilling through there was two sheets of steel in the door. We also got locks fitted on each window with a bar to slot in to the grove to stop the opening of each window and door we also got two major locks on the two gates on the patio entrance I am not saying it will work but hopefully it will.!!!!

It's clear that improving the security is going to incur costs either as an ongoing bill or as a once off cost for installing new equipment.  Ideally each block should have a self locking access door and the wall which can easily be got over should be closed off with suitable bars or glass structure so that blocks can only be accessed through the garage or entrance door.  As well access to Don Juan itself would need to be controlled. Some video cameras may also be a good idea. I really think a security consultant should be asked to make recommendations so that we can get  the best advice and obtain realistic costs and in the meantime  perhaps hold on to the security guard.

With regard to deadlocks,  I had thought that the existing door locks were in fact deadlocks when in the fully locked position.  Is this not the case?

This message was last edited by gericom99 on 12/19/2007.

Hi Gericom

The existing locks are deadlocked when in the fully locked position. The weakness is the barrel which can be broken and the deadlocks unlocked without breaking the door

Just read in this weeks Sur that due to the increased police presence on the Costa Del Sol gangs of burglars have to moved the bulk of their efforts inland and that the National Police and Guardia Civil are on the trail of the Easter European gangs!

The Eastern European gangs are after rich pickings - in the same addition of Sur a gang is reported to have scooped 60,000€ from a villa near Alhurin de Grande. I doubt if many Don Juaners have this kind of loose change lying around! These gangs also do not like communities like ours - it is hard to be sure which apartments are empty and they don´t want to risk breaking into an apartment when someone in the 1 next door is quietly phoning the police. For these reasons I do not think the risk from these gangs is high. However we are vulnerable to opportunists thieves who nip in and take your TV because you left the door open on a balmy night or who steal a handbag while you are unloading your car. At the AGM I will be in favour of seeing what we can do at the lowest cost to deter this type of thief.

Hi Davmunster, That's exactly what I was thinking.

I have had a new door lock fitted and was going to get a gate over the door but was told by the locksmith that the doors were really good and with the new lock would be very difficult to break in. Don Juan does look a lot more secure than I first thought it would.

This is some interesting info on a security camera which records onto a memory card like those used for instance, in digital cameras.

SD MEMORYCAM SECURITY CAMERA SYSTEM

Brand: Marmitek [SDMC2] £ 95.00 (£ 80.85 ex VAT) A great idea - this is an external colour security camera that records onto its own control box using an standard SD memory card! It neatly solves the problem of switching and control that you get with traditional cameras with VCR’s and also gives you the option of capturing stills or video footage. For example, you could use it to get a time and date stamped photograph every time sopmeone enters your property, or of course choose to have a video clip of selectable length and quality. A 2GB Sd card can hold up to 24,000 pictures or 3,200 10 second clips. The control box will play back the recordings from the SD card into a TV (std video output) or of course you can just put the card into a card reader on PC or MAC. It’s very easy to install and makes a very complete and affordable solution. Key features: • Guard your belongings and register who has been on your property at all times. • Record automatically pictures or short movies when motion is detected. • Easy to install and viewable anywhere using the SD card. • Produce reliable proof in case of calamity. • Record as many as 24,000 pictures (each picture is 640 x 480 pixel, qty based on a 2GB SD card). • Record as many as 3,200 events (an event is a 10 second clip at 5fps, qty based on a 2GB SD card). • Intelligent learning mode; disables recording during repeated movement. • Possibility of watching live pictures on your TV, sent by the camera. • Very suitable for keeping an eye on a property that is out of view, such as garage, horse stable, shed, driveway etc. • Can be expanded with a 2nd camera. • Camera suitable for outside use. • Camera has 5 IR LEDs for a clear image up to 1.5m in complete darkness. • Prevents recording images of repeated motion, using the intelligent learning mode. • A pair of normally open alarm contacts allow for external trigger to an alarm system or interface to X10 products to switch lights etc

For the last couple of months in a couple of papers I read about the National Police and Guardia Civil stepping up their presence and an increase in the number of officers on the Costa Del Sol so hopefully this latest bit of news in the Sur is correct and the risk to the DJ complex will be less. By the way compared to the other complexes which I have stayed at in the past DJ seems to have far more local Spanish residents (a few who seem to be permanent residents) again hopefully this may lower the probability of DJ being targeted. Some of the other complexes I have stayed at hardly had one or two if any Spanish residents!. Max I hope the gangs aren't reading these posts especially about the prospective number of millionaires on the complex! lol!

Speaking of security does anyone know if the street lighting in the communal area and the temporary access road in the back of DJ is functioning? As these were not when we were there. Having these lights working would be a big step towards improving security at DJ. Also just out of curiosity does anyone know if work has resumed on phase 3?

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Having any extra form of security is always a good thing so long as it is costs effective and does not add too much to the monthly community fees as I have stated earlier if we are not too careful a few euros for this and few euros for that and before you know it we will be paying double the original costs. It will be interesting to see what quotes and options the administrators come up with.