smoking ban

regarding your quip about lack of evidence when refusing to pay - Mobile phones have cameras.!

That's the quickest way to get yourself arrested ! It's illegal to photograph police officers & they will take the camera & delete them & if you're lucky they won't arrest you! That's one thing they're red hot on.

We've also got plenty of non-smoking bars & restaurants around here that conform to it !

The answer should be seperate smoking & non-smoking bars, rigidly enforced but it's not really about that but control over the population with more & ever increasing rules & laws designed to chip away at the fabric of democracy , little by little.It's far easier to target the law abiding that to arrest the criminals , be it smoking, gun laws, carrying of knives,etc. The eventual plan is a euro state where everyone conforms or they will probably disappear whilst the scum & criminals will carry on as normal under the radar.

We've all got to die at some time & whether or not you think it will be made earlier by passive smoking , benzene fumes or some other reason doesn't really have any bearing. You'll be going anyway as that was when you were destined to die.

waterdog

so sorry to hear that. I didn't realise it was still that bad?.  So despite some on the forum doing the decent thing, it sounds like most in Spain don't respect others rights to good health?, and probably defend their right to ruin others health under the ''freedom of choice''  banner?. Some freedom for the victims?, their only option is to stay away! 

Until bar and restaurant owners have the balls to risk losing a few smokers in the short term (but then attracting back those like you) by making more places non-smoking, then it's hard to see much changing fast unless the new laws are taken seriously?. 

guslopez said

''The answer should be seperate smoking & non-smoking bars, rigidly enforced but it's not really about that but control over the population with more & ever increasing rules & laws designed to chip away at the fabric of democracy , little by little.It's far easier to target the law abiding that to arrest the criminals , be it smoking, gun laws, carrying of knives,etc. The eventual plan is a euro state where everyone conforms or they will probably disappear whilst the scum & criminals will carry on as normal under the radar.

We've all got to die at some time & whether or not you think it will be made earlier by passive smoking , benzene fumes or some other reason doesn't really have any bearing. You'll be going anyway as that was when you were destined to die.''

I don't think It has anything to do with chipping away at democracy, but everything to do with consideration for your own and more importantly others well being. When gun laws, smoking laws, cruelty,  justice  laws, etc are clearly wrong, they need changing for any civalised country to move forward. it doesn't  mean it's turning in to a nanny state, that's just propoganda from those who won't accept much needed change. Same with the old   ''we have all got to die sometime''.  Just denial of the damage smoking does and the results for so many who have suffered horrendous suffering  and early death because of it.

Goodstitch - you are eloquent.  You stated the fact succinctly and nothing more needs to be said.

 Some interesting comments on a day when a UK  MP calls for drugs like heroin, cocaine and marijuana to be legalised.  

Ban the car entirely, is what I say.  Dirty, horrible, polluting things.  You wouldn't get the problems of smoking, drinking, answering the phone, changing gears and not using seat belts whilst driving then nor the hypocrisy of no smoking but I can pump as many noxious fumes into the air as I like when I'm doing the shopping.

And, on the Costa Blanca at least, the driving without seat belts, no kiddy restraints or using mobile phones is taken very seriously by the local police.  Same as the "No no-smoking restaurants".  Definitely in the wrong part of Spain then because at least six restaurants in Quesada on the main street alone are no smoking.  At least two of the bars are smoking outside only and no parent should take a kiddy into a smoking bar anyway as it against the law.  If a bar has a "Se puede fumar" sticker up, then kids under 18 are not allowed and this is pretty well enforced around this area.

 and the same in Algorfa, Bob.

As usual its the people that don't live here that are spouting on about rules that will never affect them.

I have 2 bars within 10 seconds walk of the office, one is smoking and the other is strictly non smoking.........its really easy once you know which side of the street to be on, you make a very simple choice.

and yes i have seen the same in Quesada myself, i think people ignore the facts and just like to preach.........

I don't think It has anything to do with chipping away at democracy, but everything to do with consideration for your own and more importantly others well being. When gun laws, smoking laws, cruelty,  justice  laws, etc are clearly wrong, they need changing for any civalised country to move forward. it doesn't  mean it's turning in to a nanny state, that's just propoganda from those who won't accept much needed change. Same with the old   ''we have all got to die sometime''.  Just denial of the damage smoking does and the results for so many who have suffered horrendous suffering  and early death because of it.

So the Uk's got more guns & gun crime than it ever had before they were " banned ". The same with knives & knife crime . The most snooped upon poulation on the planet ,  a place where the innocent householder can't protect his own property without being arrested  & where the scum still run out of control & the situation is worse now than it was before all these measures were introduced . If that's what changing for the better is then you are clearly deluded . I gave up & left years ago , never to return.I'm not denying that smoking causes health problems & we've been down this road before. Just because someone smokes doesn't mean they don't exercise or keep fit . Personally I'd ban tobacco altogether & put up taxes to compensate for the loss of  tax revenue. Your going to die on the same day & date as you always will, regardless of attempts to lengthen it by caring for yourself.

 If anyone should complain about smoking it's my wife.  She is a lifetime non-smoker whereas I am a mere ex (and only for a couple of years).  However, she doesn't bother about it.  We do, and always have done, picked non-smoking restaurants but she has never minded about going to a pub afterwards when there are smokers there.  Even though I am an ex, we still go to the smoking pubs in Spain as they appear to be a bit more lively than those where there is a total ban.

I don't really think upping taxes to compensate for lost revenue would help as taxes (if I've done my sums right) would have to rise almost 10%, not a happy prospect.  The Spanish have cottoned onto the fact that upping taxes on smokers might help them stop which is a good thing.  Come January, the cost of a packet of cigarettes in Spain will be virtually the same as UK.  The French, of course, have simply ignored it.  I did mention Holland now allows smoking in certain bars and I see that Belgium also changed the law to allow bars to have smoking provided adequate ventilation is supplied.  I don't really think that works and separate areas would be the way to go.  A friend of mine in UK, a non-smoker, stopped going to pubs in UK as his friends smoked and he got fed up sitting inside whilst his mates were outside.  In some states in the US, you will often see people with one foot in the bar and one outside because it's illegal to smoke inside and illegal to drink outside.  (Not all states, of course.  California doesn't allow smoking outside either whereas Utah allows smoking inside buildings if they have a workforce of less than 20).

I'm afraid that whenever this subject comes up, you do get a lot of, shall we say, pontificating.  Mainly from ex-smokers, I must admit, so if I come on and say you smokers are ruining my health it'll be time to slap me round the head and tell me to get on with my life.  (The offer to come and have a fag on my balcony is still extant, by the way, and I'll even provide the beer).

guzlopez said

'Your going to die on the same day & date as you always will, regardless of attempts to lengthen it by caring for yourself.''
 

Only someone in denial of truth would make a statement like that.  Giving up smoking, and starting regular exercise could well add years to your life, and better still, a better quality of life.

Each to his/her own though. I'n not preaching, just pointing out a fact that can't be denied.

Your going to die on the same day & date as you always will, regardless of attempts to lengthen it by caring for yourself.''

This is nothing to do with smoking or anything else . Nor is it denial. When your born the date your going to die is already fixed & there's nothing you can do about,it. Have you ever thought that some people don't want to live longer ? Some are just making the numbers up until they die wondering what it's all about ?

Didn't see too many of you people that are going to be making up the numbers after January 2nd , down the bar earlier ? Thought you might be getting in some training ! lol. -2ºc it was , not going to stand outside in that are they ? Still the suns coming out now & it'll be another lovely day .

Well doctors now think that being overweight is worse for you than smoking, so I reckon we should keep smoking in the the bars and make those who want to eat go outside. I hate it when Im forced to eat other peoples leftovers

philevans

well  joking apart,  no doubt about weight causing problems. The three most important questions from health experts are always, do you smoke?, are you overweight?, do you get regular exercise?. If you can get those basic things about right, then you are at least giving yourself the best chance of a long and healthy life.

guslopez

your theory on when you die fits in very nicely with those who prefer not to use any will power with regards to keeping themself fit and healthy. Either that or you are on some very strong weed?

those smokers who are angry at the tightening up of the smoking laws here should remember.  A perfectly fair and workable law was introduced in January 2006.  with consessions to both smokers and non-smokers.  The smoker weren't happy and decided to ignore it with the result that it became impossible for non-smokers to exercise 'choice' as there simply were no non-smoking bars or restauarants. (at least not on the costa del sol)  the size rules and under 18 rules were not enforced and it was business as usual.  For this reason the government has decided that nothing short of a total ban, with no 'grey areas open to mis-interpretation' is the only way to go. 

You didn't  accept  minor restrictions it in 2006 now you will have to get used to no smoking at all

Even if I believed that tosh about a due date to die, and I don't.  It is not about the health issues, it is about the obnoxious smell, and the irritation to eyes and throat which even if it were harmless, as most smokers claim, it spoils my enjoyment of a social occasion be it a restaurant meal or just a drink with friends..

This message was last edited by waterdog on 17/12/2010.

From a simple question that I put up about the date for the introduction of the new rules (good or bad) this thread has become the object of insults. Ist it really necessary?

.........what do you mean ya' knobhead!!!

.........only joking Benicarlo. It's a subject that many feel strongly about, so always gets a little heated. I think this time though it's mainly friendly 'tonque-in-cheek'  banter?.

 Just back from our christmas meal,memebers of staff is 50/50 split smokers/non smokers.

Had a beautiful meal in a Spanish owned, predominantly spanish frequented restaurant.

Completely no smoking throughout, it was my choice to go there because i prefer non smoking although i smoke.

I am not sure how we stumbled across it considering they do not exist,thats 6 in the village now,you never know it may catch on!?

Merry christmas.

georgia

that's good to hear. Sounds like the message is getting through well in some areas at least.

Waterdog,  " it is about the obnoxious smell, and the irritation to eyes and throat which even if it were harmless, as most smokers claim, it spoils my enjoyment of a social occasion be it a restaurant meal or just a drink with friends.." So you obviously don't get the people covered in pig slurry in the places you frequent  that the smoke fumes at least partially blocks out !