Meeting in Jumilla today

Just in case nobody has picked up on this from reading various posts:

Today HdT are holding a meeting in Hotel Monreal in Jumilla, starting at 1800.  It was originally to be held in the sales office at SADM, however they had to change the  venue because of the number of people who wished to attend.  We assume that the majority of people attending will be Spanish.

I will take notes at the meeting and post something on here, though I´m not guaranteeing when that will be as it depends what time the meeting finishes and how long it takes me to decipher my scrawl!

If anybody plans to come along, and needs any further information, please send me a PM.  After the meeting, if it´s not too late, we are probably going to Nuestra Bar for tapas so you would be welcome to join us there.

Kind regards.

Sue & John

Thanks on behalf of us all for sharing this info and looking forward to your report when posted.

Ken.

looking forward to your report Sue, many thanks for attending as we were unable to attand any of the events in the UK.

Vicki

I have been trying to post the report all afternoon without success!  It may have been because I was trying to paste the whole report, so I will cut and paste it in several parts.  Hope this works, and apologies to all.

Sue

Part 1

Meeting for creditors of Herrada del Tollo, held in Jumilla on 22nd April

The meeting was held in Hotel Monreal and was due to start at 6pm, though it actually started 15 minutes late. 

Almudena (Director of HdT) and Antonio (Finance Director) gave the presentation, and then answered questions.

Forty nine people were present, nine of whom were British.  John also noticed a couple who looked British standing in the doorway but they never came in, possibly because they saw that the presentation on the screen was in Spanish. Herrada del Tollo had provided handouts in English though so they could have followed it, and we were also given brief explanations in English.

Being cynical, I compared the handout with what I could see on the screen, and they were almost identical, although obviously Almudena and Antonio expanded on the various points.

For those people who haven’t attended a meeting in the UK, these were the main points covered in the presentation:

• Brief history of the San Jose Group
• Why are we in this situation?
• What have we been doing during the last 2 years?
• The Company’s current position
• Timescales and costs
• Summary of the Proposal.  Key points
• How we are going to cover the repayments
• The way forward for the future
• How the Proposal benefits you
• What happens if Herrada del Tollo is liquidated?
• What you need to do if you support the Proposal.

Part 2

Much to our surprise the Spaniards at the meeting were fairly quiet (!), so we were able to follow the presentation and also hear the questions being asked.

Almudena explained during the presentation that British buyers had been particularly concerned when HdT went into voluntary administration, and that this was because the liquidation process in the UK was completely different to the process in Spain.

Antonio made the point that the housing market in the Murcia region cannot be compared to the housing market on the coast and prices are amongst the lowest in Spain.  Prices in Jumilla represent better value for money and have been more stable than in many other areas.

Antonio said they had several options for future financing, however at this stage of negotiations he could not reveal names as it was still confidential information.

A British woman asked several questions, stating that her lawyer had advised her (incorrectly) that according to Spanish law she could not cancel her contract.  Almudena suggested that she gave her lawyer’s contact details to HdT after the meeting so they could correct any misunderstandings.  The woman also asked whether Herrada del Tollo would be willing to pass on potential buyers to anybody who wanted to sell their house. Antonio said they would be willing to do so if appropriate. All questions asked in English were answered in English – some Spanish creditors in the audience became a bit restless while this was going on!

Part 3

A Spanish man who claimed to be representing several buyers also asked a number of questions, which he had written down.  He specifically asked about the shepherd, plus whether there would be problems with the water supply.  Almudena stated that the land owned by the shepherd was outside the area to be developed in phase 1 and they would be able to continue without needing to buy his land.  Moreover the Supreme Court in Madrid had been satisfied that there would be adequate water supplies for the development and that they had the appropriate paperwork.

Another question was regarding how positive they were that they could successfully complete the project without going into liquidation.  Antonio replied that they could never be 100% certain, however what was clear was that if they went into liquidation now, with the current economic situation, there would be insufficient funds raised to pay all their creditors, and the ordinary creditors would not get their money back.  If this happened two or three years down the line, their assets would raise more money than at present, so ordinary creditors would get some if not all of their money back. The rationale behind this statement was the fact that there have been some signs of a slight recovery in the housing market, plus they had received offers to buy assets recently whereas there had been no offers when they first went into administration or over the last two years.

The presentation lasted about 50 minutes and the questions took another half hour. Once people started leaving, other people went to the front to speak to Almudena and Antonio on an individual basis

After the meeting I was able to ask Antonio a few questions regarding the number of live contracts.  He confirmed that originally there were more than 1500 contracts, two thirds of which were with overseas buyers, mainly British.  Spanish buyers hadn’t been cancelling their contracts, so of their existing 966 live contracts about half were now with Spanish buyers.

Antonio also mentioned that they had asked for an extension to the date of 6 May, partly because of British buyers being stranded in Spain because of the ban on flights to the UK.  If the extension was granted they could hold further meetings, so if a group of 15 or more buyers requested a meeting he would be willing to attend, whether it was in Spain or in the UK.

The Spanish people that I spoke to after the meeting were all going to agree with the proposal, as they saw that as the best solution for them and for Jumilla. 

Three of the other British buyers had said prior to the meeting that they were also going to say yes, although they wanted their money back.  They left before us, so I don’t know if anything said at the meeting changed their minds.

Hello everybody

Well that seemed to do the trick!  Hope that you can make sense of it.  If we receive any other information through our local contacts, we will obviously post it on the forum.  Several people went to the notary in Jumilla today and more have made appointments for Monday. 

From what we have heard, HdT will know the outcome by the end of June.

Best wishes to all, no matter what you are hoping for!

Sue

..........end of June?!?!!?**  i thought we would hear something after 6th May! ..........golly it feels like forever! on and on and on...............

Thank you very much,Sue and John for taking the time to keep us informed of what was said and done at the meeting..............has it helped you to decide which way to vote?

Have you read the link:

http://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/costaluz/3350/legal-tip-256-precedent-favouring-buyers-without-bank-guarantee-in-a-insolvency-proceeding.aspx

it does oppose the part about liquidation, giving Ordinary Creditors priority.

.............at least the sun is helping us to keep smiling

Kay

Hi KayT,

I followed the link & read Maria's posting . The purchasers at that development have a different creditor status to us purchasers at SADM. The ones mentioned by Maria, have the status of credits against assests, however, none of us have that & we are all listed as ordinary creditors. Therefore, if HdT is liquidated we still come 3rd in line for getting anything back.

I have read Sue's report, PM'd her & asked if we could send it out to all of our members and place it as  purcahser's independent report on the SARC website .She has kindly agreed to this & we are very gratefull to her for not only writing a report but allowing us to ciruculate it to a wide audience.

 Wishing you all the best

Tony

A question is asked of Maria 'does this include other developments, for example San Jose Inverciones?  The answer given by Maria is that 'It does'.

Lafera,

Are you a purchaser at SADM? I have never seen you post before and you appear to be attempting to mislead purchasers who desperately do not want to lose their money

TONY

 The question to ask Maria de Castro is what status were Martinsa Faldesa Creditors given by the courts and when.

I believe the court dealing with the administration process in the Martinsa case said, shortly after the applications from creditors were made, that creditor purchasers will have what has been commonly called here 'credits against the mass'.  That being the case they were always in a position whereby they would be first in line for repayment.   We do not have that luxury.

Tony  -  It is Laferia  -  My husband and I are purchasers and I am not trying to mislead anybody.  I am merely saying look at the whole picture and do not be hussled, by anyone, into doing something that may or may ot be right for the individual.  We all have to make up our own minds about this situation.  HdT/San Jose have had our money for 4 years now - not as long as some - it is a considerable amount, but we are not prepared to wait 4-5 years for 65%. 

We are exploring all avenues.

Hello Sue,

Thank you for taking the trouble of posting the report.

It does confirm my suspitions that people are voting YES but want their money back.

That sends a false message to San Jose.

Regards To All