DEVELOPER REFUSES TO REFUND MY MONEY BANK GUARANTEES NO GOOD

Dear All

With whats going on at home and with the endless delay in Spain [parted with my deposit some £50k back in May 2006] I decided to cancel my contract last october as the 6 month delay period beyond the contract completion date had well passed. The developer is refusing the give me my money back, I have tried calling on the Bank guarantees with the Bank de Valencai and theyre not worth the paper theyre written on. Despite serious pressure being applied the Bank will NOT honour the guarantees. I have been trying to recover my deposits for nearly three months now without sucess.

If anyone else is in the same position please contact me on 07919 093914 or 01482 632341to forge an alliance / share notes.

I am going to spain this coming Monday and I have BBC watchdog onto it and intend to start getting nasty as other avenues with solicitors etc have all fallen well short.

Hi there

Will be very interested to hear how your trip goes.

We have issued notice of our intention to cancel the Purchase contract, will post an update in due course.

Hi, we have purchased on m4, been told completion is March '09, but after reading the posts on this site, I'm starting to feel a bit dubious about the whole thing. Not sure whether to pull the plug on it, or what to do. Let me know what you think, thanks.

I think it depends on your situation... if you dont mind waiting probably another year + for the complex to be fully completed and if you still wish to puchase at the full price when better places are now readily available cheaper on the resale market . Not to mention negative equity for maybe 3 years to 5 years with a low rental market...

I have simply had enough for personal and financial reasons its been far too long and another year will make it almost 4.5 years thats about 10% of a typical adults active life... a complete joke...

I think in the long term this devopment is a winner but so are many other properties that are now available NOW and CHEAPER.

Phil

please, stop with this subject as the builder is finishing the properties on the M1 and M4 soon, as i have been there only a couple of weeks ago and work is progressing, just the last features are to be finished. My property was dued to be completed one year ago but external matters to the builder, like town hall issues and things like that made it to be delayed, so not reason to cancell.

The only thing i can tell you is that if your commence with these comments and try to cancell, the only thing that can happen is builder to go bust, and that is the reason why is not allowing cancellations, so please don´t be another of those groups which are just trouble makers and leave in peace to the people that we want to live and enjoy our lives there without problems.

I spoke to the builder, everything is correct and going smooth, so please, leave the work keep going ahead and DO NOT CREATE TROUBLE.

The reason why i say this is because other sites and blogs started like this with other builders and i have seen them going bust and still buyers WOULDN´T get the money back.
If you are not happy with the site, which i doubt that it´s the problem, wait till is finished and then sell it or rent it or whatever but do not put all of us and our investments in danger.

BANK want give you the money back as you don´t have any right for cancellation.
 

A agree totally with the sentiment of your post... HOWEVER i entered into a contract for a house that should have been ready 14 months ago... Perhaps the developer should have been more realistic about his expectations of what he could achieved in the timescale initially he had given me for the construction... secondly as the project manager of the development he holds total responsibility for all factors effecting the works.

I would further add that my request to cancel my contract was perfectly legal and within my rights and not unreasonable. A mutual agreement by both parties to this effect exists after 6 months has passed after the contract completion date has passed this is CLEARLY set out in the contract agreed and signed by the developer and I yet he has REFUSED to return my deposit and so have the bank.

The developer has niether honoured his obligations in providing a house within the timescale nor in the returning of my deposits.. and by the way the Town Council are refusing to issue completion certificates and the common areas are still simply piles of hardcore...

If you want to wait a little longer thats fair enough and your choice, all I want is my money back a simple request made with 100% entitlement under the purchase contract.. why is it then that despite 3 months of trying no refund has been issued or even any indication of any intent to do so.. is this the action of an honourable developer ? if it was i would have had my deposits returned rather than a string of excuses and in the case of the bank ignored completely ... I SIMPLY DONT WANT MY PROPERTY as i got sick of waiting... Perfectly within my rights regardles of cause or delay.

I dont want the builder to GO BUST but believe me I am not alone on this one and if the developer does not honour the terms of the contract the result maybe his demise.

He whole idea of these blogs are for freedom of knowledge...

MAKE YOUR OWN MIND UP.. my story is FACT the progress on site has been FICTION for far too long

I remember receiving a tile choice letter back in December 07 giving me a deadline until Feb 2008 to choose.. still not tiles in my house in Feb 2009.. FACT

Making my own mind up? Progression on site is a fiction? All you say means you haven´t been there for long and you don´t have a clue on what a building site is, although you are pretending.
Work happens everywhere as complainers are too, everywhere.

I am sorry about your personal circunstancies and reasons are ok, but builder has never lyed and only major subjects issued by the townhall have delayed the progress as well as the fact that one of the construction comapnies went bust at the middle of this year and the builder had to employee every worker that was on site by himself with new contracts, same as ingeneers, machinery and so on, SO, yes it is a reputable company, and doing things in our favor and obviously on his favor.

For a builder as quicker is completion better for him as he has to pay interests on mortgages so delayes is not his better option.

It sounds as if you have seen you cannot make as much money as you were pretending, sorry, that is investment and that is life, don´t spoill ours.

I hope you never come on site to life as you sound a terrible neighbourh.

No more to say.

All the best.

Lets sum the situation up ..

I am an average guy, wanting a house in spain....working within a budget

I placed my deposit back in early 2006 my property to be ready Dec 2007... at the same time my business partner did the same on another development.... Yes we all know that the spanish cannot work to timescales but in this instance the construction period was already three times that of every other developer offering properties at that time... remember I am no spanish property expert just a regular guy... I quizzed the developer about this length of construction over a meal in the resturant on the other side of the valley... three frondoso staff attended that meeting back in Feb 2006. They said " We have quoted a lengthy timescale to avoid the situation of giving people false hopes and to avoid contract overuns due to the amount of ground work required" Fine I thought perhaps the construction period is long but realistic...

On making my first vist to the property in feb 2007 nothing had really changed other than basic earthmoving forming the start of some roads and on my second vist in Dec 2007 [The date of completion of my house] nothing existed of my house other than a peg in the ground adjacent the service connection pipework and a few manholes. This being in total contrast to the assurances i had in the meeting at the resturant pre contract. I am a chartered Civil Engineer and the MD of a civil engineering company [Project Manager (yorkshire) Limited] I own excavators and all kind of earth moving plant and believe me with 20 years experience under my belt I can state with confidence that the way the groundworks was execute was totally under resourced and the equipment was inadequate to say the least... I have just carried out the foundation work for York College a £65million pound complex the foundations being £3m of this value and we had ten times the amount of equipment on this job which was probably less than a third of the size of Frondoso.

The Plannning issue revovled around the roof terraces and had nothing to do with the progress of the key infrastructure such as the foundations, also the develop again said that all planning matters were in place pre contract...

Subcontractors and contractors only go bust for one reason... cashflow.... was the developer not paying the builders on time? Had the developer taken on a project beyond his capabilities.. the latter seems to be more the reason... Or had he appointed contractors at cheap and unsustainable prices taking advantage of them until they went bust...

My property is now 14 months over the contract date I visited in Aug 2008 and again in late November 2008 yes some significant progress has been made and jolly nice it is too.... but to habitate its far away from finished.. my property had no windows, render, tiling, electrics etc etc etc  the ground around it is baron sandy wasteland

In the delay period my parents have fallen ill in particular my dad who has a myloma a cancer of the blood.. not good believe me... a major part of the reason for buying this property was to let my parent escape the english winters, he cannot travel now has he has visit a renal unit three times a week for the rest of his life... I have gone from being 40 to approaching 44 and my kids 4 now 8, 8 now 12 far too long for me to wait its already been over twice as long as forecast.... and i expect at least another 6 / 8 months to see the common areas completed ....

The suggestion that i launched this blog for a cheap trick to make some euros due to excahnge rates is really bad, or that I in some way am acting unreasonably asking for the return of my deposit ... for the record the euros will remain as euros for reinvestment overseas anyway...

How can you say that you would not like me as a nieghbour, all I have done is reported the fact that the builder will not give me my money back this despite the contract saying he should and that the bank guarantee when called upon does not help..

My property is well from completed and the common areas are also well from completed thats why not one single person has moved in and my tekephone has been ringing constantly with people who visit this sit who are also wishing to cancel for various reasons...

My partner who purchased on another development at the same time as me moved in in June 2007, enjoyed it for a year and sold out in early summer 2008 at a hugh profit... he has now reinvested and again looks like moving in before my property would be completed...

Its been a very sorry affair for whatever the reason but I am simply requesting the return of my deposits to which I am entitled.... I am a popular guy and go to the pub with my current neighbours most weekends... what about you!

Once again, i fully understand your personal situation with your family and it is a shame what is happening to your dad, i do hope all goes well for him, BUT, we are not talking about that staff, and believe me, each of us has something personal in all this and family is part of it.

What i cannot stand (and you can be the best CIVIL ENGINEER in the UK, and congratulations you can keep on working there) is your complainning about the lack of infraestucture that the builder has been issued for the building and so far from reallity your guessing and loud thoughts about the builder having probably not been paying the constructors, AGAIN, you are far from the truth, so don´t make false commments.

Wonder why those constructors and workers, and all that staff who had the problem with the construction company they used to work for, now they work directly to the promotor, AND BEING PAID AND WORKING, and your intentions for creating in all of us a bad impression to the builder is just deshonest and not fair as THERE IS A LOT OF PEOPLE WORKING THERE EVERY DAY which lifes depend on the site to keep on and go ahead as it is happening, so please leave all this cr... for your building sites back home.

Do you know that a british lwayer needs an speciall degree to be able to work in Spain, because of different laws, so it is for any other professional carreers like yours, so stop comparing ways of building and capacities.

Should you build your own site? Try, you look quite confidence with yourself, too much probably.

I am a happy potential owner and work is going ahead on site, landscapping areas, work on the swimming pools, and keeps on being a fantastic place.

You are such an spoil for this place that better if you buy somewhere else and leave us in peace.

A happy neighbourgh.

Hey perhaps you could do me a favour seeing you have taken a dislike to me so much.. tell the developer to pay me off so that we can put as much space between us as possible.

Even better, get the responsability for your actions over your shoulders (you must know about responsabilities CIVIL ENGINEER), and GO.
Engineers here are front line on site working back to back; You appear to be not very busy in yours, i do hope they go well.

I wouldn´t pray for you a penny to the builder.
He wouldn´t give it, anyway.

And just as a fair comment, i do not dislike you, you got it wrong, you just don´t deserve to be here and is you who dislikes the site and anything that has something related to it.

Loose or Win? Learn to loose and come back down and put your feet on the ground. Don´t complicate our lifes.

I think you have too much free time from your building site CE.

I do work in a bank as a BM and nowadays we are scaping from people like you.

God Bless You.

Oh yes a Banker.. I now it rymes... But what a mess you made of our economy no wonder your escaping... I take it your alright though!

Mate, going no further. It is clear your education level, and i hope everybody can see the type of been you are and your high skills.
You don´t deserve more comments and wasting my time.

Bye

Theres and old saying;... The truth hurts...

You stick to your bean counting and I will stick to engineering...

It will be the latter that will get us out of this recession as a few of your beans went missing...

Oh and I have a degree in civil engineering thank you and I am member of the institute or arbitrators, what do you have some banking exams ha ha... education... please

Man, you sound like a pr...
In Spain most of the young and not that young Bank Managers mate, we have degrees in MBA, and a couple of Masters more which is not the case.

But anyway, whatabout my level of english, where is your level in Spanish?

And one thing more, when you built where do you think you get the money from, under stones, you don´t sound educated you sound like and id... playing a game that was not born to.

Todo esto en español siginifica que eres un porculero sin pajotera idea de lo que es educación, que además te crees mucho siendo un simple Ingeniero Civil, que aquí en España los temos como naranjas, y que además vienes a un pais a enseñarnos y darnos lecciones sin saber hablar español.

En france, tu est an idiot, qui ná pa une idee du come ces´t la vi et sirvousplait quite de notre Pay.

You don´t have a clue of Spanish Culture and how well prepared we all are.

I think now you look like a donkey with certificates, don´t you.

Kind regards.

Buenos días, Alvaro y 6076867 and all buyers looking forward to completion on the Frondoso Valley urbanization.  I agree with both of your comments, but as we have been waiting possibly longer than most (we gave our holding deposit for a Link Detached on phase M1 in May 2005) I thought I would respond.  Our property was due to be completed in June 2007, with the usual 6 months without penalty.  In January 2008 we decided to cancel as the contract had been breached, it's a long story but we changed our minds.  So, we signed an Annexe to the contract in April 2008 with a new delivery date of September 2008, obviously that has now gone.  As I said earlier, a lot of the comments from different buyers are valid, but the last thing we want is for anyone to scare people into cancelling at this stage with the possible consequences.  We visited the site three times in 2008 and was happy to see our dream nearly realised.  We bought this as a retirement holiday home, certainly never as an investment but obviously,  because of the delay (20 months from intial delivery date) the current exchange rate is creating a problem as we are both retired.

Hope to meet some of you in the future in Frondoso Valley

Un saludo

Tus vecinos

Geoff y Pat    

Usted insulta mi inteligence...

Pienso que usted es ignorante y muy grosero.

Usted embarcar insultarme sin motivo alguno.. puede la lluvia de caída de Madrid en usted

Give me a break...

Yo no insulto su inteligencia, usted se rie de nuestra preparación sin tener ni idea.
Last thing i would do is use a basic translator from Internet to pretend to look as if... but no way, that level is poor for a person which is proud enough to be unrespectful with somebody else skills.

Don´t go on.
And yes, to your last words, you need a break, you look tense and nervous, but again, nothng to see with Frondoso site, which for relaxing and enjoy life.

Get off.

Que en español, se dice, ...., aprende tu solito que para eso eres mayor.

Hello Geoff Y pat, i do agree with you as i bought in the same phase and here i am waiting for it for a long time.
Sometimes it becomes desperate.

My comments to this guy are purelly because is complainning from the very beginning, talking bad about Sangonera la Verde which is where i actually live, bad mentions towards the builder, so personally i think that this guy is just not happy in his life but he does not have to tell the rest what to do with our properties and more when there is a lot of people that has put down most of their savings on this site, and the only thing he could create is all of us loosing our money and without the property.

I agree it is been dealyed for ages, and personally is afecting me, but if i consider pulling out or not is my own decision and my dealing with the builder.

What this guy is trying to do is not fair for the rest, for me, for my savings, for my family and so on, and i can tell you, for the builder.

I have had a numeour chats face to face with him and he has always faced the problems up.

I hope the site is finish soon, i can move with my family and enjoy with all my vecinos on site, but I DON´T WANT THAT GUY in here, hopefully he will go leaving his money for us, to build a Nice Covered Winter Pool.

Gracias a Geoff y Mat.