I'd like to second that from Jackie, Polaris are crap at customer relations and without the efforts of Maria most of us would not know what is happening.

Many thanks Maria, Happy new year (I hope).

John

A pleasure.  We all do hope to keep having good health to keep helping in EOS.

Happy new year! Let´s wait for the best because it is possible.

http://www.simplynetworking.es/news-1926-31-polaris_world_seeks_court_protection_from_creditors.html
or http://www.simplynetworking.es/news-1927-31-polaris_world_crisis-_what_the_spanish_papers_are_saying.html

a link re simply network article

iam pretty sure that for people who have completed the main down side if polaris can not resructure there debt will be that the facilities promised will be put on hold until a buyer is found and the market picks up also it is more than likly that bar and resurant will close. The security and maintance is all done by a seperate company so life will go on as normal in that area, but my thoughts go out to anyone that has not yet completed and have paid a percentage of there money already, i can only say that polaris resorts are all top class resorts and i think that the banks will step in and either manage it or sell it to a venture capitialist group who in the long run will see that the best way to recover or make any money is to go ahead and provide the facilities promised. well lets hope so good luck one and all

The article written Vegamedia.com says the PW owe large amounts of euros to local municipal councils of Murcia. Torre-Pacheco council is owed 4 million euros relating to a planning agreement for the Mar Menor resort. They have offered the main PW head office building in Balsicas as collateral  in order to extend the loan. The building is already mortgaged. A PW director is quoted as saying that PW were experiencing problems with short term liquidity. There has been significant staff redundancies already and PW staff say that there is real air of crisis within the company.

It will be interesting to see the goverment stand-point on all of this .

As yet PW are only giving themselves breathing space- they havent gone to the wall yet. Even if they do little will change for the people who have completed, its those caught in a deposit hole on properties not yet built on other developments that have a more major problem. I dont even see that the bar and restaurant will close if bankruptcy happens in fact selling off the Al Kasar may give a it a boost and get more units open. I understand that the Inter continental hotel chain are in charge of the sports boulevard and the proposed club house with hotel complex- so that could still go ahead albeit Intercontinental may want to hone down their plans in view of dropping numbers of tourists but the golf break market is still doing well across europe

I'm told the golf course is open for business and trade is regular throughout the day, without advertising just by word of mouth so far- another viable concern. The supermarket is owned by UPPERs anyway. So that leaves the further golf courses and the Oasis- always part of a 10 year project.

Of course PW wont be able to build further properties- but CdA is pretty big already- if they stay in business they'll have to consolidate not expand. If I'd put down a deposit somewhere I'd now be looking to swop to a built property as I cant see depositors on the top of the creditors list and I'd come away with something.

The biggest problem is for private sellers as this news will disturb prospective purchasers and of course you cant say the CdA development will have all the expected facilities because the future is now unknown. Those expecting to rent out probably wont have any more problems than they had last year.

The thread 'banks to create social housing' on the main forum makes interesting reading. Is this a way forward with bankrupt stock? 

There's no alternative other than to sit tight and see what materialises- but they may hold off creditors with revised financial plans. Some of the general financial news is of a slowly improving economy. I bet Jack Nicklaus is still wanting the other golf courses in his name to to go ahead and the Lorca theme park news, the rail link and airport may mean there will be govt help for PW as this all brings in continued revenue for the region

This message was last edited by TheQuietMan on 29/12/2009.

 The main objective the government has for this measure is to mobilize the estate market and offer oportunities to sell and buy through low prices and subsidied financiation.

Developers, Banks and individuals can turn their porperties into social houses and find a buyer within the list of applicants to social housing. These people have enhanced access to financiation, also protected and monitorised by the government.

You may like to read this other two posts:

Number  201 and Number 202

Best,

Maria

I'm asking these couple of questions from curiousity not from a desire to scare monger- what would happen to the tv services, internet and rubbish collection, gardening etc in the event PW did go into insolvency? I understand some are franchised out but not all and even so are the franchises affected by bankruptcy, does anyone know what the position would be - Maria?

I'm actually hoping that the desire to retain PW as a developer in the region is so strong from the local financiers they are able to renegotiate their loans and the very slow improvement in the financial markets is just enough to keep their head above water.

 Most probably. The commun goal of every insolvency protection proceeding is to keep the life of the company.

Id say what is going on here is that polaris is getting rid of all the baggage they are carrying.Polaris have many companies which are all seperate id say. So if i was a supplier to Polaris I would be scared. You might think you were suppling Polaris world and you are guaranteed your money but you are actually suppling a company set up by polaris which can fold in the morning and leave you sitting. Id say they have all the banks fooled the same way along with local councils. They pretend its all in the big pot but its far from that.ITS ALL SEPERATE COMPANIES.

Condado de alhama is a profitable resort to them,they had it all more or less sold before the crash. If its a separate company its probably one on the strongest within the group and will sit pretty when all these other companies they own walk from what they owe and leave all the suppliers high and dry.

Would you finish a golf course in the past few months if you knew you were going to go bust. Being an owner on many properties on condado I think its great news. Condado will plough on you will find. The next 2 courses will be built and the hotel will be a goldmine when finished in 2011. Polaris condado will remain strong and it will be completed. Its grand as it is if you ask me.They have to revise their policy of having to sell 60% of a phase before they start it down to just release 50 properties,sell them and complete them. The planning laws need to be revised to accomadate this also.

If the pull out of the clover I'll take it. I can guarantee live music 365 days a year. if i break even every year i'm happy.Bring on Boney M and Kool and the gang,they have played the other resorts.

Maybe im wrong but id like to review my thoughts in six months.I'd say i'm right. I have done the same thing in Ireland myself 2 years ago. It works a treat.

Ace

The initial main problem, if Polaris goes under. Would be their non-payment of their share of the resorts Community Charge.

This will have immediate impact on next year's CC.  In Terrazas alone they owe about 60% of last year's CC, so a lot of bad debt sitting about all the resorts.

So all owners will have to pay more CC next year.........

I think your'e right about all the different companies, I know when we completed all the documentation etc was not to Polaris world it was to the resorts, so I assume these are the companies, and Condado  is a company in itself. As far as telecoms bin collections etc, we as owners are paying for them in our maintenance charges so I don't see what difference that would make if PW went under.

Good news if PW pullout of running the bar etc, I'm sure someone else could run it and be a damn site cheaper than PW. But all thses things are already built and running so that won't change. As far as communiity charges going up I thought a majority of the properties had sold, so I can't see our charges increasing that much.

I think with Polaris out of the picture, this could open up El Kasar/Foro to others, which would create competition and lower priced food/drinks.

Although I really didnt mind the prices in the Polaris Bars and restaurants as they were quality establishments, with great deco and service. I hope the place doesnt end up looking like Camposol Sector B, which could easily happen if these bars are offered to anybody.

I also dont think the second/third golf course will be built any time soon, if ever. The revinue created from the golf course is not sufficient to cover the building and upkeep costs. The only reason Polaris builds Golf Courses are to help sell properties and there is still plenty of room around the existing course for new buildings.

If building does ever recommence at Condado, they will build around the existing course, till all the land is built on, only then will they consider another course.

I also think the Oasis will not happen in the next 10 or 15 years, I think they the Foro is so large, that even if there property count on Condado doubled, there would not be enough people to fill the bars and restaurants in there.

Maybe someone should give Donald Trump a call and see if he wants to buy the place!!  After all, the halfwits up here in Aberdeen are giving the bloke a seriously hard time over a couple of sand dunes he wants to remove in order to create 'the greatest golf course in the world'.  Talk about looking a gift horse in the mouth.........

What's the latest word on the street from the people who live on Condado..?? I guess for the people who have completed that not a huge amount will change other than more expensive community charges?

I stayed on La Isla around 3 weeks ago and it was absolutely dead. Considering La Isla has 380+ properties I only saw around 6 cars. I am wondering how much of La Isla is actually sold?

i wonder if ocean finance  can help?

Brilliant !!!!! 

 Ace, if you did screw all your creditors in Ireland, maybe you could provide them with holidays in your many properties and free drinks at your live music bar.... ;)  Having been on the wrong end of this type of action it isn't a noble act...

Happy New Year everyone!

what a brilliant trick that polaris are now getting people who bought into phases (which are now not going to be started) to transfer to a completed property in an emergency rather than wait and get their deposit money back otherwise they are going to loose their deposit to the liquidator. So instead of polaris owing them 40k back the customer now has to fork out the balance money  to close out on a completed one.POLARIS WIN AGAIN.

This has really got the ball rolling for them again. If they had not have done something like this they could have gone burst

Ace

Alhama gardener,it was not by choice the way it fell for me in Ireland>it was banks that I was dealing with that took the hit but looking back if I was in a situation like it again it would be the option I  would choose as the banks leave themselves wide open for this carry on

We have to remember that PW haven't gone into insolvency proceedings they have asked for time to sort their finances and for creditors to have to wait 3 months before taking action. They might be able to tidy a lot up in 3 months.

Besides, Its not a trick on would be purchasers. Afterall if you have paid a deposit then you have made an informed choice to buy a Polaris property and very few people can be niave about property development and the off plan system today so they know they may not get what is on the plans 'buyer beware' as the saying goes. Things can and do happen but the recession has compounded that now. But I think PW seem to have pulled out all the stops with CdA to get it to a viable point- not sure why when they have other resorts with things promised and not built. Essential things like the town centre at  del Alamo. But if this action prompts an upturn in PW's business than thats just the way it is. There is no deposit money sitting in bank vaults those are gone before they hit the safe. Commissions and debt clear them early on, developers always use the money they get in to clear previous debt. I'd be looking to move to another key ready property too in this current climate, there's plenty available.

Even if a Bankruptcy happens and then there is clearance for deposits to be paid back you cant get blood from a stone and may have to wait for years as individual depositors are way, way down the pecking order. Thats not scaremongering its the obvious truth and at least the purchaser has something 'concrete' from the situation if they swop to a key ready property. It might not have been a first choice but it doesnt mean it can't be a good choice.

In the end these people have already chosen to buy a Polaris property and they are now still able to go ahead with this plan rather than have the fear and incertainty. I know the exact facilities might be delayed or not happen but that could have been a decision in a off plan situation anyway. Its not so long ago CdA thought they'd have Foro and Agora shopping centres- PW just chose to change that- joy of buying off plan. We transfered rather than wait for the golf suites and it was a good move- probably the best in terms of what we now have.  I was a reluctant convert but I'm pleased with the property and if I can say that after this past year then I reckon many others will be just as pleased to finally get their property whether its the original choice or not. If PW can keep their head above the watermark then we stand a much better chance of more of the expected facilities happening than we have done up to date.