Buying & Owning a car for a non-resident

Hi,

Very interesting thread as i would like to buy a car as a non resident. Gus appears to know something about this matter, but can anyone confirm the medical issue. If this was the case then it would probably be a step too far for me, Its not a health issue but just another hurdle to jump and yet another expense to be budgeted for.

To overcome any language barrier would a UK, or indeed respective EU national medical certs for be acceptable.

Guslopez,

Can you give me a link to the trafico website that confirms that you need this medical?  Also a link to the court case would be good.

Hi Sanchez, no not to the trafico website ( I only go in there when I'm desperate! ) but this is from Brian Dellers updated book  Motoring in Spain. He's red hot & always spot on regarding traffic law.

EU DRIVING LICENCES IN SPAIN - Medicals

New laws have been recently introduced and these state that if you hold an EU driving licence, you need to hold a medical certificate, the same as a Spanish national. For drivers aged between 18-45, your medical examination is every 10 years. From 45-70 years, every 5 years and for 70 years of age upwards, every two years. If you are caught for ANY driving offence and your medical examination is not current, you will be deemed to NOT HAVE a driving licence.

 The medical examination is a very simple procedure and most private medical centres carry them out. Costs vary but an average cost would be 30-40 euros.

http://www.idealspain.com/Pages/Information/DrivingSpain.htm

The court case was about 2 years ago & widely reported in the Costa Blanca news. The lady concerned was from The Alicante area & was in no way to blame but  was found to be liable as she didn't have the cert. Even the Judge sympathised with her. Hope this helps . I didn't bother to keep the article at the time as I thought it would be widely publicised but wasn't & is now starting to come to light as the trafico have to get some money in to fill the gov. coffers & far more of the officers appear to be aware of he need for the cert. now.

Hi, raff, There's nothing too hard about the medical. Round here it's just blood pressure & can you see the bottom line on the eye chart. In some other areas they ask you to do a co-ordination test which is basically like the old fairground test of maneouvering a metal ring along a bent coathanger without setting the bell off! lol. It costs here, 28e & you just have to find a  'Center de reconocimientos'.

 The more I read the more I get put off buying a car in Spain. No wonder there are so many English cars driving around. Makes me think this has to be an easier route to having a car in Spain. I've even heard you do not need to take it back to the UK each year if you are a non resident. Fact of Fiction?

Are car repairs more expensive in Spain than the UK?

Kevin

Hikev2006n, Her's the answer to that one from the DVLA yesterday, which I needed for a query on another site.

Hi ******, I e-mailed the dvla with your query re; leaving the car in Spain & bringing it back to mot it & they replied with the following.


"It appears that the vehicle will be taken to Spain and only brought back to the UK to obtain an MOT. Your acquaintance is not able to keep the vehicle registered in the UK under these circumstances if it is being kept abroad."

The following information will be useful to your acquaintance.

"It may be helpful if I explain that, if you are taking your vehicle out of the country on a permanent basis (over 12 months) you must notify us immediately of the vehicle's intended export."

I then asked the question regarding what the situation was if the vehicle was taken out of the UK whilst remaining taxed & mot'd ( being brought back to be mot'd ) if the owner still had a UK residence. In addition I asked what was the situation re: motorhomes that stay out of the country for over 12 mths. only returning for mot's. Here is the reply.

" I can confirm that all vehicles, if taken outside the UK for more than 12 months, should be notified as exported, regardless of whether the keeper still has a UK address."

"This would include motorhomes."

"It is also important that keepers contact the licensing authorities of the country their vehicles are being used in, to establish their requirements."

If anyone wants the complete e-mails, pm me with your e-mail address.

I have asked where you would register your motorhome if you were permanently touring & await there reply.

So it would seem that if it's abroad over 12 mths. it must be exported.

So the ones running around ,even with t&t +ins. are illegal.

"So the ones running around ,even with t&t +ins. are illegal."

Unless they have been here less than six months, and have adequate European (green card) insurance. Then as long as it is road legal in the country of registration, then it is road legal here.

However once a car has been in Spain for more than six months, it must be imported and re-registered, if it is intended that the car is to remain here permanently.

Arguably, one could keep a road legal UK car here in Spain for less than six months, take it back to the UK, ensure that it is road legal, and then bring it back for another six months.

As the DVLA have stated, as far as they are concerned they car must be re-registered if you intend to "permanently" leave the car outside the UK.

But if you were to take it out, then bring it back, once or twice a year... then really you are not doing so!

So, again arguably, you are sticking to the letter of the law!

My cars are registered at my parents address, as until we 'officially' move to Spain, that's where we "reside".

If you're not on the padron, where would they send the road tax bill to each year?  Gus Lopez

Why not just have them send it to your postbox like all other bills? Some people seem to cross the road to find problems. If I'm ever stopped driving my UK car I tell them I'm on holiday and if they ask since when I say since a couple of weeks ago when I departed my French holiday home. We are in the EU for Christ's sake and if I chose to spend one month a year in each of twelve EU countries what business is it of some peanut as long as my car is insured & taxed somewhere in the EU and I have an EU driving licence? It all comes out in the wash, I pay a fortune in UK taxes that go down the drain in Greece and Spain and I don't quibble, so I don't expect some Spaniard to quibble that I'm driving on his roads - which I probably paid more towards than he did. I don't get hassled by Scots when driving around Scotland wanting to know how much time I spend north of the Clyde. This "we're in their country, after all" bull cuts no ice with me. I have as much right to live in Spain as Zapatero does - and I have no more right to live in UK than any Pole. |That's about the sole upside of belonging to the EU.

Forgive rant. Back to sipping teensy weeny glass of Manzanilla before supper.

Interesting thread.

Concerning the medical certificate. I am a resident of the UK, own a property in Spain, have an NIE number but not on the Padron and not Residencia - each time I fly into Spain and hire a car - do I need to obtain a medical certificate? If I do need to obtain a medical certificate then why do the car hire companies not ask for this? They ALWAYS ask for driving licences.

Also, if I drive my UK car to spain for the summer holidays for about six weeks (the car will be insured, taxed not MOT as it is new) will I need a medical certificate?

This is the first time I have seen reference to medical certificates, and I want to be totally legal when in Spain. As I am sure do many others. I have read the link, and very worried that it states if you do not have a medical certificate you are deemed to be driving without a licence and can face an immediate 6 months in prison.

You see, this is the interesting thing about EU law, and the fact that the UK decides which EU laws to adopt... and which to completely ignore!

And this new law regarding EU Driving Licenses and having to carry a Medical Certificate stating you are fit to drive, appears to fall into the latter category.. ignored by the UK.

So it would appear, and I think we need to clarify my assumption, that if you are a UK resident, and hold a UK "EU" photocard licence, then you do not require to carry a medical certificate stating that you are fit to drive within the EU, as this is not required to hold a UK "EU" license.

However, my assumption goes further...

That if you move to another EU member state which has obviously had to adopt this law, and you then become resident in that country, that you have to acquire such a medical certificate and a Spanish EU driving license, as your UK "EU" license has now become invalid, as you are no longer resident in the UK.

Seems to make sense.

I've never been stopped by police/Traffico but my husband was.  They looked at his paper licence and passport, asked if it was a hire car and waved him on.

I have heard of people being stopped and fined for not having a medical certificate, but no further information than that.  Similar to when the not driving in flip flops rule surficed.

When I sort out my insurance next week I'll ask them what their take is on this new rule.  The car I bought is an ex rental so I'll ask the company if they have heard of this new ruling or perhaps they have a different insurance policy.

By reading the literature it would appear that you only need to have a medical certificate when you renew your licence, the problem arises when you have a paper licence which doesn't run out until your 70.

 Carol and Richard. TechNoApe is correct as regards Spain. As long as you have a European UK driving licence you do not need a medical. I cannot see why the car hire firm should ask for one as it is not law.  Problems arise if stopped by the odd policeman who may believe it or not, is ignorant as regards this law and or fancy getting some fine money out of you.

Technoape , It was made quite clear by the DVLA that if you take the car out & leave it in another country that they must be informed that it is permanently exported 6 regardless of being taxed , mot'd & returning to the UK for yearly mot's that it cannot remain UK registered. You cannot take it out for 6mths. take it back ,all the time being legal, & then bring it back. That was the original question asked of the DVLA.

"It appears that the vehicle will be taken to Spain and only brought back to the UK to obtain an MOT. Your acquaintance is not able to keep the vehicle registered in the UK under these circumstances if it is being kept abroad."

myra cecilia, it is the law & always has been for Spanish nationals. It now applies to foreign residents & anyone they consider foreign residents. I.e., Holiday home owners with an NIE number.

Remember, on the side of the road there probably won't be a problem it's when the accident has happened & there's bodies around that it will all hit the fan & the onus is on you to prove your legality not on them to prove your driving illegal. Also if it is found to be your fault through no med. cert. illegal car, etc, & their are serious injuries / deaths they''ll embargo the house & sell to cover the compensation.

caroland richard ; no you don't need a med. cert. as you are only on holiday but it's always helpful if stopped & asked that you can prove entry & exit times into the country. If you are pulled for an offence requiring fining / points deduction,if you are non-resident it's pay on the spot but if they consider you resident by your nie number you will have time to pay the fine but, they will create a "non-licence" in your name based on info from your UK licence & deduct points from it ,just as if you were a Spanish licence holder. (The same as they do in the UK for foreign licence holders.But there they give you points. )

GuyT : 

f you're not on the padron, where would they send the road tax bill to each year?  Gus Lopez

Err, I didn't  post this I was replying to it , I'd cut the drinking down & read more. I agree , why can't an mot,etc, from any EC country be sufficient anywhere in europe.

Technoape:

"That if you move to another EU member state which has obviously had to adopt this law, and you then become resident in that country, that you have to acquire such a medical certificate and a Spanish EU driving license, as your UK "EU" license has now become invalid, as you are no longer resident in the UK."

No, that's why it's an "EU" driving license. The UK is just the issuing country but the EC legislation requires you to comply with individual countries medical requirements.

Hi Myra,

Thanks for confirming you don't need the medical certificate on a UK licence.  It confirms what I thought.  I did some research earlier just to double check, looking at Spanish and English sites as well as the Trafico website and I couldn't see anything saying that you need the medical. The only people saying you need a medical are people on forums like this!

The medical is only for applying for or renewing a Spanish licence, and the certificate itself is handed in as part of the application process so even those with a Spanish licence won't have a physical copy of the certificate.    I don't know where people are getting this idea that you need one.

 Sanchez 1. It is amazing is it not the misinformation that floats around. It makes things so difficult for the new crowd. With respect to people who advise. They are just trying to help, I presume.

What is the situation if resident here (with residence certificate) driving our spanish plated car on a UK licence?  I need to renew my "plastic card" licence this May as it expires and, as I am now resident in Spain, I presume I have to now apply for a Spanish issue.  How does that affect my licence in general?  Obviously, my UK 'paper' licence is valid until I'm 70 - what happens if I convert to a Spanish licence?  Or should I just wing it and keep my UK one going - although how does that affect me legally, living in Spain and driving our Spanish registered car?

Hi Myra,

I've noticed that on the web there are all sorts of articles and blogs about Spain that seem to be authoritative, but are actually a load of rubbish.  Then people on forums like EOS pick up on these articles and post links to them or quote them and things spiral.

The classic one was the Disney Manilva one.  A few years ago a freelance journalist managed to get an article publisjed in the Sunday Times saying that Disney was going to build a theme park in Manilva. It all snowballed Chinese whispers style and there were then hundreds of articles, blogs etc on the web saying Disney was coming to Manilva as a given.  Obviously it was total rubbish.

 Pitby. If you have the paper licence as I had it is not legal though you may get away with it but you can be fined for this. The ID card European style if perfectly legal. If you need to renew, you would have to appear to live in the UK. The Spanish licence is easy to obtain but you need the medical certificate which is cheap and easy to get. The doctor will just be interested in getting his thirty five or so euros. I should not joke but if you had one eye and were half deaf you would probably sale through the medical. I use my Spanish licence as proof of ID in banks supermarkets. Saves carrying the passport with the new residencia papers. 

Thanks, Myra - I use my UK card licence as ID with no problems here too. 

In the UK (unless it has changed again) you will always have the paper counterpart licence - which is valid until your 70th birthday AND the ID card type licence.  The ID licence has to be renewed every ten years - even though your "licence" is valid until your 70th birthday.  It makes sense that the photograph is updated.  I don't know if this has changed or not.

Technically, am I legally ok to drive my Spanish registered car on my UK licence being a resident here?  Or am I obliged to apply for a Spanish licence? It makes sense, really, that as I am resident here and need to renew my ID licence then I should apply for the Spanish one - but just wondered if I am actually driving 'legally' on my UK one until then?

Hmm! This is getting very interesting.

What I am saying is that if you do not leave the vehicle abroad on a permanent basis, then you do not need to export the vehicle.

Bearing in mind that a UK citizen can legally live in Spain for 10 months out of every consecutive twelve months without having to legally move residence between countries.

This extract from the UK DirectGov website Taking a vehicle out of the UK permanently or temporarily

"Taking your vehicle abroad for more than 12 months (permanent export)"

"When a vehicle registered in the United Kingdom (UK) is taken out of the country for 12 months or more, it’s regarded as being permanently exported from the UK."

As I said, you have to export the vehicle if the vehicle is out of the country for 12 months or more.

And, from the same page on the same website:

"Taking your vehicle abroad for less than 12 months (temporary export)"

"If a UK registered vehicle is taken abroad temporarily, it remains subject to UK law. This means that you as the keeper, must by law make sure that the vehicle stays taxed while it’s overseas. Providing the vehicle has a current MOT certificate and insurance, you’ll be able to tax the vehicle."

Now then, remember what I said about that a UK citizen, who can legally live in Spain for 10 months out of every consecutive twelve months without having to legally move residence between countries!

So if you are a UK resident and have a UK vehicle registered to a UK address, and you own a property in Spain, then you can take a car abroad for less than 12 consecutive calendar months at a time. As long as you take the car back to the UK once or twice a year, and that then adds up to no more than 10 months in total that the car has spent in Spain, then it is not permanently exported.

If you are moving to Spain, then when the car comes over, not you - the car, then it must be exported and re-registered within six months of it's arrival in Spain - but you must be a legal resident in order to re-register the car in Spain.

On the other hand, if you have or are in the process or moving to Spain, have not become legally resident in Spain, own a road legal UK registered car which is registered to an address which is you legal residence in the UK, then you can legally have a temporary export.

If I drive the vehicle I purchased in the UK last November, which was taxed and tested and insured (EU green card) before it left the UK, back to the UK and then stay in the UK with the car, and then drive back to Spain, then the car has legally left Spain much less than 12 months, as have I, and then both the car and I legally re-enter Spain.

If this is done, possibly one more than one occasion, so that the car and I have only spent a total of 10 months out of any consecutive 12 months outside the UK, then it doesn't have to be exported or re-registered, and I do not have to legally change residence either!

Pitby, you can keep your UK one but if you renew it, you will need a UK address for them to send it to.  If you change to a Spanish licence, then you will have the extra hassle of doing the medical.