Starling Bank Euro Account

Alternatively, you should be able to use a TransferWise multi-currency account, which provides a Belgian IBAN for SEPA direct debits (so no address details needed in the direct debit initiation message).

Bear in mind, though, that the TW account is not a true bank account, so there is no FSCS, or equivalent, protection for any deposited funds. However, your funds are 'ring-fenced' from the business itself. For relatively small balances of a few hundred Euros, the risk of loss is probably acceptably low (IMHO).

TW doesn't levy any charges for accepting direct debit requests, but does add a small fee for making a SEPA transfer.

I agree with Marksfish that the problem does not lie with Starling.

Thanks free_bee and Marksfish for the replies. 

I do have a Transferwise account which I will be using to transfer money to Banco Sabbadel to avoid their 18 Euro fee and I appreciate that they are not a proper bank.

With regards to Starling I have not recieved an email as shown by Marksfish. Perhaps this is in response to my formal complaint that they recieved on Monday, I sought out the CEO's email address and have a reply from her staff. I didn't have to use my contacts in the payments industry.

As I used to say to companies before I retired " You may not own the problem but you are part of the Solution", when i was working with groups like 'www. acceptmy iban org' that exist to solve industry problems.

Starling has known for a long time about 'IBAN Discrimination' and also as was pointed out, would have kown about possibe problems at the end of the transition period.  

However, when a couplle of payments were not taken from my Starling Account that have been processing OK since I opened the account, I raised the Issue with Starling, and was told 'Insufficient Funds'. When it happened with other transactions, I was again told 'Insufficient Funds', When i got stroppy they then said it was due to problems with the Direct Debits.

My complaint is that this is something that they had fair warning of and when it happened they were unprepared. Hopefully now they will get a grip, join with their industry partners and start playing the Spanish Banks at their own game. 

I think you have a genuine complaint regarding the misinformation being given about insufficient funds. There is no excuse for that, I would be interested to know what information they based that reply on. A lot of banks have dedicated pages now about IBAN discrimination, they all seem to say the same thing though, it is the orignator's responsibility to ensure they have the correct information from the customer to supply to their bank, which appears to be be a full UK address now for GB IBAN numbers. If the local Ayuntamiento doesn't want to amend their forms, there isn't a lot that Starling can do about it and as we all know, Spain does things the way/ timeframe it wants to and not necessarily the right way. It is good news that Liberty Seguros now acknowledge they were in the wrong and collecting, hopefully others will follow rapidly.

I must confess, I was getting ready to change my direct debits to my Starling account so I could close my Sabadell account, bu this has made me stop in y tracks for the time being until things are running a bit smoother. I did pay my non res tax last month from Starling by bank transfer and the money didn't come back to me, so the hacienda aren't refusing cask from GB IBAN numbers.

Mark

The CEO of Starling Bank also sits on the board of UK Finance, a trade association that represents the UK banking and finance industry.

It was UK Finance that successfully applied to the European Payments Council (EPC) for UK payment service providers to continue participating in SEPA after Brexit.

I believe that UK Finance is currently the National Adherence Support Organisation (NASO) for UK participants in SEPA.

Perhaps UK Finance should be asking the EPC to relax the requirement for the payer's UK address to be included in the SDD collection data until the other SEPA countries have got their act together.

An update from Starling:

https://www.starlingbank.com/blog/how-to-defend-yourself-against-iban-discrimination/ 

A blog post dated 3rd February, still talking the problem down. 

I am a non-resident in Spain and have a spanish bank account but I was thinking of moving to Starling - thanks for all of this information it is really useful.

Can I just ask one quick question.  As an example if I wanted to do a transfer say once or twice a year of 3-4,000 Euros is it better to use an exchange company or use your Starling account internal transfer? 

I was wondering how this works if you used the exchange company straight into your Starling Euro Account - guessing the charges only from the exchange company? and if you transferred from your Starling GBP Account to your Euro does it work out cheaper?

Any help would be greatly appreciated in making the decision to open this account up. Thank you in advance

Personally I would recommend Transferwise. You get a multi currency debit card and best exchange rates. The Euro account will have a Belgian IBAN avoiding DD hassles.

KarenDyke £1000 put into your account this morning in Euros would be (after fees).......

Starling 1136.85€ (fee £4 included)   TransferWise 1137.47€ (fee £3.69 ??)

If the fee is added for TransferWise (never used, but that's what it looks like on their site), Starling is a slightly better conversion rate. 

macsco.

I think your figures are wrong

Transferwise live rate is 1141.49euros (fee £3.69) rate after fee 1137.28

Transferwise works out better

Many thanks for all information on Travelwise/Starling.

Can I just ask one more piece of advice....If I went ahead with one of these accounts is it safe to close my account with Ibercaja (so have no Spanish bank account) and get all my dd's etc. from out of the Travelwise/Starling for things like Rubbish/Water/Electricity/Community Charge etc.

I could transfer my money across either through Travelwise/Starling as a lump sum into their Euro account from my UK Travelwise/Starling account say once/twice a year to cover off my DD's and any expenses when in country (if I ever get there) and use their debit card (euro/gbp) to pay in country..

Does anyone do this ie. survive with a Travelwise/Starling card only and NO Spanish bank account?

Thanks in advance to you all.

KarenDyke I survive without a Spanish Bank using Starling/N26 combo, and pay all my bills from N26.

I found too many would not accept Starling GB IBAN, so instead of joining an action group or pushing against bureaucracy I gave up and opened a N26 account. With Spanish IBAN, accepted by all (except the Hacienda tax man).

Jarvi , figures not wrong, was unsure if fee was included with TW, and said so, you cleared that up, so within 1euro no difference.

Brilliant, thanks to you all for you help and advice..it has been most useful.

I guess my last question would be... if I have to do a one off large sum say 50K (which I do shortly to pay off my mortgage) would you advise using a one of currency exchange for this purpose ie. GC partners or something?  I am guessing doing this via the Starling/N26/Travelwise options may be more expensive......OR NOT?

Apologies for all the questions but I am trying to google some of this and there is no clear answer I can see :-)

Hi KarenDyke,

I have a Starling current account as my main account in the UK and a Starling Euro account for DD's in Spain, no issues with setting up for community fees, local town hall taxes or water.  I did have issues with Endesa not accepting a GB IBAN at the start, but got that sorted and then switched supplier to Bulb dot es for cheaper supply, I can send you a link for Bulb if you pm me.

I add up my DD's and divide by 12 and then each month transfer this amount from my Starling current account to my Starling Euro account, you can see the rate before transferring and I used to check it against TransferWise but there was only a few cents difference and the convenience of just transferring with Starling was worth it, doing this monthly tends to smooth out exchange rate fluctuations.  I also transfer a small amount each month for spending money when in Spain, then, via the Starling app, you can choose whether to withdraw money from your Euro or current account when using an ATM in Spain.  Cash withdrawals from an ATM are free with Starling anyway from your current account (as in no charges from Starling) and you get the MasterCard exchange rate on the day.  I tend to use Unicaja ATM's as there is no charge from them either for withdrawing euros using your Starling card.

Liberty Seguros would not accept the GB IBAN, but have said I can pay annually by just transferring the money for the policy, but now I have the IBAN discrimination information from Starling I will challenge them again when the policy is due for renewal.

hope this helps, Starling is a great bank and I have not had any major problems so would highly recommend.  

rumbletum

For a few reasons I have several bank accounts - I used to look after the finances of my elederly relatives and have quite a few stories of woe. I also am treasurer of a Motor Club and manage their accounts.

Looking at Starling, a friens has an account and it seemed to be a good idea to consolodate my accounts into Starling as it seems very good. Amongst laa this I have a Metrobank Account (which was created for an eledrley aunt then went into my name when she died) The big advantage is that they are 'open all hours' and have a branch locally. It's still good to be able to deal face to face. So good that I was going to move the Car Club accounts and my Buisness account from Natwest to them.

The big problem I haave with Starling and Metrobank is only having a single logonID. NatWest allows different LOGONID's for my Business Account and the Car Clubs Business account. However the Staling / Metrobank approach is one ID for access to all the accounts you have. SO I C't seperate my Business / Euro and Personal accounts not even by havong different emails addressess or phone numbers. Which is inconvenient - they don't seperate different legal entities which is my point.

I appreciate theis is a problem that not everybody will have.

I previously used the Transferwise APP which was ok to transfer money directly to my Spanish Account, but found the way Banco Sabbadell conduct themselves to be tiresome and even though ther is a Brit in my branch, very difficult to deal with.

The thing I liked about Starling is the speed of doing things, It's a bank so inter bank transfers in the UK are quick - not subject to delays like transferring money to/from Building Society Accounts. They are also ver quick to do transfer from my Sterling Account to the Euro Account (Instat Transfers) but I ran into the 'IBAN Descrimination' issuse very early on, ssomethig that they have not been pro-active on helping their customers with. It is in their interests to do so. As this thread proves.  

For my monthly Mortgage payments I will be routing them through Transferwise to avoid the Sabadell fee. I'm also interested in the N26 account but that's a German Account as opposed to the Belgian Transferwise IBAN route. I have read that Transferwise may have accounts with Spanish IBANS? N26 says it is a German IBAN and they have some colaboraation with Transferwise.

WIth regrads to a bulk transfer of money to a Spanish Account, there is a percentage charge so you could be paying much more than the minimum fee.

The actual risk is down to the amount of time that an organisaation holds your money - if you aare making a single payment I would suggest that the best exchange rate is with Transferwise with the use of a Belgian IBAN account means you are unlikely to get a charge from the Spanish Bank for recieving the money. BUt don't quote me on this!

Just a point of interest on the German N26 Bank.

As a German Bank they originally issued German IBAN's for Spanish accounts, they found that customers were frustrated that the Spanish would often object to this (wrongly so) but they came up with a solution that meant they did not have to change the Spanish psyche. They opened a Madrid office and offered Spanish IBAN's.

This is my part N26 IBAN ES89156326263932xxxxxxxx accepted by every entity I have offered it to.

masco,

Thanks for clarifying this. SO it's not only the UK IBANS the Spanish don't like. Borne out by the Internet Company I have just signed up with insisting on a Spanish IBAN.

Mike.

After doing some more research I think there are several strands to this.

1) Payments from GB Ibans in Euros to Spain where Banks like Sabadell are charging 18 Euros to receive funds. That is one issue

2) Whether a Spanish entity will accept a non Spanish IBAN for a direct debit. BTW this does not only affect UK residents other instances have been noted.

In my own circumstances I started being charged last year by Bankia for monthly maintenance. I began moving all my direct debits to Transferwise in anticipation. As it happened I challenged Bankia and got the charges reversed as they had not recognized an insurance I had with them, but continued with the DD transfer process nevertheless. Transferwise provides a Belgian IBAN number and I had no probs with Electricity, community fees etc. The one I had problems with was water, but I insisted that it is a European legal requirements that they accept a non-spanish Iban. Eventually they produced a word document to complete. Iberdrola is now even set up to provide a drop down box for country of identification of an IBAN number as they vary in length by country,

Now the only issue I have encountered is with the "Hacienda" in paying non-resident tax. Apparently they will  only accept a Spanish Iban for direct debit.   I had discussions with a friend who runs a business in Spain who was also looking into this. At the time we discussed N28 and at that time was not recognized as a "partner" by the Hacienda for payment of taxes. If N28 now uses Spanish IBANS this may now longer be the case.

It seems as ever with Spain most commercial enterprises are following the EU instructions, but as for the Hacienda who knows!

There is probably also post brexit confusion about supplying full address details for GB based Euro  accounts, as we remain a member of SEPA.

If anybody has any further information to clarify that would be helpful. I found the attached link quite interesting especially the comments.

https://www.europeanpaymentscouncil.eu/news-insights/news/brexit-1-january-2021-onwards-get-ready-end-transition-period

Un saludo

Juansheetisplenty a good sum up. Re Hacienda I have paid my 210 via a Spanish Bank for 20 year seemlessly, then found they would not accept N26 or Starling for a Direct Debit, even with the Spanish IBAN. My work around was to say I was paying from a foreign bank (Starling) and enter these details in the online form. This produces a reference which you have to include on a manual payment to Hacienda. I did all this in December, so hoping it has been allocated correctly. But a complete pain.

btw Hacienda say the Bank account must be in the taxpayers name, or will be rejected. Not sure if this is adhered to, but it got the wife to open a Starling account.

It's getting better But ---

Iberdrolla now have a drop down box for the country of origin of the IBAN

I won't let me input my Starling IBAN which begins GB45 SRLG as it doesn't like the SRLG bit.

If you add a correspondence address, it coesn't allow a UK address.

But I did manage to cancel payments from my Spansih bank account and they accept a transfer from my Starling account,

Mike.

I was quite happily paying all my regular Spanish bills (luz, agua, basura, IBI, etc) by SEPA direct debit from my Starling Euro account ... until it all fell apart on 1st January.

It seems that the Spanish banks did implement the changes that the EPC required of them (ie to treat the UK as a non-EEA SEPA participant from that date). They just didn't bother to tell their customers about the need to include the payer's UK address in direct debit collection data. Or perhaps they did, and the customer organisations didn't take any notice.

Either way, the main problem, as far as continuing to use a Starling Euro account is concerned, is that many of the larger organisations, such as the utility companies and the ayuntamientos, don't have the capability to capture and record UK addresses in their billing systems.

The system modifications needed for them to do that aren't going to happen overnight, if, indeed, they happen at all. So, we unhappy Starling account holders are going to have to find alternative ways to settle our bills in Spain, at least in the short to medium term.

My main reason for switching to Starling (from CaixaBank) was that I no longer wanted the hassle (unpredictable changes to Ts & Cs, unexpected charges, etc) of maintaining a bank account in a 'foreign' country. So, for me, the N26 route isn't a preferred option.

I'm therefore going to try the TransferWise multi-currency account idea. Although not a true bank, TW is based primarily in the UK, which makes me feel more comfortable about using its services. TW's provision of a Belgian IBAN should allow me to switch my direct debits from Starling without too much difficulty.

Fingers crossed.