40,000 signatures collected for Palomares nuclear fall-out clean-up

If you go to Google Earth and type in the search box "Broken Arrow Palomares Almeria" you can see just how close the contaminated site is to residential development. Desert Springs is clearly defined as a green space to the left and within close proximity. However this development should not be singled out. There are many that have been built far too close to the contamination.

Then clearly you can see there are water reservoirs actually on the site irrigating the tomatoes and peppers we all eat. It is truly irresponsible. I would ask is this water tested for contamination how much radioactivity exists in the crops grown there?

It's almost as if it did not exist or plutonium is a harmless substance, such is the reckless behaviour of both the regional government of Almeria and the developers.

For those who are unaware of how well the petiition is going an important matter for many who live or own property in the area, 30,000 signatures were collected in one month, now 40,000, the aim is to reach 100,000 and I will also sign it in support of them because the petition says:

'plutonium from the atomic bombs continues to spread throughout the area and the Government cannot shirk it's responsibility to protect the population'. So, quite important don't you know?

It criticises the lack of governmental interest and demands action in accordance with national and international regulations, so not 'just a local issue' as was described on here.

When this area is fully cleaned the sooner local property prices will not have this hanging over them, they've already fallen drastically, and clearly this is the nub of some posts.

So kind of you Floella to point out going off-topic as you did at the end of your post, and like you Floella this subject makes be very curious, 'the more I digs the more I discover' why only some people want this hushed up and dismissed as unimportant? You know what I mean

And for those of you unware of where all the signatures are coming from, you might like to know that it is from a group of activists called Ecologists in Action.   Absolutely nothing wrong with a group working for the environment - I admire it - but it does have a 'fan' base, and it is certainly not local agitation.   That well known expat rag The Olive Press trawls the net for snippets to entertain - e.g. Maddie McCane twice spotted in Nerja.   Hardly a bastion of either honest or accuracy.  

All of this talk of Palomares is making me want to leave my radiation drenched home, and go to Villaricos.  And I have just realised why the glass bottom boat is so popular - the fish GLOW in the dark.

But hang on, if I wait until tomorrow, I can go to the market and get all my fresh produce for the week.  The blue light it gives off SO saves on the electricity bills, don't ya think?

Today I will trawl the millions of change.org petitions and see what is going on in the world.  Maybe I will sign the one to save the Roswell chicken man.  

And scambuster - at least I have a profile you can delve into...................????

Off topic:   I promise I will floella, but I have to say, that since we debated the issue, there has definitely been an increase in polytunnels in Almeria.   I still believe it is all linked to the economy and must have some government incentives.  

The more I delved during this interesting debate the clearer the picture became Roly and I fully understand why people may think such an issue might affect their home values, but the sooner the area is cleared the better for everyone.

Call me a sceptic if you wish but I really don't think 40,000 signatures and hopefully rising to 100,000 are all Ecologists in Action, more like distressed locals.

Would you say that the nuclear physicist Francisco Castejon who works for Ciemat is making it up when he clearly says 'we're in a race against time'?

I hope the required number of signatures is soon reached and appropriate action is taken asap, and the more that sign, the better for all, I really would support my neighbours.

How else does action in communities become manifest? It is useless to wait for politicians to do anything unless it's in their own self interests or those of their sponsors. It starts small on web sites such as change.org and is hightened with publicity and helped along with activisim by people who care about other people. 

I don't understand your cynicisim Roly but you are entitled to believe what you wish. The problem at Palomares is very real and is not going away. Perhaps when people start dying in numbers the Spanish government may act. Perhaps politicans with the ability to act and could actually do something think the same as you.

Perhaps in another fifty years someone somewhere may see the wisdom in cleaning up this scar on the landscape and be willing to sign the cheques. Lets hope that by then it will be a less cynical world.

, and like you Floella this subject makes be very curious, 'the more I digs the more I discover' why only some people want this hushed up and dismissed as unimportant? You know what I mean 

NO, I DONT  know what you mean, scambuster. 

Without definite facts, not people's personal opinions or via  press articles, signing any petition is something I won't do. 

So if you think you know something about me then put in on open forum and stop this cyber bullying. Never know might even make my profile a more interesting read.

Slightly OFF TOPIC ,  Roly, exactly what is happening in Aguilas. The tunnels and tents have multiplied 4 fold in last 6 months. Reckon you are correct , although it might be something in the water.

And the really interesting thing for me, is why two posters, with no profile, ( I am not even sure if they are living in Spain or UK), should be so determined to make the situation in Palomares out to be so much worse that it is.   Can it be the hopes of dipping into these potential compensation claims for some personal gain??

If I am entitled to 'believe what I wish', why the continued attack?  I started with the very clear expression of my own opinion, and two posters - only two, continue to attack, twisting words and looking for ways to discredit me using postings on other discussions, or sniping about where I live.   No wonder a lot of people don't use the profile!!  

I KNOW floella - I will try to find out.  I am up that way in a couple of week.

In your world Roly someone who cares about issues must have an ulterior motive. You don’t believe anyone can campaign for a better world or an improved environment without seeking reward or malice.

You have made an unjustified and slanderous accusation in your post that I am somehow interested in compensation and personal gain because I write and campaign for a cleanup of plutonium pollution in Palomares.

I cannot speak for scambuster but unless you withdraw that actionable accusation I will take things further.

Micky,

You're damned if you do and damned if you don't, sadly the latter carries the lesser damnation. If you believe strongly in a cause, sod the detractors, this forum has more than it's fair share of keyboard warriors, if I posted to the effect that today is Sunday, the usual suspects would no doubt take issue with me.    

Really Mickyfinn?   Really?   That is what you are going with?   So the initial attack on floella (which brought me in to the discussion), the constant insinuations against me, the sniping about where I live, my supposed vested interests are all to go unchallenged, and yet one question about the motivation of the two loudest protesters on here leads to litigation?   Really???   And your astonishing generalisation about my lack of care is simply breathtaking.   I am sure a cursory glance over these forums alone would unearth plenty of issues I have been passionate about.    I will make your case easier.   I will restate my position and ask the question again:

This is an OLD story.

It is not that big a deal in terms of the very real problems in Spain at the moment.

The Olive Press is not will known for its investigative journalism.  

Any expert witness can be matched with another.

And finally, could you state your interest in this story?   There is very little about you, or where you are on the forum as far as I can see, and I will ask the very legitimate question:   Do you have a vested interest in bigging up this story?

Answers on a postcard.     Now off you go to take it further.   I wish you luck.   

This thread is not about me, it's about trying to bring to attention the need for a cleanup of the nuclear pollution in Palomares.

I have not made any personal attacks on anyone in this thread apart from suggesting cynicism and constantly questioning posters motives. I could question why you protest so much that the subject is of no concern in Spain but I don't. Nor do I accuse you of any other ulterior motive.

You have made an unjustified slur on my motives. Now withdraw the accusation please or provide some evidence of it.

If anyone is actually interested in reading the scientific facts about Palomares here is the OECD report of 2011.

http://www.oecd-nea.org/press/2011/NEWS-07-presentations/7%20Session%202-3%20Carlos%20Sancho.pdf

Mickyfinn - you know that is not going to happen, so I will await whatever comes from the advice you take.   I think this thread is done.   Once your adviser contacts me, we will deal with it privately, until it is settled, and then we can put the 'result' up for general interest.  But I am making no more comments on this thread.    Whatever  provocatation you might bring on!!  

Been away for a little while but read comments since and quite frankly found your comment rather humorous Floella regarding cyber bullying which seems weirdly what you were trying. I've already said in a previous post that it's clear your view and Roly2's and our opposite views are not going to agree but we're still allowed to post our views nonetheless with no ulterior motive other than to believe the matter is hushed up and needs sorting out, the area in question needs cleaning up for the sake of those affected. How can some who live in the general area say it isn't a problem when Ciemat physicist and specialists say it is?

For me the picture has become clearer though and I will no doubt post on this subject from time to time until it is sorted.

It seems Hephaestus has summed things up pretty well re keyboard warriors on this site.

Roly's last sentence to Micky is in itself provocative.

My hypocricy only stretches so far, so before the pack decend with black pots and kettles snipes, I would offer the following. I have has 'the treatment' from this forum's self appointed hierarchy, and their attempted bites are really just saddo sucks, leave then to it, it's just a pity that this forum doesn't have an 'ignore' facility.

Instead of believing local (and possibly vested) interests, we should really have an international body that monitors these sites whether in Spain, the UK or Ireland. For example tests have found traces of radioactive waste in Scottish farmed salmon sold which was caused by discharges from the Sellafield nuclear plant into the Irish Sea.  Certainly food for thought!

The moment mankind split the atom we were in trouble. The discovery was born through the conflict of war. It has been used ever since to threaten enemies whether unjustifiably perceived or real. The genie is out, it will always be so.

The nuclear stand off during the cold war arguably held the peace in the world through mutually assured destruction. America and Franco’s regime at the time believed the threats the Soviets presented to be real. Leaving behind weapons grade plutonium in the deserts of Almeria, when faced with such paranoid dillusions pales into insignificance politically and in military terms.

To be fair to America they thought they had dealt with the problem of plutonium pollution at the time with the technology they had then. Ever since they have continued to pay Spain huge amounts of money to monitor the site, and the health of the local population. The US has made other financial contributions to the region. They built a desalination water plant at the cost of millions in Palomares but the Spanish never maintained it and it fell into disrepair.

In 2011 CIEMAT and the OECD made it clear with the science a clean-up is necessary. In the conclusion to their report the cost was then estimated at $31 million and three years of work. Excluding the cost of the disposal of radioactive waste generated. Yet the Spanish government continues to argue that the USA should foot the entire bill.

Now you could probably add another 25% to that cost. Subsequent generations of Spaniards will sooner or later need to face the rising costs this problem presents. It is not going away. The USA no longer relies on Spain as a stratigic ally in quite the same way as it did back in the sixties. In short they 'aint gonna pay. Ignoring it now is simply kicking the can down the road.

The current appeal seeks simply to pressurise the government in Madrid and convince them to act along the lines of the recommendations of CIEMAT and the OECD and clean up the contamination and face the costs involved themselves.

In doing this it will finally rid Almeria of the stigma of being the atomic coast of Europe. That can only economically benefit the region as a whole.

Steady progress on the petition, now stands at 43,013

The petition is on a website called:   change.org

Enter Palomares in the box.

Then click on: Petition. Gobiernos de Espana y EEUU: descontaminen

If you want to help the locals reach their target of 100,000.