Property refurbishment - advice

Hello One and All,

I have just had bad news from my keyholders, the builder has gone bust!!

This is a copy of the email we have just received.

Hi John and Diane
 
We have jsut been informed that the power to Vegamar has been disconnected sue the the builder having gone bankcrupt.
 
We received a phone call from James who was worried about his freezer full of food so we went over to collect it for him.
 
When we arrived there was a crowd of people near the pool (all the residents) and it appears nobody really knows whats going on.  Andreas was there and apparently had told them that the builder had goen bankcrupt.
 
One of the residents seems to think it might be back on tomorrow or perhaps Saturday.  Maybe so or maybe not but the bottom line is if Iberdrola do not get paid they are unlikely to switch it back on.  The water could be next.
 
Unfortunately it is not a case of just switching over to mains services as the substation where all this is connected too has to be passed and certified by Iberdrola and then applications put in to the local council.  Having said that, this may have been ongoing anyway but I doubt it.
 
We know this because this is ongoing at Fontana 2 and 3 and has been for the last few months although at this moment (certainly today) they still have power.  Interestly though, there has been alot of activity up at Fontana 2 & 3 this morning because we actually remarked on it ourselves.
 
We just wanted to keep you informed because we know you have guests arriving in a weeks time.  Obviously if there are any developements we will keep you updated.
 
Regards

Not sure where we go from here!

Hello All,

An important update again from our key holders following on from my last post.

Please can you all take a look at the copy of the email I have just received and let me know your thoughts.

I am quite happy for people to contact me directly by using the send a private message. I will then pass on my contact details.

Hi John
 
Phil has just phone me, on the way back from taking James' sister to the airport.
 
On arrival at Vegamar, the Administrator (Juan Carlos Ballester) for Fontana's 2 & 3 collared him.  He had turned up to talk to owners and residents on site. Apparently Idearco contacted him about a week ago to orgainise being appointed as the Administrator for Vegamar.  Before anything was set in place, Juan Carlos got a phone call this morning from the builder to say that he (Idearco) had nothing more to do with Vegamar as he had gone bankcrupt.  
 
What he was telling the owners was that in order for him to act for the Community he has to be requested by as many people as possible to do so.  Therefore he has asked Phil to inform all our owners to contact him directly requesting that he acts a the Administrator..  This is very improtant because without enough requests he is unable to do so.
 
His email details are:   administracion@comunidaddevecinos.com
 
Tell him that you are an owner in the development and that we have passed on his details to you.  If you are in touch with any other owners then please do the same.
 
If enough people do this he can move forward to set up the Community and then start on Iberdrola.
 
Phil is still on his way back from the airport so I will perhaps find out more once he gets here. 
 
We will keep you uptodate with things as we get to know.
 

HOLD FIRE ON SETTING UP A COMMITTEE

We need to look into the legal implications of setting up a committee as we could well be taking on the responsibility of paying for the completion of Escalera 5, the road and all sorts of outstanding issues on site.  All this needs to be clarified before we jump in.

I have just spoken to Carol who lives in Vegamar and she has confirmed that the electric is off and so is the water and apparently the administrator from Idearco is due on site at 10am in the morning.

Ironically, this morning Idearco had builders on site this morning doing snagging lists!

There is now a problem with the swimming pool which could pose as a health hazard and some of the residents are trying to sort with the Town Hall.

We are flying out tomorrow morning from Gatwick and hope to be able to return with good news, but somehow I doubt it!

Clare & Gord

 Hi All

I agree we need to know the implications, as I pointed out to someone who sent me a private Message. However talking to and administrator I feel is a good move, it does not mean we have to jump straight in with the setting up of a committee.

I have asked around to find out what this Juan Carlos Ballester is like, and I have been told he is OK.

One large problem we have is that when the builder hands over to an administrator he also hands over all the contact details for each of the owners.

The situation we now may have is that an administrator will not have these details, and as many of us have our apartment as holiday homes, it could take sometime trying to track down all the owners.

 I will email this administrator to find out where we do stand and if any information has been handed over.

Again I agree with the last post I don’t want to have to pay for the place to be finished off, and again I will ask how we stand on this, but I also don’t want to be left with an apartment we cannot use.

Please can we all work together as I am sure we all went the same; the beautiful apartments we all have bought into.  I know that the agents etc have all tried to tell us not to worry everything will be ok, but this is just standard spiel they have done their bit and taken the money. They will not get anymore for trying to help us, especialy now!

The information I have put on the site today and in the past has purely been to help others to know the situation, and I hope I have not offended anyone in doing this.

I look forward to others comments and suggestions on how we can move forward!

John

Has anyone got an update from the meeting at the apartments this morning?

Hello All,

Please see the update below, folowing on from todays meeting at Vegamar.

I would very much like other peoples views on this!

Thanks,

John

"There has been further developments today as Juan Carlos had returned to the complex to hold a meeting at 10am.  Phil went to this meeting and can report the following.
 
Apparently, Idearco have stopped paying any community bills on all of their complexes, so this is not only going to be a Vegamar problem.
 
Juan Carlos has been in touch with Iberdrola who are not being very helpful and apparently will not reconnect the electricity to the building until the outstanding bill is paid.  However, at this time the amount is unknown.
 
Juan Carlos' advice was to set up a Community.  A number of people asked Phil for his opinion who agreed that this was really the only way forward in order to get the electricity re established, as this could possible be a long term thing.
 
The first AGM has been set for next Wednesday 2nd April at 10am. in the Vegamar complex. 
 
The swimming pool is now completely green and nothing has been done to the road.
 
The concensus is that priority should be given to re establishing the utilities with the road and swimming pool a secondary matter as money will have to come in from the owners to start fighting these other matters.
 
There are a few unhappy owners out at the moment.
 
Some owners have apparently been in contact with their agents eg Atlas, Iberian etc who have told them they should not set up a Community as this is only done once the complex is completed.  The point is, it will not get completed by Idearco and without  a Community and Administrator in place, then you (as a complex) are on your own. 
 
Juan Carlos has list of details of some of the property owners but he is still missing alot of owners details.  It is imperative that all owners email him giving their details, apartment address, home address and contact details for him to update his records and essential to be able to eventually to apply for your utility services.
 
We would advise that you do not ring him at this stage because he is snowed under trying to sort out the Idearco mess.
 
To be honest, at this moment in time, the complex is unfit to accept paying guests and you should think seriously about taking any further bookings and perhaps even resheduling current bookings until the matter is resolved.
 
Please note this is a general email which I have sent to our owners at the Vegamar complex."
 

John

Thank you for your update.  Although not good news, it is some what reassuring to get some news. 

At least things are moving.  Although i won't be able to go to the AGM next week, i hope to send my brotheralong as proxy along (I assume this is ok).  I agree with your proposals that we probably need to set up a committee sooner rather than later but i think at the meeting we need to disucss a few issues including:

• Was the builder required to place a guarantee with the bank to protect us in this situation? Can Juan Carlos shed any light on this.
• Can a local council representative be invited along to provide advice?
• Can Idearco's liquidatior (or whoever) be contacted to get details of all the owners?
• What are the outstanding utility amounts, like a lot of other people i paid €900 in cash (on advice from iberian) to have my own supply of electricity connected but i guess this is dead now
• What are the priorities, like John said ultilities, then pool and road.
• What are the formalities of setting up a committee and appointing a management company and what happens if we can't contact some owners or they refuse to pay the charges
• Do we (as owners) need to appoint an indpendent solicitor to keep us on the right track and if so how do we pay for this (which will be the first thing they will ask)

Surely someone on the forum or someone who knows someone has heard of this situation happening before (we can't be the first) and could maybe shed some light on what happened to rectify it, how long it took and what was the legal position.   I have tried in vain to contact both Aroca Sequier and Iberian but I am going to keep trying. 

I think if we all try and keep each other informed as much as possible we have a better chance of getting things done as a united front.

Regards

HI

Thanks for the updates John, I will not be able to make it out to the agm, I agree with the points furry was making and believe we should get all the info we can before setting up a commitee, legal and cost implications, also is Juan Carlos relieable as he was the adminstrator going to be appointed by Idearco.

Maybe we should put a post in the general forum and ask for some advice from others posting on here, once again thanks for keeping us up to date.

Regards

Dave

 Ray at Iberian International has just called me back.

He said that they are still in the dark as to what exactly the situation is.

 He said that instead of Idearco just disappearing into the horizon, it is normal for the Bank to take control of the company, but does not know if this has happened or not.

 I asked about what happens, as they have not finished the site?  

Rays response was that Idearco should have lodged a sum of money with the local authority for every apartment they have built, this is then either given back once the place is all finished or used to finish of the apartments. Again he did not know if this had been done!

I have never been told about this from them before or my solicitor, but I have seen someone post this on the forum at some point.

 I take all that they say with a barrow load of salt – as I think they are trying to play things down.

He also told me Monday is a Holiday in Spain, and Iberian will be back open on Tuesday.

 Regarding Furry’s comments about the 900Euros; I think we have lost that, and from what I understand it was not an amount they should have taken in the first place, its just something that is done in Spain if you know what I mean.

 If it comes to it I would be happy to contribute towards getting an independent view along with other owners.

 Again to answer one of Fury’s questions, I have herd of this situation before I read about it in one of the local papers when I was over last I don’t think its that unheard of I am sorry to say!

 Regards

Hi All

What a nightmare ,does anyone know if the builder has a bank guarantee on the Vegamar and if so how we stand as to the legal ramifications if  we do go ahead and set up a commitee as I understand it we become responsible for not only the utility bills but the completion of the whole building and the road, so please anyone more clued up on the Spanish legal system please reply. As for the the water and power its a must these are put back on ASAP and if setting up a commitee is the only way forward then so be it. So If there is anyone out their who can help with this problem please do even if you are not a vegaMARE owner either from past experience or an intimate knowledge of the Spanish legal system please help. 

See you all soon June&Dave

Link about  Spanish community, It may be of help!

http://www.spainlawyer.com/guialegal/guialegal.cfm?IDCAPITULO=04070000

Dear All,

Like Joanne I have not completed but paid a large deposit which I cannot afford to lose.   I have read the information from Iberbrit Legal which is what I understood to be the case but it appears that many builders do not follow the rules and little is done to enforce the rules as would be in the case in Britain.  I hope that the permanent residents are OK it must be very difficult to cope in such a difficult situation.  Everyone inclutuding myself name the builder as Idearco but on my contract and the final details sent by my lawyers PSI the developer is named as Proalto S.L. which I think needs some explanation as this may be the parent company which may not be in such dire straits.  How much finishing work is required on escalera 5 or is it just the road, tidying up the communal areas and the pool which require work.  I understand that there is no habitation certificate at the moment and perhaps this is a good time to make sure that the developer whether it was idearco or proalto s.l. had all the necessary legal requirements in place.   It is a very good idea to have the Local Town Hall officials involved, it is their interest as well as ours to ensure the appartment complex is viable and a source of income to the local community.  PSI are contacting the administrator and expect to give details of clients such as myself who have not completed.   Hopefully if the administrator is effective the situation can be salvaged.

Regards,

Safia

Dear All,

Like Joanne I have not completed but paid a large deposit which I cannot afford to lose.   I have read the information from Iberbrit Legal which is what I understood to be the case but it appears that many builders do not follow the rules and little is done to enforce the rules as would be in the case in Britain.  I hope that the permanent residents are OK it must be very difficult to cope in such a difficult situation.  Everyone inclutuding myself name the builder as Idearco but on my contract and the final details sent by my lawyers PSI the developer is named as Proalto S.L. which I think needs some explanation as this may be the parent company which may not be in such dire straits.  How much finishing work is required on escalera 5 or is it just the road, tidying up the communal areas and the pool which require work.  I understand that there is no habitation certificate at the moment and perhaps this is a good time to make sure that the developer whether it was idearco or proalto s.l. had all the necessary legal requirements in place.   It is a very good idea to have the Local Town Hall officials involved, it is their interest as well as ours to ensure the appartment complex is viable and a source of income to the local community.  PSI are contacting the administrator and expect to give details of clients such as myself who have not completed.   Hopefully if the administrator is effective the situation can be salvaged.

Regards,

Safia

Hi Safia,

Our apartment is in Escalara 5 and we spent the Easter weekend in it.  When we returned, I informed Idearco by fax. of some of the things we noticed that we felt were potential health & safety issues, i.e. lift out of order but no 'Out of Order' notice on it, so not sure this had even been reported, lights not working in the stairwells, the main door from the road can't be opened from the outside, so should there be a fire, the emergency services would have no way of gaining entry to this part of the building and lastly we raised the point again about the road, not only not being finished but not being lit.  Idearco still have a cement tank in situ and the manholes covers are raised considerably higher than the uneven road.  If you didn't know they were there and drove down the road in the dark, you are in danger of having an accident.  To their credit, they contacted the local agent we purchased our apartment through to ask for more information yesterday.  We'll let you know if we receive any further information from them.

Regards,

Allen & Leigh

Dear Allen and Leigh,

Thanks for the information about your part of the building it sounds as though there are finishing and repair issues but thankfully the main work seems to have been completed except road which was bad when I inspected my apartment in December.   I am unsure as to the position of people who like myself have not completed yet.   Hopefully we will get some clearer information in the next few days but it is very disappointing and stressful for everyone concerned, so much for chilling out in Spain.

Kindest regards,

Safia

Hiya dont know if anyone has anymore news but the latest I have heard is that the water is on for a week to give us time to sort something out. The electric is still off as far as I am aware. With regards to the road Carol has told me that the Town Hall have money there from the builder to finish. Dont know if there are any bank guarantees I have emailed my solicitor and will update when she gets back to me. We are going over next sat so hopefully we will have water and electric.

I am sure if we all stick together on this we will be able to sort it out. I have given carol my voting right as I know she will do what is best. This is a difficult situation but I agree our priority is the utilities and then the pool. Escpecially for the people who are living full time there.

Lets just hope that the AGM on wednesday gives more news for those of us who arent able to attend and we will know where we go from here.

I know the administrator that was there yesterday is the same one as algorfa and aparently he is very good and has sorted all the problems they have had.

Fingers Crossed.