smoking ban

It has nothing to do with the smoking ban.

It started in 1967 with the Breathaliser Act.        Something I totally agree with.

Meanwhile from about 1970 the the bread and butter of a British pub, the older generation, started to stay home in the evenings and watch tv thus making way for a cash rich younger generation who unfortunately didn't show the same respect for alcohol as their parents had.

However it was the 1989 Lord Young's that started the death knell when it was decided that brewers couldn't brew and own more than 2,000 pubs. Until then most pubs were tied houses. Either with managers or tenants. Rents were reasonable and landlords kept properties in reasonable repair. After this report any pubs which would be requiring major refurbishment were sold off . Mainly in lots  to middle management brewery employees.

Rents for tenants rocketed and their alcoholic stock, which had to be purchased via the brewery, rose to cover the the fact the big brewers had lost income.

But worse was to come via Lord Young. All day opening and children permitted.

Since then pubs have had two ways to try and earn money. Either to become more food oriented or have bouncers on doors, children running wild, multiple tv screens, head banging music and let the alcopop brigade reign supreme.

And thereby hangs the demise of what once was the Great British pub. A predominately male domain, except on Saturday nights, where one could indulge in a cheap pint. Smoke. Play darts, crib,shoveha'penny. Tell risque jokes. Put the world to rights and feel safe walking home at closing time.

Smoking Ban ... Brilliant news!

Fantastic news for us that have had to put up with this imposition for to long. 

Sorry Smokers but many of you have no idea how annoying and antisocial (and unhrealthy) this is for others.

It has been brilliant in the UK and i look forward to the same effect in Spain .

Only hope that outdoors eating areas does not become an issue.  Here's to a segregated area outside too  Or prefably an outright ban within eating establishment premises internal and external please.

Are there any rules governing the inside/outside spaces that have shuttered roofs and/or  filled in sides as these establishments are very common on the Costas?

ONe Very Happy Chappy

Are there any rules governing the inside/outside spaces that have shuttered roofs and/or  filled in sides as these establishments are very common on the Costas?

Yes, as long as it has only two walls & a roof you can smoke in it. Around her mostthat have the rol-out awning roofs & curtain sides areb smoking areas . all the ones I have used this week all have  4 sides & are still classed as smoking areas. Last night the police were in & were qiute happy that it complied with the law.

Can I presume TP1 that you , with other like minded folk on this forum, will be at the forefront in banning all petrol/deisel vehicles in preference for an electric ones .Plus people  cycle or walk unless it is really really necessary to drive?  I will be generous and ssay Max 3 miles .   Because polution from smoking is mearly the tip of the iceberg.

Folk who insist on driving when they could easily walk or drive spewing out obnoxious fumes ,particularly over children in buggies, have no idea how extremely anti social that is.

... umm not quite sure what floella you are trying to make me fall into but what the hell ...

Yes, i must be like other like minded folk who would prefer alternative energy vehicles that were less poluting (but electric cars apparently cause pollution from the electricity that is generated to charge them ...  etc etc,  but in principle i am all for them ) ... and I would prefer to walk cycle wherever possible

Not to sure what it has to do with the smoking ban that this thread is all about to be honest but hey ho

Thank you for you reply gulsopez about  the roll-out awning area that maybe deemed to be a smoking area ... that's a great shame  ...

But overall, imho, a positive result enabling me and my family, and millions of others,  to be able to eat out without wafts of smelly, poluting smoke adourning us.  Is that so wrong floella?

Will give you a clue TP1  Polution is the link.

But you are certainly correct am sure we would all like to ' eat out without wafts of smelly, poluting smoke adourning us'  but it is rare to find a restaurant that is not near a busy road which is why I always prefer to dine inside.

Just playing devils advocate because am wondering if the anti smoking anywhere brigade are just against smokers or really are concerned about our enviroment and live their lives accordingly.       Somehow I think the jury out on that answer  

"Are there any rules governing the inside/outside spaces that have shuttered roofs and/or  filled in sides as these establishments are very common on the Costas?

Yes, as long as it has only two walls & a roof you can smoke in it. Around her mostthat have the rol-out awning roofs & curtain sides areb smoking areas . all the ones I have used this week all have  4 sides & are still classed as smoking areas. Last night the police were in & were qiute happy that it complied with the law."

I do not believe that a room with four walls and a roof all of awnings/curtains can legally allow smoking.  The underlying principle of the new law is the protection of workers in their workplace.  If bar staff are required to serve people in the sort of place you describe they are going to be subjected to secondary smoking just as much as if it were brick walls. The policia local might well allow it, but the guardia won't and it is the guardia's responsibility to enforce it.

My regular has always had the sort of attached room you describe and had no-smoking in the main bar but allowed it in the atached room.  Not any more.  No smoking there since 2 January.

Any customer can file a denuncia with guardia anonymously and it will be investigated.  €600 is the minimum fine for the bar owner for a first offence.  Three times and the fine will probably put him out of business. 

Latest update from Jumilla (inland Spain). 

Everybody here is obeying the smoking ban so far - possibly helped by the good weather over the last couple of days! - and the bars are as busy as ever. 

Last night we invited some British and Spanish friends round to our apartment for a Noche del Cava y Chocolates.  Only two people smoked, and they were happy to go outside onto our balcony to do so (we had a table and ash-trays outside, dropping a subtle hint!). 

Some friends drove us to our other friends' house for a meal on Tuesday night, and we noticed lots of people standing outside bars with cigarettes in their hands as we drove out of town. 

We went out for lunch today for menú del día and people were standing outside with cigarettes and there was a lovely smoke-free atmosphere inside the bar.  As a point of interest, there was a fair bit of rubbish on the floor near the bar, but we have been told that is a sign of a popular (and therefore good) bar.  Certainly the food there was excellent and good value (8€ for mdd).  A family were sitting near us with a child, and the father went outside to smoke, which surely is a good thing.

As non-smokers this is bliss!  By the way, we don't drive and either walk everywhere or, if going further afield, we catch the bus.

Sue

Likewise suemac. Everyone in my part of Murcia has conformed with gracious acceptance.  Although I have had to smile at the how some bar owners are trying to accommodate the smokers.

One has erected a small open sided tent complete with patio heater ,couple of tables and bar stools. Another was serving through an open window to people standing on the pavement. Guess it was cold for the punters inside though. Strangely enough in this particular bar have rarely ever seen a smoker . Perhaps some have taken it up in protest .

Goodness didn't think there was a household anywhere now that didn't own at least one car . Congrats.

  jek ; Here is a copy of the legislation, in english.    http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publish/article_28544.shtml

As you will see a roof & 2 walls  are allowed, as is 4 walls & no roof. The bar I used last night  has always had an outside retractable roof & on tuesday had fitted 3 canvas sides. The 3 policia local that inspected it last night were more than happy. A wall is a self-supporting structure, normally of stone, brick or block-work & Capable of supporting superstructure. Canvas sides do not constitute 'walls' otherwise they'd let you build your house out of them ! 

If you look under punishments you will see that enforcement is nothing to do with the Guardia & is policia local, environmental health or health departments duty to inspect & control.

Sorry gus but that is not a copy of the law - it's a summary of main points, of which there are loads on a google search now.  So all you have is the view of the local plods that your four walled tent is ok.  I suspect that they are wrong. 

You've got to laugh...

'The new anti-smoking law nearly killed me'

Something to think about ????

Re: Something to think about

I think ... even if you do kid yourself that it does you no harm ... it still stinks and is antisocial (and potentially harmful) to others

Re: Something to think about

It's a killer, an addiction, does nobody any good, and at best waste's money and ruins health........That's the main thing to think about!

Not condoning or agreeing with statements made I am a non Smoker but I also believe that freedom of choice is important and false information or tactics are WRONG and shoiuld be highlighted.

Have a nice day all

They are not depriving anyone of their liberties.   This smoking ban is purely ensuring that people who where at risk ( staff / other customers / children ) are no longer at risk through passive smoking.  Gotta be good surely?

Smokers still have the choice to go outside and smoke. 

bbbreakfast, I can't believe you are arguing about whether banning smoking in pubs and restaurants is right or wrong. Now that everybody in the UK is used to this law, even smokers generally agree it is better. Most smokers I know are happy going outside for a smoke; even in the sub-zero temperatures we have been getting lately.

I also have a friend who doesn't believe in wearing seatbelts when driving. Who will pay for his hospital treatment when he has an accident? I think the public in general should have some say over what is reasonable, and freedom of choice is not always right.

There are many twisted individuals in society who would like the freedom of choice to do what they want to do. Sometimes you have to create laws to prevent them for the good of the masses.

 ok the ban has is here yes!

Why every one is still going on about it 

As far as i can see every 1 is abiding bu the law, which you can expect if you will be facing a fine..

As is the the same in the uk!

Clean breathing comes to mind....but then it wont be the same out side... lol

Jeanie 

bbbreakfast, I take it that you also believe that the earth is flat and that God made it in six days and took Sunday off.