corvera airport

Hey Steone - why not tell it the way it is, instead of beating round the bush? You are 100% correct and the shambling herd of politicians who think we are all as stupid as they are deserve to be exposed for their avarice and gross incompetence. Is it any wonder that Spain is ridiculed by the rest of Europe and can't find a serious investor for Paramount?

http://murciatoday.com/san-javier-airport-january-passenger-traffic-down-81-from-jan-2007_24774-a.html?Banner=13#.VOeGhO90zcc

Perhaps people should also read the altest article on Murcia Today that the traffic into San Javier in January in now down 81% from January 2007 and even 25% down on the same month last year, a total of 19,154 passengers or 617 a day

Even Almeria airport had more passengers while of course Alicante continues to grow, up 7% in January on almot 500k passengers

I would suggest that if you don't have any passengers for 2 thirds of the year then it is pretty easy to get a quality award, especially when you maintain the same staffing levels so yes of course the unions are going to fight to keep their jobs

My question remains, when are prople that post here going to wake up to what AEAN are doing with this airport and the DAMAGE that the lack of flights is doing to this region and while AEANA have the monopoly how are things ever going to change

The reason to open this airport still remains to break a monopoly  and get some flights into this rea, 5 routes just doesn't help anybody, no mystery on what nationally visitirs are falling in the region, the British

The main reason no one is flying to San Javier airport is the cost of the flights it is always more expensive than Alicante some times double the price why. 

The main reason no one is flying to San Javier airport is the cost of the flights it is always more expensive than Alicante some times double the price why. 

Absolutely correct because AENA, as published on their website charge the airlines much less to fly into Alicante, around half is the estimate and the airlines will ALWAYS vote with their profit line

People would love to fly into San Javier, I would love to use the airport, if there were any flights

Based on the ACTUAL numbers it works out that the flights are running at around a 94% occupancy rate

When are certain people going to see beyond the end of their noses?

Lets look at some facts...

When the routes/flights were up for tender for the winter schedules 2014/15 AENA expected that they might have to lose their MJV slots to Corvera. Therefore they were not going to invest money into getting routes to MJV if it was going to close. As it now stands, as Corvera is not open yet and not likely to until, at the earliest, summer season 2016, Aena are not going to waste time and effort in distracting flights from Alicante to MJV. Until the wrangling over Corvera and MJV is settled then AENA are going to push as hard as possible to get as many flights into Alicante.

There is no economic reason as to why AENA will encourage flights to MJV at this very moment. Until the FINAL decision is taken as to who will run Corvera, if anyone, then there is no point in encouraging flights to MJV and in fact the fewer flights that land there the better it is for AENA as passengers will just get used to using Alicante. Also the 'price' that AENA will offer to use Corvera will be less if there is very little traffic at MJV to transfer over.

It is a great smoke screen that is being put up by saying that MJV is getting X% less passengers because this is a deliberate act to get both airports (MJV and Corvera) closed and everyone will then have to use Alicante.

Everything was fine at MJV until the politicians started saying that it would have to close so that they could get their illegal loan to a private company back at any cost. All this indecision is just making AENA push as many flights as possible to Alicante and just use MJV as an overflow. They are not trying to get new routes as this might have to go to Corvera which they will only be the concessionary user and not the owner. It is all simple business sense and everyone is getting so worked up about two insignificant airports that Alicante is taking all the new business.

In my opinion, as usual the politicians have no real international business sense and are only interested in their own little world and can not see the bigger picture.

As you can see I am still sitting on the fence, only now I am begining to take out the splinters!!

So all of the way though this thread people have continued to make the comment that there is no demand and that is why the airlines are not flying into San Javier

Now thi is a plan by AENA which is something that I have been saying for a long time, a stratgic plan to run down the airport, even though they took government money to EXPAND the airport, add a runway, control tower, new parking, sold franchises

So AENA ran San Javier into the ground, with the REAL effect that you the people on this forum to loose rentals, allow the area to decline and pay nmore to travel from other airports and then encourage people to sign a petition to save MJV and allow them to continue to play their games

People will stay in areas to which they cam easily get cost effective flights, Murcia Mar Menot isn't one of those areas

Whilst we agree that AENA are now running down MJV the cause of this rundown is a matter of difference. It has only been since AENA realised that there is not enough traffic for both Corvera and MJV that the penny dropped with them that the likelyhood would be that MJV would have to close. IT was also realised that when the routes were allotted that they would be losing MJV so why work on getting new routes.

The one and only reason why MJV does not have the passengers is Corvera. As said previously why  this total waste of everybodies money was this fiasco allowed to be started let alone be built? Until Corvera ran out of money there was no real talk of closing MJV but when they did run out of money and the illegal loan was made,  MJV has suffered ever since.

Another major reason as to why Alicante are offering cheaper landing slots than MJV is that Alicante region are subsidising the airport whereas Murcia are not doing the same at MJV. Anyone with any logic can see that it would have been far far cheaper for the ratepayers of Murcia to just thow a little money at MJV to reduce the landing fees rather than build their own airport which will never ever make a profit. This solution would have shown instant returns with more passengers arriving into the area and spending their euro/sterling or whatever in the region instead of in Alicante region.

Here is a prediction..... if Corvera ever opens and Murcia do not pour even more money into reducing the landing fees then no airline will want to use it. I give it a maximum of 5 years before the weeds  will be taller than the buildings there. And still the politicians will not be charged with fraud or whatever because of their stupidity that they have thrown away hundreds of millions of euro.

Before we say goodbye to MJV just realise that it still had over 1 million passengers lats year and that is not to be sneezed at. There is a demand for services but because of the indecision at Corvera no airline wants to sell seats at MJV and then find that they have to pay to transport everyone between the two sites. Think about it, if the airlines are selling seats at €20 before taxes etc. how can they affort to lay on coaches to travel between the two airports for free. Also the extra admin and bad feeling of passengers is not worth the agravation and costs.

Stop blaming the innocent and lay the blame squarely where it belongs at the feet of Corvera and the politicians in Murcia

Please look at the AENAA website because it isn't the region that provudes the bulk of the subsidery, it is actually AENA

Please also look at the terms of the airline transporttion, the airlines do not have to lay on any transportation if they move airports, they have to give an option to allow the customer to cancel or change their flights but the the bulk of people they will as normal make their own transporattion arrangements, car hire, buses, taxis etc

Some of the long term parking people have already made provisions for land in tis area to move their services

The government can only sponsor flights if they happen and if the operator is helping, in this case AENA are not

AENA spent a very large sum of money upgrading MJV, taxpayers money and then did nothing to promote and grow the airport, even to maintain the current numbers and AENA have not repaid any of their part of these loans

Now they are interested in running Corvera when they get flack form the government for the situation at MJV so in no way are AENA an innocent in these matters

Roy

I am not sure your assertion on subsidies is entirely correct.

Yes different AENA controlled airports will have different fee structure as with any business, economies of scale will allow the operator to offer better deals at a busier facility.

After all the fixed costs are the biggest proportion of the fees, adding extra flights would add little more than the extra labour needed.

Alicante has massive fixed costs so it can encourage more flights to encourage the economies of scale that exist.

MJV cannot compete on these fixed costs as a bigger proportion is labour

In life, bigger more streamlined businesses are able to offer better deals than the corner shop.

What is being suggested is subsidies from the regional or sometimes central governments to encourage airlines to bring passengers to smaller airports in order to spend their tourist Money to bolster the region.

In the boom years it was widely reported than Ryanair received in the region of 13euros per passenger landing at MJV from the Murcian authorities to encourage tourists to add to the tourist spend, encouraged no doubt by the likes of Polaris World and others.

This was a major incentive for many low cost airlines to use MJV at the height of the building boom.

These subsidies have existed in many European regional airports not just Spain, which is why Ryanair and others saw great potential in providing flights, getting paid to bring passengers in means you can reduce the price of the flight, until the subsidy disappears, which is presumably the case for Murcia as they want to encourage the opening of what was originally going to be a private, competitive venture taking share from MJV which they actually wanted shut to civil aircraft.

The problem was, AENA were busy expanding MJV which they controlled as there was sudden demand for more flights.

 Another case of complete breakdown in communication costing taxpayers even more money.

As I have explained before you cam actually visit the AENA website and they havce a section which lists all of the different deals amnd incentives to use particular airports, including Alicante and there are none for MJV

If of coutrse AENA had marketed and kept the flights going into MJV, which has a much lower cost base you would asume then of course they could compete

The FACTS remain is that AENA have run Murcia airport into the ground, with a total disregard for customers and profited from the expansion of Alicante and paaid the airlines big money to get them to use Alicante, these incentives are public domain information

As I said in a previous mail I am amazed that people would want to support this organisation that have let customers down so badly

Roy

No one is supporting AENA, on the contrary we are critical of all the authorities who may have saved taxpayers money, had they communicated travel policies. 

I am sorry but you underestimate the power of encouraging tourists

Yes AENA may want to encourage airlines to use certain airports but why expand MJV if they want airlines to use ALC.

AENA however receive no other benefit from the passengers arriving, the regional authorities on the other hand gain great benefits from tourists spending their pounds or euros in the businesses and developments in their region.

I can assure you that all over Europe, airlines have been offered subsidies and profited from regional governments to bring in passengers to smaller airports and many have later been withdrawn, leaving them losing tourism. FACT.

By supporting keeping MJV open without having AENA give any guarntees, on the terms which they operate under as far as the operating charges that they offer to airlines is supporting AENA and basically AENA have a monoply to do what they wish, heads or tails they win as proven by the fact that they are increasing passenger numbers, the people are going somewhere

Great question why did they spend taxpayers money to expand MJV, all of those Euro wasted by AENA with NO BENEFITS to the travelling customers

We are loosing people in this area not because of government payments but because of the AENA scheme and payments

AENAA's benefits the nore people that fly into their airports the more money they make, the more shops and restaurants they have in the airports the more money they make, what facilities are there at MJV paying AENA money, not many

We will have to agree to disagree Roy, as those tourists will spend far more in the local businesses, shops, bars, restaurants etc. and in the region than they will ever spend in duty free or airport cafes.

The regional government benefits most from subsidising tourists flying in.

In an ideal world wouldn't exist, AENA wouldn't have expanded Alicante, AENA wouldn't have run down San Javier and Corvera wouldn't exist and of course there would be plenty of people visiting this wonderful area, all year round enjoying the golf, beaches and restaurants, spending lots of money with everybody

We don't live in that world in Spain and the only real people that get screwed are the taxpayers and the businesses, nit the likes of AENA or the politicians

Here is an excerpt from Tumbit Spain which is just reiterating what everyone, except Roy, are saying.

"There is still no official announcement to confirm or deny whether the airlines flying into San Javier will transfer their operations to Corvera Airport, and with Alicante Airport being both more convenient to get to, Cheaper, and with a better range of flight frequencies and destinations, the logic that 100% of San Javiers (falling) passenger numbers will transfer to Corvera remains questionable."

Most, but not all, people are saying that if MJV closes they will choose Alicante over Corvera. Even if only 500,000 passengers opt for Alicante then how is Corvera ever going to make any money?  As everybody keeps on saying the airlines do not care where they land so long as it is cheap. Can the supporters of Corvera please explain why any airline would wish to go to Corvera when the landing fees will most probably be far higher than Alicante and its only 40 mins. drive away. Who is going to subsidise the flights that might opt for Corvera to get the landing fees equal to or even lower than Alicante?  As has been stated earlier any additional flights into Alicante will not cost the airport very much as all expenses such as 'rent', staff, utilities etc. etc. are already covered by the existing flights.  Every flight into Corvera will have to contribute to the circa €200 million loan, the building costs, the purchase of the land (which I understand has not been paid for yet or even a price agreed with the 'previous' owners) and all other setting up costs. Also as AENA or whoever runs it will have to pay 'rent' as it appears the Region of Murcia will be the freeholders where is this money coming from? The maths just do not add up and no amount of fudging by the politicians can disprove the rules of mathematics.

Surely now is the time to say farewell to Corvera airport and may it rest in peace

There is a demand for San Javier, ME for one!! I am coming out next month and have to fly into Alicante as the flights to Murcia are no available from Luton or Stansted at the times I need to be out there. I love flying into/ out of MJV and when we return, always spend time in the town beforehand or the bars up by Solmar rental area.

Being forced to Alicante, with the extra driving time and early flight times is not what I want, but am stuck with 

Mark

Surely this actually backs up exactly what I have been saying, AENA is susbidising the flights into Alicante in order drive traffic into that airport and the airlines don't care where they fly to as long as they are making a profit, it is AENA that is controlling the landing rates

How cam thay say that ,OST people are saying that they would not fly to Cirvera, perhaps they should say what the ACTUAL source of this information is, what did they do a poll, interview passengers who got off the planes, what a ridiculous unqualified statement to make, what about the thousands of passengers who fly and travel into the Murcia area every year

The main idea of the Corvera airport being private was to enable it to compete with the monolopy that AEAN have, to complete of fees

It isn't 40 minutes drive from Alicante to Mazarron, nearer 1.5 hours

this has been going on for so long time to give up - nothing anyone says or does will change anything

cock ups have been made, money has been spent, palms have been greased - nobody will be held to account time to move on, get over it - better things to do etc etc etc

flights have been reduced by the airlines into St Javier and Alicante over the years (why - market demand, other routes are more profitable) but still a reasonable good service

covera opening will not make a bit of difference to the number of flights etc

the airport will open when it opens (or not as the case maybe) come on does anyone really care that much?????