The current situation

I recently received an e.mail to say that banks are not giving mortgages for La reserva de Marbella property and that prices are falling all the time at La Reserva.

Can anyone comment on this.  Is it Fact.

Hi Owengoonan

Please be very wary of the intentions of some of the mailers on this forum.  Some are hell-bent prophets of doom with hidden agendas who are desperately trying to do anything they possibly can to destroy the confidence of already worried investors.  Some of the rumours (and they are just rumours) that I hear or read are so ridiculously innaccurate and / or outdated that they barely justify a response.  I understand, however, how plausible they can seem to owners who live away from the area most of the year and  I can also imagine how they must inspire the owners on the negative side of the fence, but it is vital that these claims are treated with little respect until substantiated.  Also, banks only grant mortgages subject to status and will often reject unsuitable applications on differing grounds.

I know for a fact, as I have said many times on this forum alone before now, that banks most certainly are granting mortgages on La Reserva de Marbella (subject to status) and that property prices are generally holding their own in a market that is currently going through a very difficult time and is rather slow.  Admittedly, the market now favours the buyer as some investors who had no intention (or means) of completing on their properties when they placed their deposits some years ago, are now desperately trying to off-load their apartments at any price that may recoup at least some of their initial 30% payment.  This scenario is supplying the market with some absolute giveaways and is happening all along the coast - not just on our development.

The long-awaited elections are almost upon us which will hopefully lead quickly to some much needed stability and confidence in the leadership and to the settlement of licence applications on all 30,000 properties irregular to the PGOU86 in Marbella, once and for all.

For the record, I have mortgages on my properties in La Reserva de Marbella.   However, I will again walk round the banks in Marbella, as soon as I can, to see which of them are willing to grant mortgages (subject to status) on La Reserva de Marbella and post back my findings in due course.

This message was last edited by kenny e on 5/16/2007.

i fully agree with kenny e that there are two many doom and gloom merchants. The facts are that Malaga airport is expanding , the high speed rail link to Madrid nearly complete, investment in rail link along the n340 planned and ring road to link up urbinsations see pguo at marbell.es.

Yes the government has pulled the plug on the irregular activites of majors, lawyers,developers and many more but this will lead to a new dawn for the area. Spain is still the most preferred holiday destination for norhern europe. The developers have been greedy and there is an oversupply but in the long run we have a quality built complex in the marbella post code and the market will bounce back.

We have just had a great weekend at our appartment, met a swedish guy on holiday renting in lareserva and said how fantastic the place looked and what agreat time he was having.

best wishes james

This message was last edited by jamesyvonne on 5/16/2007.

Hi all,

We have just taken up residence in Manzana 3 Block 1, everything looks good, the hill is still as steep, but you can get used to it. It is a pity that the lower part of the raod is still in a bad condition, won't do the tyres much good.

I agree with the sentiments of Kenny and Jamesyvone, things can only get better if we sit tight.

Adio

John

On a recent trip to the Marbella & Mijas area we decided to see if it would be possible to see our 'investement' - i.e. the property we signed to buy off plan about 4 years ago.

The website seems to have some differing opinions on the quality of this development.
The reason for this would appear to relate to which Manzana you have as this is key to the size of your particular development. Also any previous experiences of similar develpments in other parts of the world will colour your expectations of this large scale building. The photos already on the website may refer to different Blocks and give misleading impressions.

About an hour before sunset we did a photo tour of Reserva - primarily to see Manzana 3 Block 7.  Fortunately security does not seem to be high on the site priority at the moment as two ways in were open to us. We were able to walk around the whole of Manzana 3 Block 7 although we could not enter into any apartment - just the communal areas. There are 11 photos now posted on the website.

Manzana 3 Block 7 ground floor appears to be around 10% occupied with even a few families at home. Conversation or perhaps the radio or tv could be heard although none in English. We did not have time to try and meet with any residents.

We had a walk around the entire top floor of Manzana 3 Block 7 and not one of the apartments had been occupied. Although we did not have time to walk around the other floors there did not appear to be any occupied units there either. So total block occupancy seems to be at best 5%. Without having a Habitation Licence the legal position is unclear.

The whole impression is one of a detention camp with guard posts at each corner! The development of Manzana Block 3 is a long U shaped back to back block with a long narrow courtyard up the middle. The walk to the pools is quite a long one for anyone near the closed end of the U.

Walking around the remainder of the site we did see some occupancy on other Manzanas - perhaps they have the required Licence in place.

The general appearance of the site looks like it has been let go for 6 months to a year with some maintenance problems having appeared, weeds growing through pavements, and the gardens looking in need of a lot of attention.

We took many photos and also some of the pools and Jacuzzis. The grassed areas between pools and Jacuzzis were very wet and boggy. The Jacuzzis being at ground level had a lot of 'stuff' at the bottom - grit and vegetation I think but they did otherwise look clean and cared for.

On the plus side anyone who has Manzana 4 Block 2 looks to be well set up - a small unit with it's own pool.

Hi br,

All Manzanas are in an identical situation regarding the licences and completion is perfectly achievable to anyone in a position to do so, with the licence still pending from the Junta de Andalucia.  Unfortunately, a large proportion of investors placed a deposit and legally bound themselves to a property on the development some years ago with no intention (or means) of completing whatsoever.  These properties are most likely the vacant ones that you write of, the owners of which are either trying to sell on quickly, or burying their heads in the sand and ignoring the legal obligations contained within the contract signed at the time of paying the deposit.

Security is currently contracted to one of the most respected firms on the coast (LIP) and is 24/7.  The costs of security and indeed to the maintenance of the entire development (gardening, general maintenance etc) is paid from a community budget,  funded by the community fees which are to be paid by the community owners (i.e. apartment owners).  Unfortunately, as mentioned above, a proportion of the owners are yet to complete and so community funds are yet to be paid by them at all (these fees are being charged on a daily rate as in the terms of the contract and will remain payable by the named owners on the day of completion or sale to a third party and are charged fromthe day the apartment was officially completed (latest June 2006)).  As more owners complete and so pay their community fees up to date there will be more money available to maintain the development accordingly and make it self-sufficient.  There may then also be enough money to pay for extra security staff and / or cameras, communal gardeners, maintenance workers etc.

The impression you give of maintenance being ´let go for 6 months´ seems a little harsh given that the weather here most recently has been of high winds, thunder storms and torrential rain followed by bright sunshine and high temperatures - perfect weather for vegetation growth and pool muddying!  The gardeners have been working daily all year over the whole development to keep everything to a high standard and, as stated above, are in shorter than perfect numbers as they are paid by the community which is owed money by incompleted investors.  The pools in my area were cleaned and chlorined most recently last Friday and the lawns were cut again this morning.

Finally, whilst Manzana 3 Bloque 7 is the largest on the development, the views that the apartments enjoy in the majority of the Bloque are quite breathtaking, with uninterrupted views to accross to the mountains and / or the golf course and the sea.  The ´long narrow´ courtyard in that Bloque is beautifully stocked with young shrubs and plants, lights and benches to rest on.  On a hot day, it provides perfect respite from the heat and sun.

I have completed on several apartments in various areas of the devlopment without problem.  The only complaint that I have is of those investors who have yet to complete and so pay their community fees, who then jump on websites complaining about about a weed they spotted gowing in one of the gardens when they were snooping around peoples private property listening to whatever they could hear. 

I wonder ´br´ have you completed yet?  Are your community fees paid to date?  If so, then any complaints that you have regrading dirty pools, weeds etc can be raised at anytime by contacting the Administrator on 952602585.  They are very helpful, speak English and can ensure a most prompt response to any  notification of a problem.

If you have not completed, or your community fees are not paid to date, then you are in no position to complain whatsoever, as you are contributing to the very complaints that you have and should be largely ignored.

Hi Br

I fully agree with the last post from james 123. We are very pleased with our appartment in Manzana 3 block 7. Our appartment looks over the large pool with a view to the sea and evening sunset. Your criticism of the development is quite unfound, the gardens are new and need to develop. We have had craftsmen working in our appartment who have said that they have rarely seen such quality workmanship in a new build. We only had a about two things on are snagging list to be fixed and these were sorted out quickly. i have found the office very helpful in any enquiry we have made. We have now had our appartment for nearly a year and have had many happy days there.

Until the doubters and moaners complete, the community is doing a very good job with limited resources. May i take this opportunity to reiterate the need to complete to enable the community to function in accordance with the legal contact that you all signed in the beginning.( you can't work a car without petrol!)

best wishes

james   ps i note your pictures are taken at dusk i have many when the sun is up that show the complex in a different light!!

This message was last edited by jamesyvonne on 5/24/2007.

I have completed on several apartments around the development and I am very happy with the standards held in all areas - as are the long-term tenants that live in them.  A friend of mine is hoping to complete on an apartment within the next week (most likely tomorrow) at which point the community fees owed to date, as james 123 has said, will be paid in full at the notary office.  The longer owners take to complete, the bigger the amount for the community fees will be.

As jamesyvonne says, the community is doing a very good job with limited resources.  I´m sure as more owners fulfill the contracted duties to sign or sell on, it stands to reason that the community will benefit from these long overdue resources and grow to look even more fantastic in the future - after all the development is not yet 1-year old.

Some owner friends recently attended an AGM for their Manzana and a motion was agreed that LEGAL ACTION is to be taken on all owners whose community charges are not paid up to date.  Hopefully this might bring enough money into the community pot to pay for some extra security who will in turn prevent the likes of br from prying into peoples homes.

P.S.  As unbelievable as it may seem br, it is most common that television and radio programmes in spain are broadcast in the spanish language.

P.P.S.  br -I would be very interested to see your reaction to learn of someone creeping around your grounds and then posting their findings on the internet if you accidentally left your gate open at your home residence.

 

This message was last edited by kenny e on 5/24/2007.

Without wanting to start a war here; it is interesting that both James123 & Kennye state "I have completed on several apartments.." at La Reserva.  You are both obviously very worried about your investments & rightly so.  But please remember that no reputable lawyer will advise anyone to complete on a property without the correct licences being in place, so attacking those who do chose not to complete is totally unwarranted. 

I am not worried about my investments at all.  Why should I be?  My payments are up to date and I am not going to be sued by the developer.  Nor am I throwing further thousands of Euros more to my lawyer in a ridiculous attempt to sue the developer for my money back.  Nor am I accruing charges for my community fees which are chargeable from the date that the apartment was completed.  Nor am I accruing interest on my outstanding debt to the developer from the date that the apartment was completed. 

Worried?  I don´t think so.  Try ´very satisfied and optimistic for the future´.

Suzie,

It is laughable for you to suggest that you know my state of mind based on one written sentence.

James.

We have completd on our apartment and enjoy our time there.  We are not worried about the lack of licences and have complete d to enjoy our apartment and lives and save money as things are sorted out in marbella town hall.  We have friends on other developments in the same situation and they havent been able to complete because the information given by the developers there is not enough. and the building quality is no where near as good as ours. All the informationm that we have seen leads us to believe that a licence will be issued one day at which time if we hadnt compkleted we would be faced with huge costs and not have enjoyed the times we have had at the apartment in the mean time. the development is well designed and maintained by hard working people and some of our neighbores have completed but not moved in yet so it could be that the empty aopartments that br has seen are completed but not moved in to.   When all the apartments are filled and the community charges are being paid by evrybody the whole development will be one of the nicest in marbella. This might take a bit longer than we hoped but we see people moving furiture in every week and estate agents cars are on the development evry day.  12 months ago people couldnt get a mortgage and people couldnt complete because of everything, now that is all diffrent and with the elections on sunday maybe licences will start to be issued again soon.   Stay for a few weeks on the development and you get to see that things are very good here and very positive things happen almost every day and as kenny e says the development is not even 1 years old yet so things arent running properly yet.

It is an important point that very happy owners have made by drawing a comparison from LRdM to other developments without a licence is that all processes legally necessary to be fulfilled in order to be granted a licence have been met in full by Grupo Peñarroya for LRdM and therefore most likely be granted a licence in due course.

When completing on a purchase on LRdM the water contract and the electricity contract are taken off in the name of the developer for construction works and signed at the notary as being contractually assigned to the new owner.  This would not be possible if the licences had not been correctly applied for by the developer.  A good example of this hideous situation is Banana Beach, Marbella Centro.  The ´owners´ there do not have contracts in their name and are still running off construction electricity and water.  At the beginning of Operation Malaya, Banana Beach was courdoned off by Police tape and the owners were not allowed into their homes and the development featured heavily on a daily basis on national television news bulletins and chat shows.  None of this ever happened at LRdM and even Banana Beach now appears to have had it´s residents allowed to return.

Suzie is partially correct in her belief that ´no reputable lawyer will advise anyone to complete on a property without the correct licences being in place´.  However, it wouldn´t have taken too much research by any  ´reputable lawyer´ to discover that all licence applications have already been correctly submitted and that to sue would be quite futile.  My most reputable lawyer (and those of my neighbours) agreed that a licence application rejection would be ´very unlikely´. 

It is also interesting that those ´reputable´ lawyers (one of whom was heavilly promoted by members of this forum around 12 months ago, but whom has since gone very quiet (coincidentally, as have those members promoting the firm)) wanted thousands of euros up front to make a case - I am of the mind that if litigation success was to be so cut and dried, it would have been based on a ´no win, no fee´ basis.  I will be interested to learn of any progress and total costs so far from anyone who chose this option.

Owners are completing every week on LRdM as we all legally bound ourselves to do so.  We also agreed to pay community charges so that the community could be managed and maintained correctly for us to enjoy our time there as well as securing our investments financially.  The only flaw that currently exists in the whole plan is that of the speculators who had no intention of completing when they paid their deposits and who are temporarily succeeding in making things fianancially more difficult for the majority of us by not paying the community charges (I suggest ´temporarily´ as legal action is being taken against them).

Hopefully decisions can be made soon. In the meantime enjoy your summer.

The Junta de Andalucía has announced that planning responsibility will be returned to Marbella Town Hall from 16th June, once the new Corporation has been formally constituted.

The Junta de Andalucía’s councillor for presidency, Gaspar Zarrías, gave the news in a press conference on Tuesday after the regional government’s weekly meeting. He also said that Marbella’s new local development plan, the PGOU, delivered by the team commissioned for its design to the Junta’s public works department last week, will be handed over to Marbella Town Hall on the same day as planning responsibilities are returned.

The woman voted in as the new Partido Popular Mayor of Marbella, Ángeles Muñoz, has meanwhile announced that her new planning councillor will be the lawyer, María Alba Echevarría.

She told journalists that the planning department will be managed just like any other area at the Town Hall and will be given no special importance over other areas.

Marbella Town Hall has been run by a Management Committee since the Cabinet decision on 7th April last year to dissolve the Corporation following dozens of arrests in the Malaya corruption case. The main figure in the case is Juan Antonio Roca, former planning assessor to the Town Hall.

More than one year on, the arrests now number more than one hundred.

(The article that canavant refers to can be found at:  http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publish/article_10698.shtml).

Further to canavants post and from todays edition of Sur in English:

Planning powers

The Junta de Andalucía has announced that it will return planning powers to Marbella when the new council led by ángeles Muñoz (PP) takes over on June 16th. The regional council took over control of the PGOU (town development plan) after the start of the Malaya corruption case. The Andalusian Parliament ruled that the Junta would be able to retain the powers for up to three months if they deemed it necessary after a new council was elected. However they have decided not to exercise this right and have stated that instead the Junta will work alongside and support Marbella in making up for ‘lost time’ during the GIL administration years.

http://www.surinenglish.com/noticias.php?Noticia=10696

just read this link on line in the surinenglish    http://www.surinenglish.com/noticias.php?Noticia=10712  looks hopefull for the future. Have you heard the latest podcast. it is refreshing to here some positive news. i gather they are now building a new railway terminal at malaga airport, with such investment in the future i am sure the storm will pass. Any news of agm date yet for manzana 3. best wishes to everyone. ps have you installed  sky yet and any experiences to date?


This message was last edited by jamesyvonne on 6/2/2007.

...and people say that I misinform people...

http://www.surinenglish.com/noticias.php?Noticia=10748

I installed sky manzana 4 bloque 3 bought freesat card recieved sky 1 sky news cnn reality zone and a bunch of shopping channels but couldn't get bbc or itv channels, then brought card from uk can now get channel 4 but still no bbc or itv.

Thank You Kenny E for this information and for all your help and advise over the past year.  Its great news for us all after all the hassle over the past 2 years.  A new dawn has broken.