| The Comments |
Hi All,
As been pointed out by several posters we know that the money is not there to refund purchasers. The only purchasers who can get their money back are those with BGs but they need to activate them. As for the rest of us what do we do? If you want your money back where is it going to come from? Not form assests in this present climate nor would they cover the amounts paid by purchasers.
So what do we do? It would seem sensible that what needs to happen is that SADM goes ahead with refinancing and those of us whp wish to continue with our purchase do so. This will give HdT income and then thus enable paying back money to those who wish it. What we really do not want nor need is for SADM to fail there lies disaster for us all, except those with BGs.
Tony R 17 18
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
"activate " that is a good word Tony did you learn that today ! wonder where you got it from .You know nothing Tony except the info you get from others on here the people you criticise constantly then use the info they give to make yourself look smart .You fool no one waffle waffle waffle and more waffle with a bit of spin added on the end. SAD
How many PMs have you had tonight asking for info I have had forty nine so far this evening .oh but you say I never give useful info .Tony your halo is slipping people are starting to see you for what you are.Nothing but a a bag of hot air.SAD
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
JA that is one hell of a lot more than me, although I am surprised the responseI have had to the Land Ownership thread, with a few throwing light onto the subject, but will not post it on here just in case the are mis-quoted or it is mis-interpreted.
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Hi Tony
Stop playing at god and acting as though you have knowledge of the complete financial affairs of this builder.
The fact is you have only the infornation you have been given from somewhat dodgy sources and with somewhat dodgy motives.
The administrators and the financial companies associated with the builder will know the amount of money 'left in the pot' when they investigate these affairs and the chance of recovering any further money when they place them into full administration and bankruptcy. If as you say there is no money left in the pot.......there is only to be one outcome, bankruptcy
How can a builder in administration, with debts and no money left, carry on building or raise capital to progress.......think it through its not rocket science. Dont come back with the motorway ploy or the water stocks.............not nearly a cause worth mentioning. Sorry Tony but you contradict yourself too many times to be taken seriousley.
The way you place information on here is only to give some weight to the continuation of SARC. You didnt like being called a liar before, kindly stop playing with the truth or i can see it happening again, and you will not be happy about it.
Brian
_______________________
Best wishes, Brian
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Hi Briando I think things got a bit too hot for Tony to handle today .He gives as good as he gets but then makes out the rest of us are rude and nasty .I think it may be better for his stress levels if he takes another short break .God only knows how he is going to cope when the final bad news comes through which by all accounts is not far away . At least it will put him out his misery .It may well come as a complete shock and knock him for six . I think he has been ranting for so long he actually believes his own spin .He reminds me of a few politicians who when faced with their own downfall were still shocked when the inevitable happened . Hope he doesn't take it too badly .Wont be long now.
I heard on a Spanish site the other day Spanish buyers and shareholders suggesting money had been ferrited away over the last few years into offshore and Swiss bank accounts ,if this is true can any be traced and reigned back in .I think this could only be possible if the criminal charges hold .What do you think would that money lost in the ether forever .
Cheers` JA
This message was last edited by julie anne on 10/4/2008.This message was last edited by julie anne on 10/4/2008.
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
|
et all
I have heard today (Saturday) through a reliable and legal source (Spanish) that both companies that are involved in SADM will be wound up before the year is out and any further correspondence is to be passed straight through our legal representation regardless of any approach by SJG. I would love to hope this is wrong but regardless of IWMH or IWMMB, doesn't look promising.
Sorry if i'm the barer of bad news and really do hope i am proven wrong this time.
Darren
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
I have had the same information for some time now I fear it is accurate as it has come from a variety of different sources.Just hope the folk with the rose coloured spectacles are not too shattered by the news .
I guess the fat lady just sang her last song !!!!!!!!!!!!!
I think the crux of the matter is the shareholders and the allegations of fraud ,any company with allegations like these hanging over them (now founded ) were as many of us have said unlikely to refinance .The writing was on the wall but SARC were unable to see the truth and have clouded the issue from day one .
These are the options SARC did not want you to use
Be very sure there are other ways to get something out of all of this even if it is just the owner ship of a piece of land or your half built property .
Don't walk away with nothing
You are innocent European consumers the contracts which have now quite clearly been broken offer you some protection as in the eyes of the law they have now been broken and should not have been issued without a BG.
The fact that you're contracts were issued without a BG which is in its self illegal could with the correct legal representation push you up in the line of creditors.
The fact that you are not a profit making business and entered into a contract in good faith as a consumer could offer you protection and change your position in the order of credit .
The fact that SJ/HdT have acted illegally could change the final destination of hidden assets to repay the victims of criminal fraud .
Each of these options are not an easy route but all are possible , with perseverance in a large joint litigation we may have a chance of getting something .
The last resort which is very difficult to prove under Spanish liability law ( these professions are not as accountable as in the UK) is litigation against the agents and the lawyers they recommended and claimed were independent. This is in its self a breach of Spanish law as a lawyer should not ethically take any case where there is a conflict of interest ie all parties in a sale ie representing the purchaser ,agent and builder in any one case . This is a difficult one to prove ,but is still an avenue open to us . Good luck all I hope you get something but it is not going to be your house JA
This message was last edited by julie anne on 10/5/2008.
This message was last edited by julie anne on 10/5/2008.
This message was last edited by julie anne on 10/5/2008.
This message was last edited by julie anne on 10/5/2008.This message was last edited by julie anne on 10/5/2008.
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Once again...et all
I agree with Julie. lets all for once try and work together to get something out of this but please, please, please lets not make this current situation an "I told you so" against the SARC members, rise above all the pettiness, throw differences aside and work together for a solution. Don't take my word as read, like a lot of things, It's not 1st hand information but as close as it could be (the words horses and mouth spring to mind).
Whether we all work together or as individuals, now is the time to go out and make a conservative effort to
a) clarify if what Julie and i am told by legal representation is correct (or not so), and
b) what are the next steps we as individuals should take to protect ourselves in the coming months......!
Each and every one, it's worth a phone call at least to solicitors to instruct them to seek clarification on your behalf.
regards
D&M
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Hi All,
Back in July in the SARC report we pointed out that money had been spent and was auditable. We had an iteresting exchange of emails with Ana and others who said that it was there and we pointed out that we had not been able to get any proof of such an account, only the one for BGs.
The whole point that some are missing now and i am surprised that they fail to see it, is that the only way people can get their money back now, unless they have a BG is by the refinancing of SADM. Now all of this doom and gloom stuff is unnecessary as with purchasers on the books and a large number of foundations in, this is a very interseting project for other companies. THis is why there are negotiations under way and why my solicitor recieved an email from the adminstrators informing him the negotiations on refinancing are taking place.
Looking at a similar comparison with an other development at Jumilla , the other development costs more, has less factilities and as far as I know, does not yet have the licneces and is further behind than SADM. So the value of the properties has not dropped/
What is important is that for those without BGs the only succesfull out come for them will be if SADM goes ahead and realises the sales on its books. This will enable refunding those who wish to have their money back and fro others to have their homes. The only purchasers who are not bothered are those with BGs and some of those have not been totally honest with you all!
So what we need is for SADM to go ahead and for those of you without BGs to realise that the only way that you can protect your money is to get your house.
ps the reason I go off EOS is because I have a life and I intend living it
I WANT MY HOUSE AND HOPE THAT YOU CAN SEE WHY YOU SHOULD WANT YOUR'S TOO
All thr best
Tony R17 18This message was last edited by TonyMal on 10/5/2008.
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
|
Hi All,
If you look below this post you will see one from JA, who out of interest has a BG and therefore her deposit is protected and she cays that this posting, that I have copied and put up here is as follows
Intersting sentiment and comment for some one who is safe to deride a way for the rest of us can protect our deposits. I will let you make you own minds up what you think but personally I find her behaviour and selfishness plus that of her nasty little group repugnant.
Hi All,
Back in July in the SARC report we pointed out that money had been spent and was auditable. We had an iteresting exchange of emails with Ana and others who said that it was there and we pointed out that we had not been able to get any proof of such an account, only the one for BGs.
The whole point that some are missing now and i am surprised that they fail to see it, is that the only way people can get their money back now, unless they have a BG is by the refinancing of SADM. Now all of this doom and gloom stuff is unnecessary as with purchasers on the books and a large number of foundations in, this is a very interseting project for other companies. THis is why there are negotiations under way and why my solicitor recieved an email from the adminstrators informing him the negotiations on refinancing are taking place.
Looking at a similar comparison with an other development at Jumilla , the other development costs more, has less factilities and as far as I know, does not yet have the licneces and is further behind than SADM. So the value of the properties has not dropped/
What is important is that for those without BGs the only succesfull out come for them will be if SADM goes ahead and realises the sales on its books. This will enable refunding those who wish to have their money back and fro others to have their homes. The only purchasers who are not bothered are those with BGs and some of those have not been totally honest with you all!
So what we need is for SADM to go ahead and for those of you without BGs to realise that the only way that you can protect your money is to get your house.
ps the reason I go off EOS is because I have a life and I intend living it
I WANT MY HOUSE AND HOPE THAT YOU CAN SEE WHY YOU SHOULD WANT YOUR'S TOO
All thr best
Tony R17 18
This message was last edited by TonyMal on 10/5/2008.
This message was last edited by TonyMal on 10/5/2008.This message was last edited by TonyMal on 10/5/2008.
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Come clean JA, what group have you got going now?
Is it another of the roll up trouser sect. nod, nod, wink, wink.
Hope that your posts will not be in secret code, like the other sect and as can, or can't be, read below.
Hope that your sect will stick to English?
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
|
I can assure you Tony
that I have a BG and I AM BOTHERED just like the rest of you.
I am sure I speak not on ly for myself but for all those of us with a BG and without one too
_______________________
Great Auntie Linda
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Tony I was not aware I was part of any group .Could you please enlighten me as to which nasty little group I am a part of as I don't remember joining any group or are you being delusional again.May I also say I am far from selfish and have passed info and tried to help anyone I can on this forum ,except to yourself as I truly believe you are beyond help and are on self destruct mode. You are actually doing a great job of dividing people and stopping others from protecting themselves by joining forces.However now we know you are an agent and not just plain stupid as we first thought your real motive is now obvious to all .
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Hi Tony
Ok then back to brass tacks here...............i want to get to some truths instead of descending into politics and cat calling.
You say there is no money left in the pot. Then a retraction because you cant answer my point that no money left in the pot equals bankruptcy.
You say they are re-financing and thats the best way to get a return for us.....I say..a company in debt and owing creditors to the tune sj are, no-one will finance them unless they can trade on. Trading on includes paying back deposits to out of contract individuals.
Then on the subject of BG's and accounts from your meetings and publications with sarc, you say as below.
Hi All,
Back in July in the SARC report we pointed out that money had been spent and was auditable. We had an iteresting exchange of emails with Ana and others who said that it was there and we pointed out that we had not been able to get any proof of such an account, only the one for BGs.
This clearly says there is a bank account for bank guarantees. I say there isnt, and the money was used to buy parcels of land by this builder. Greed to develop more sites at the expense of their customers.
Furthermore if the finances were auditable and as straightforward as you maintain, the administrators would have had an easy job and been finished months ago. There is no shred of evidence to back up your claims and information.
Tony....you do not make any sense at all with your statements.
Try to explain without placing more complications to the argument, and making it seem like you know something special.
Brian
_______________________
Best wishes, Brian
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
i believe that the money was in a separate acount tony and that this was provided to the court. it says so on the other forum and anna has the court document. you went and told san jose this and it was promptly gone. Nice one Tony you are a great pal. When everyone loses their money it will be no consolation that sj will rot in jail nor will it be consolation that you will always remain a great prat.
however is they have provided false information to the court then there will definiely be criminal charges - shame we cannot include you in those
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Oh Yes we can !. We can include Tony Totally Talking Tosh and all claiming to represent all purchasers when they clearly do not ( to their legal and financial detriment in another EU State ) this is illegal under UK/European law and renders the actions of SJ/SARC in their collusion unlawful . Litigation is already underway.JA
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|
Hi All,
I attach below the posting where we had been trying to get proof of the deposit money and Ana statese it is there but I believe we were never shown proof. Below that I have posted a SARC document 26 July in which we raise concern that we can not find deposits only a BG deposit account. Scroll down and you can all see for yourselves our concerns that the money was not there.
Tony R17 18
|
04 Jul 2008 1:06 PM
brianmags
Adosado
I've made 226 posts
Send private message to brianmags
|
Hi Guys
this is from Annas site last night Muppet ask about deposits
Question for Anna re deposits
Yesterday at 18:59:23
Hi Anna.
Hoping you can clarify situation regarding deposit monies.
You stated on Antonio update thread deposits were thought to be in seperate account but Antonio was seeking confirmation.
You then stated on the key ready thread at a later date the monies were in a seperate account.
Can i assume you have had confirmation through Antonio as this obiously makes for good news if it has been confirmed.
Looking forward to your reply.
Regards Ken.
you picked the short straw then???
Yes Antonio confirmed that the owners (ie buyers for Herrada del Tollo only - you wil need to make this clear when you post on eye on spain) have their money in a separate bank account. There is 36,000 euros missing (thought to have been spent on construction and this is th element which is being further clarified / confirmed. I expect an update from Antonio today which I will post)
For info. I dont mind posting but clients of Antonios can and will make direct contact with him and those that have chosen lawyers via other groups would be better placed to take advice from their own counsel as to not do so and rely on others would be unwise. How a claim gets handled by a particular lawyer through ths process will not necessarily apply across the board at all and will only apply to those he/she represents. Owners therefore need to make sure they are pushing their own lawyer for independent information and questioning next steps etc.
hence my comments about quality not price!
Hope this helps ken
Anna
So it seems that if you purchased with Herrada del Tollo our monies are safe but we are still in the dark those who are not. but It might bee good news about the Build at SADM as they seem to have done things properly when it comes to Jumillia
regards Brianmags
R4 556
The meetings that SARC attended and are reported upon the SARC website have given some cause for deep thought as to outcomes for purchasers at SADM.
Several key points have been noted that impact upon the decisions to be made regarding whether to continue with the purchase or to stay as a creditor and try to regain the money paid.
It can be seen clearly in the report that the deposits, although auditable and appropriately accountable are not all sitting in a ring fenced client account. This is information was given with some discomfort by SJ/HDT but we needed to know the truth regarding the position of the deposits. When we attended the meeting we were not sure either way regarding the existence of a client account, as there had been two mutually contradicting postings on the EOS forum. We sought to clarify this and in doing so found that only a small proportion of the funds are kept in an account linked to bank guarantees.
Therefore, we are very concerned that if purchasers decide to try to get their deposits back that several factors need to be considered:
Only a small proportion of clients money is in a clearly identified account
Money can only come from the company trading out of difficulty or through liquidation of the company.
If agreement can be made with creditors regarding debts the company can carry on trading.
Liquidation of the company would take time and in the current economic climate not realise intrinsic value of assets.
Staff, Government, Court/Administrators, Banks come before purchasers in line of payment.
Any interest or compensation claim would come at the end of the line of payouts and as such is highly unlikely.
Taking these points into account we cannot see how it can benefit any purchasers to go down the route of trying to get back their money. We understand the wish to protect your investment in your property/ies but believe that going down the legal route will have small return, cost money and have lots of stress. As of yet no one has been able to give a good reason how it is beneficial to try to get your money back!
If on the other hand we support the continuation of SADM and we take up the offer to continue to purchase we can have, although it may have been delayed, our property. This is a much clearer and by far a better outcome for most if not all of SADM purchasers. It has been made clear to us that SADM is a legal development; the licences are there, the water is there, and that the location is desirable and not part of the coastal property bubble.
It would therefore, seem prudent for all purchasers to actively seek to get SADM built and ensure that liquidation of the company does not occur. We may not be happy with the situation that we find our selves in caused, primarily by the credit crunch and banks, but we can try to ensure that our money is safe by getting SADM built.
With regard to solicitors it is essential to realise that if you decide to continue with your purchase the legal fees should be less and thus there could be a conflict of interests. Think very carefully about what you want and what is best for you, not your legal representative who is getting paid. If you do decide to continue with your (the purchase of your property) property, it would be a good idea to ask about a reduction in your legal costs, as you will not be going through a protracted legal procedure. Why for example pay 10% of your deposit if you are not pursuing a claim through the Courts?
23 July 2008 SARC Admin.
|
0
Like
Spam post or Abuse? Please let us know
|