Community charges..... non-payers....direct action?

We never got an answer to Pat & Roy's question of how long court proceedings could take from start to end for non payers of the Community charge.

Does anyone know?

Fibby. I quote you:..'Justin only deletes inappropriate posts Acky, therefore I rephrase my last post from nasty to inappropriate.'

Fibby quote: 'Justin...I'm throwing my toys out of the pram' (you remind me of Kevin Keegan!)

But the 'damage' had already been done, prior to you back-tracking.

Fibby I do note. Quote: 'Some of your posts are extremely imformative and give great advice, don't spoil your new membership by being argumentative! We need posters like you who have knowledge and an opinion of living in Spain'.

As for the 'troll' remark by Sandra (and backed up by you) (there you are again putting the boot in) Infiltrating the board?  Gnomes? (not me, I'm 6ft 3in). Air brained, loud mouth bigots?  Bona-fide members? (so, I'm not, and you are?)

I'm sure Justin - and the EOS advertisers/links - are pleased that my comments have succeeded in 'racking up a high number of posts'.

Fibby I think the remarks from you and Sandra deserve a rap on the knuckles from Justin.  Justice, where justice is due, Justin? 

Yes!

I do remember that Sandra...............

Mmmm, this Troll could be a banned member in disguise me thinks!

That accounts for the posts directed at me personally.

I have my suspicions who it is........let's hope there's no more of it.

I will take it all with a pinch of salt, nothing more can hurt me at this moment...............

Kind regards,

Fibby,

Do you remember those 'troll' thingamies that tried to infiltrate the board over a year ago?

A member who had come across them on another board described them as being like insulting and argumentative trouble-making gnomes and that they come across as air-brained, loud-mouthed bigots. He said they do this   to affect a response from bona-fide members and cause mayhem . They also succeed  in racking up a high number of posts in the process. If you 'Google' the word 'troll' you can find a description on 'Wikipedia' that describes it more aptly.

If you remember you remarked at the time that we had none on EOS. I'm not so sure now.

Eh?

I really am lost now Acky, just what is your problem?

I said nothing derogatory in my post below, in fact I praised your posts.

Enlighten me, cos' I am confused.....................

Fibby.  There u go (yet) again!! Like a little schoolboy running to the teacher (Justin)

Grow Up!

ANYWAY...................back to thread ?.......................

Justin only deletes inappropriate posts Acky, therefore I rephrase my last post from nasty to inappropriate.

You really need to "get into" EOS members though Acky, we have all got odd senses of humour and harmless quirks.

I am sure if you re-read my post and knew anything about me and the way I post, you will see it's done humerously and in good faith.

Some of your posts are extremely imformative and give great advice, don't spoil your new membership by being argumentative!

We need posters like you who have knowledge and an opinion of living in Spain.

Nuff said, tarra.....................

there u go again Fibby...with the reamark 'nasty posts' 

How can you say such, not having read the thread?

Glad u r not on any jury - they'd be hung b4 you heard the evidence!

Justin...................

I am throwing my toys out the pram now....I missed Acky's comment about me!!!

Wait longer before you delete nasty posts pleeeeeeze!!!!!! He he he!!!

Sandra:  Your comment..'probably a novice at using the internet'..

Afraid not, and sorry to disappoint. 

I was making a (valued) point about the state of the housing market, re: selling homes for the community non-payers.  

Surely the font/type size doesn't affect you reading replies?  Appears so.

But, as Roberto says, this thread is like a cosy community meaning.  Forums are to air your views - and not everbody agrees.  It's what you call 'free speech'. 

And as Pat & Roy state..'the debtors might pay up, but will that be the case?..'

Exactly.

 Yes i HAVE TO AGREE with you there Roberto,

But I would be interested to know we have taken a few to court on our urb:  how long is the procedure from begining to end ie?    court possesion or does it depend  at what court it is heard at?  I know it is a bit long winded in Spain,

The debtor's might well pay up but I wonder in this current climate if that will be the case.

Pat

Loving this thread - it's just like a nice cosy little community meeting!

       " This just proves my point - valued at £15M and not even sold at £1.5M "

Icky,

Apparently there was no shortage of interested would be buyers but for some unexplained reason, the Town Hall did not    release  it for sale. If you are  interested in the story surrounding this (which I doubt you are) you will have to do a search of the Spanish property web sites.It was on one of them that I picked up the news report. So, it not being sold, does not really prove your point. I was just trying to make my point that the creditors do not have to try and achieve a market value when selling.

I hope you don't mind me saying, but I found your post rather confusing. If you had put your comments- to my original reply to you - in a different font or if you had used a different coloured  font to me   it would have been more clear that you had replied. Also what had FibbyUK to do with it. I did not understand?

I realise that you are new to this board and probably a novice at using the internet, so don't let my comments put you off posting. We welcome new members and try and help where and when we can.

** EDITED - Please respect terms of posting **

Sandra.......the name is ACKY.......not ICKY !!!!           

noddy,

Once you have the debt registered in court the amount owing can be updated as other community fees remain unpaid. At each AGM our owners are advised of the current situation and approval is given to continue action. The Administrator's Lawyer advises the court of the additional amounts and these are added to the debt. The debt also accrues interest, which means that a debt of 3000e can end up as a debt of over 600€ pretty quickly plus court costs.

I have not known a court be soft regarding community fees, just the opposite because Spanish courts see non-payment of Community Fees as an infringement of Spanish culture. And lets face it..................everyone knows that Community fees have to be paid....................you have to pay your dues in UK.........and the penalties are strict so why should they be any different here??

Hi Icky,

"If, say, a case was proved..and the debtor was to sell their house to pay their dues.  In the current climate, who's going to buy it? "

The courts sell the property in order to recoup the debt, NOT the debtor.

Also I don't believe the courts are  obliged to get the market value. If the debt was say 5k euros and the highest offer they got for the property was 6k euros, then they would sell. You only have to take as an example the case of the Byblos hotel on Mijas golf. The hotel was reputedy worth 15million euros and it was up for auction with a reserve of 1.5 muillion euros, the amount needed to clear the debt.

I can't  see there being a shortage of interested buyers for such a property however depressed the prevailing market might be except, I might add,  the Byblos did not sell!

I love your name by the way!

Taking debtors to court is the only option. We have over 30% debt rate, the problem arises when the courts take too long, and in the meantime another load of community fees have not been paid. I understand only the debt at the time of your AGM approval can be considered.

I also understand that the courts are quite soft, and if for example someone owes 2,000 maybe the court will instruct only part payment of say 1,000. please correct me if i am wrong.

So the debtors list gets bigger and bigger withe genuine good owners getting frustrated at supporting the shirkers. Eventually such a shortage of money could lead to urbanisations not being able to run the basics.

Especially on new developments with vacant investment apartments, these people have no intention of paying. I know legally you cannot prevent their "rights" but you can make it very awkward.

I fear with the exchange rate, the economy this problem can only get worse.

noddy

Quote: my Post

I think the post should be taken with a pinch of salt and a slice of lime.........mmmmmmmmm delicious tequila!

All I was saying Acky is that KarenSun REALLY does know what she is talking about and not to be wound up by your post, as it seemed to question her ability to answer your question.

** EDITED **

And I am a chilled out member, I don't cause trouble, just pop in now and again to say hello........

Kind regards,