Dream or reality

Regarding the healthcare it is like asking 'how long is a piece of string'. We can only answer what it is like now not what will happen post Brexit. You are right that Spanish based private health insurance is not only cheaper but different. Some companies even off a policy where you remain at the age you are when you start. However the premium will still increase with inflation. It is possible to get a reasonable policy for under €100 p/m each. However you must read it very carefully to see what happens when you reach certain ages, if it will cover you for life, does it cover medication etc. U.K. based policies that cover you abroad are generally more expensive and generally don't cover medication for regular use. Whilst John down the pub might say just use the EHIC, this is only for emergencies and is only available for people visiting a country. Travel Insurance is the same and they tend to ask awkard questions when you try and claim!!

The best thing is when you are over here ask to see many different policies and read the small print. Don't buy the first one you look at. Also 'brokers' here seem to only offer 1 or 2 companies and not all of them. Good luck

Thanks Steone,that's the sort of figure that I was quoted by the realtor. If anything brexit may hopefully reduce the premiums, if more people are paying in it may reduce the charges. Who knows, thanks for the help, much appreciated

rick

Good luck with your decision Rick, very informative post, thanks.  

A friend moved to Marbella in his late 50's, he was a retired high ranking fire officer drawing a very good pension. He took out a 'private' contract with Marbella General Hospital, that he described as being very reasonably priced, however as he is as fit as a butcher's dog, has never has cause to test it, I just thought that this might be useful.

Good luck.

The only advice I can give you is rent first that way if you don't like the place you can move on ,another thing that you will have to get used to in holiday type locations is the vast amount of empty properties around you that people have bought for holiday homes ,when you read forums like EOS you tend to get the impression that every man and his dog from the UK have sold up and move to Spain ,in fact that could not be further from the fact ...........and that fact is what you are considering is very rare I have owned a holiday home in Spain for 10 years and would not say I was a expert on Spain like others profess to be on this forum the information I am giving you is a personal point of view good luck.

Windtalker, many thanks for your reply, I agree renting first has always been top of our priorities if the move actually materialises.

Thanks Brian

Just a couple of points:

"I also believe the correct way in obtaining first hand information is to ask people on forums such as this, who actually own properties in the area I have been looking at."

Absolutely, for information on specific developments or areas. But just be aware that for other non area-specific but very important things such as residency issues, healthcare, taxation etc., just be aware that anonymous individuals on forums are generally laymen with limited knowledge / expertise / experience, and you should always back up such research with official and or professional sources. We all have different experiences after all, so who's to say any advice I, for example, offer, is any better than what you may get from Tony down the Pub (@steone: who the hell is John?!)

that's the sort of figure that I was quoted by the realtor.

Of course you will be aware that the realtor (are you American?!) will give you the most optimistic figure. Good advice here to compare & shop around and check terms & conditions etc. carefully. Also, check into the "convenial especial" arrangements for you r area - whereby you can access state health care for a fixed fee. Well worth investigating IMHO.

If anything brexit may hopefully reduce the premiums, if more people are paying in it may reduce the charges.

Funny, I immediately think the opposite: when (if) Brits are no longer able to access state health care in Spain, surely the insurance companies will see an opportunity to increase premiums for them? Don't make the mistake of applying logic or British reasoning in Spain: after all, we have a government here that, when faced with huge losses of tax revenue due to the property market crash, decided to increase transfer tax on property transactions, thereby killing off even more of the dying market and reducung the tax take even further. Genius!

Thanks Destry, I have to admit my forward planning for my retirement was absolutely useless. The fact I only took an interest only mortgage out is testament to that. I don't have a great private pension unfortunately but thank you for you ur input and your wishes.

kind regards 

rick 

Morning Roberto, many thanks for your response, no I am not American it's just shorter to type realtor and everyone knows what they are. As I have said we are at the very start of our journey and advice is always accepted. How or whether we act on it is a different matter. A filtration will always be applied as this is a forum.

I can see your logic regarding the insurance companies and I had considered that this maybe the route they follow should this situation arise. Perhaps I am an optimist, we will just have to see the outcome.

Roberto:

What do you mean you don't know John from the pub? Well he is Tony's first cousin twice removed (once by the police!). He is the guy who gives all the useful/useless info to Tony. You must have seen him at the pub as he is the guy who drinks creme de menthe shandies without the umbrella in the glass.

Silly me - I know who you mean now. I think he usually introduces himself as Juan, though, and says "Oh-lah" to everyone!

Ola!

I would encourage you to rent first as others have. But I am going to go back to your comment about having to sell because your fixed rate is up in 6 years (and you are, I think you said, 51). I am in my 70's and have just paid off my mortgage in the UK having had a series of fixed rates over the years. Unless something odd happens to the economy you ought to be able to find new fixed rates up until you are 75 (More with specialist proividers). So you should have plenty of time for making up your mind. If you live in an area where you can rent your UK place out easily you may be able to pay the mortgage from the rental and live in Spain.

Golf resorts usually have you by the short and curlies. Community fees are whatever they want them to be and on-site shops are are overpriced.

I think, unless you actually love La Torre for some reason, that you will settle somewhere else if you rent for a while and as you say you want to asses the results of BREXIT before fully committing.

I will try again after 24 hours I would have thought I would be looking at loads of cheap Spanish power companies tariffs still waiting ? Right ive just taken this from my UK power compay,can you do me a favour and yourself one and put your Spanish bill on the forum,

Electricity
Tariff Name . . . . . . . . . . . . . Fixed 12 Crystal
Product Type . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Fixed Rate
Payment Method . . . . . Monthly Direct Debit
Unit Rate . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9.4000p/kWh
Standing Charge . 16.22p/day (£59.20/year)
Tariff End Date . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10 Aug 2017
Price Guaranteed Until . . . . . . . 10 Aug 2017
Early Exit Fee . . . . . £0.00 per fuel (inc VAT)
Estimated Annual Usage . . . . . . . . 4366kWh
Gas
Tariff Name . . . . . . . . . . . . . Fixed 12 Crystal
Product Type . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Fixed Rate
Payment Method . . . . . Monthly Direct Debit
Unit Rate . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2.6450p/kWh
Standing Charge . . 9.75p/day (£35.59/year)
Tariff End Date . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10 Aug 2017
Price Guaranteed Until . . . . . . . 10 Aug 2017
Early Exit Fee . . . . . £0.00 per fuel (inc VAT)
Estimated Annual Usage . . . . . . . . 7641kWhR

OK, I'll have a shot at it, although trying to understand my electric bill (no gas) and more to the point, trying to show direct comparisons to yours is doing my head in!

From my last monthly bill (1st-30th November):

Standing charges - 

Importe por peaje de acceso - 5.5kW x 38.043426 €/kW y año x (29/366) dias = €16.58

Importe por margen de comercialización - 5.5kW x 4 €/kW y año x (29/366) dias = €1.74

Total standing charge €18.32 (+IVA @21%), so annual standing charges come to €266.01

Energy consumed - 

Importe por peaje de acceso - 292 kWh x 0.044027 € / kWh = €12.86

Importe por coste de la energía - 292 kWh x 0.078947 € / kWh = €23.05

Total consumption charges €35.91 (+IVA @21%), so I reckon unit cost comes to approx. €0.15

In addition to this there is an extra electricity tax, and equipment rental, which come to another €3.54 (+IVA)

Total bill for 292 kWh is €69.90

Estimated annual usage 3,808 kWh

If you want to try and do the comparison with the UK bill, good luck! I think on the face of it it's obvious that an empty property will cost less in the UK than in Spain. Beyond that, I'll leave it to someone better at maths than me.

Is this any good ?  

There is something major you need to understand and that is the amount of power that you will use here compared to what one uses in the U.K. The cost per unit is higher in Spain and I believe a lot of Europe is higher than the U.K. However as it is a lot warmer here and also the length of daylight per day is longer that the U.K. you cannot make a direct comparrison between the two countries. I find that my energy usage in Spain is far less than what I used in the U.K. but my cost is not a direct equation.

It also depends on lots of factors like which side of the street you are on i.e. on one side it will be warmer in the winter thereby using less energy to heat your home whereas in the summer it will be hotter and one will use more energy in cooling the home, however on the other side of the street it is the opposite. It also depends what temperature you like the property in both summer and winter.

The bottom line is with most people here their overall energy costs are a lot lower than they paid in the U.K. Also the way of life here is different, more outdoors, so again a direct equation is not applicable.

One thing not mentioned is that with the slower pace of life and better weather the chances are that you will live longer. This means that if you are relying on a fixed sum of money it will have to last longer so don't sp[end all your money at the start of your life here.

I also notice that some posters are suggesting that you keep your U.K. property and not sell it now but wait until you have been here a year or so and then sell it. Here is a word of warning and that is if you are a tax resident in Spain and you sell a property anywhere in the world you will be liable for Capital Gains Tax whereas if you are a U.K. resident you will not be liable if the property is your main residence. Something else to concern you and to put into the mix.

Good luck

All good points, and why this age-old argument is largely pointless unless you can make a direct comparison: a near enough identical family unit (e.g. retired couple) living in a more or less similar property (e.g. 2 bed / 2 bath all electric apartment).

For what it's worth though, our electric costs for 2016 were €750 (couple, 2b/2b all electric apartment etc.). From newworld's example, UK combined electric & gas usage would have cost around €850 (if those figures include VAT - and using an approx ex-rate of 1.20) Without knowing what kind of property or family unit this is for, the comparison is meaningless - but the difference isn't so great that it's worth bickering over is it? It's always an interesting subject, and of course for the OP (of this and so many other similar threads in the past) very useful...but it's hardly a factor that going to make or break a move to Spain (or vice versa) on it's own. 

As I've said before, the difference in income tax could easily balance / cancel out any savings in cost of living in Spain for some (only for those who declare their income correctly, that is!)

As for the quality of life and longevity, I've seen far too many people succumb to the temptation of cheap ciggies and cheap & easily available booze to concur with there being any realistic chance of living longer in Spain. Inability to cope with and/or fear of state health services in a foreign language has also seen off too many to mention - not to mention the stress of living in Spain & dealing with the bureaucracy at times! So the advice to budget for your latter years is as relevant whether you intend to see them out in Spain, the UK, or wherever. Suffice to say, growing old anywhere sucks, but growing old in a foreign country with a lack of funds really sucks!

With regards to your last paragraph, again, good points, and I think the best advice is probably to not burn your bridges, rent first and also don't rush into comitting to becoming a resdient for tax purposes. Do your research, and use your head not your heart.

Thanks Steone, interesting about the tax issue. I will have to make sure that I check this out if we do get the opportunity to move there.