The Iron Lady - Did you love her or hate her?

At the time the country was in deep crap.  I was a Tory activist, (which wasn't easy), in Scotland and she did sort it out.  However, looking back, at what cost?  Many lives were ruined throughout large swathes of the country.  Our manufacturing base was decimated, although I agree much of it was old fashioned and redundant, or so we thought at the time.  However, her economic miracle was floated on a huge pool of North sea oil and it was that, that saved the country, not Maggies thatcher.

Male or Femail it matters not.

We have have had two truly great P.M.s in my lifetime.

Churchill and Thatcher.

Without either we would have been much the worse.

"However, her economic miracle was floated on a huge pool of North sea oil and it was that, that saved the country, not Maggies thatcher."

Nice to see that not everyone was fooled.

There's also the selling off every core industry and service and leaving a much reduced manufacturing jobs base for future generations. And no, they were not all unproductive by any means. It was a short-sighted decision to sell the family silver and have a politically expedient party rather than embark on the much more difficult, slow and politically suicidal process of cleaning it. 

How's that short-term gain to fund very ephemeral tax breaks and re-election campaigns working out for the UK now? Everyone who could and can leave - has and will.

By definition, they will be people with skills, money or both. Guess how that loss in skills, spending power and tax revenue has to be recouped and how many more unskilled substitutes are needed to make up those shortfalls? Answer: Too many.

So, the deficits that can't be rebalanced with Immigration, have to be made up with ever-increasing mountains of debt. That is then aided, abetted and fuelled by an increasingly irresponsible and now undeniably, criminal financial sector - which she unleashed  - and to which every successive government is now subservient.  

In short, give me a few £trillion that I can leave for someone else to repay and I'll show you a good time too.  It is NOT an achievement. Anyone could do that.

The party stopped but the repayment has even't begun in earnest yet. It's at least, the next two generations who will realise Maggie's real legacy - not us who will be long gone when the SHTF in full force. 

Cameron, when speaking about the rioters a couple of years ago, said: "These people have to realise that there are consequences to their actions which may not be felt for many years". Oh! The irony - or should that be 'The hypocrisy'? 

The fact that the full effects of the problems caused by previous governments do not filter down to the country as quickly as say, a Miners' strike or a riot, does not make their mistakes any more forgiveable or less painful. In fact, they do far, far more damage than any rioters or Miners could ever hope to do and are actually the 'cause' of that eventual and inevitable 'Blowback'.

I am not a Maggie hater. She did get some things right - e.g. curbing the Unions' abuse of power. But let's face it, it'd be hard NOT to get something right over a 10/11 year span in power. Nor am I a 'Lefty'. I find them just as offensive and in the case of Blair, even more so. He took Maggie's 'lust for power' and added 'spineless' and 'psychopathic'.  A pox on all their houses, if you will. However, both debit and credit should be given where they're due. The full debit account for Maggie has not only been miscalculated by her supporters but it will not/can not be fully reconciled for many years - if ever. 

This message was last edited by JD01 on 13/04/2013.

I think the character of this lady is best summed up by a quote heard on question time

When attending a dinner with members of her cabinet.

 The waiter brought her meat and asked what about the vegetables?

To which she replied, They will have the same

Horrible, destructive, selfish, greedy woman. Glenda Jackson had it exactly right in her speech in the Commons - one of the few Labour MPs not to spinelessly accept Miliband's cowardly refusal to place any checks on the Cameron's nauseating orgy that had even Buckingham Palace raising an eyebrow.

As for 'saving Britain from collapse', what nonsense. She smashed the unions and now look at the state of the labour market in Britain - unemployment permanently high, 'zero-hours contracts' in abundance, and millions of people on such pathetic wages that the taxpayer has to subsidise their income with benefits. So she didn't shrink the state in smashing the unions - she just made sure that the taxpayer would subsidise their exploitation of the workers.

As Glenda said, she promoted greed and selfishness as if they were virtues and made it a sin to be poor.

"There is no such thing as society" - Thatcher, 1980.

"There is no such thing as Thatcher" - Society, 2013.

Reading today that the PP in Madrid want to name a street after her.

                                                                            Iron Lady, may she rust in peace!

So he wasn't a terrorist then? And did Maggie not say the ANC was a terrorist organisation and not that Mandela was himself although allegedly he founded the MK ,a militant wing of ANC and led a bombing campaign against government targets. So just like Martin McGuinness no terrorist just a freedom fighter.

It's amazing how someone like Maggie Thatcher is pilloried and vilified by so many and someone like Mandela is held in such high esteem.

DIBSY - Not wishing to go off topic.

BUT is is often conveniently forgotten that Mr Mandella

often gave speaches to encourage the killing of White's

in South Africa..

What a load of old tosh spoken about someone who hasn't been in power for what 25 years or so, since she left all the following governments have had ample time to fix the problems, face it they ALL seem to have these such wonderful ideas to get the country up and running again but has it happened, has it hell.

 Loved her resolve and courage abroad - despised and hated her policys at home .

.....since she left all the following governments have had ample time to fix the problems,

I don't think anyone's disputing that the governments we've had since have been woefully lacking but why did they have the problems to fix in the first place. Who put those problems there that you so readily acknowledge existed after Thatcher?  With what commensurate windfall do they fix them as quickly as they were created if the assets from the first windfall have been squandered? 

e.g. If you inherit some money and spend it all on self-aggrandizement and gaining popularity (masquerading as being in the  country's and public's long-term interests), are you absolved of any and all blame when your heirs have nothing left to make the repairs that you didn't take care of, or retain a fund for? As the deficits (both in financial and human terms) continue to mount, is it really reasonable to expect a repair of the problems when the now, much reduced income, can't even service the debt?    

Yes, What a load of old tosh is spoken by those who can't join dots if they span more than two episodes of Eastenders. 

What a load of tosh has been written about Maggie Thatcher.    So much mis-information regarding her actions.

I listened to Ken Clarke on Question Time and he said, she was as sharp as a razor when it came to her cabinet meetings and when they were arguing any political stance with her.  When they were debating political issues she would challenge them down to the minutist detail and god help them if they were not "up" on their subject because she was !

She was a giant of a person, she divided the country because she was charged with the job of dragging the UK into the 20th century, something none of the men of "her time", or now in fact had the guts to do.   All that has happened since her death has been the continual winding down of the UK in every respect.

I was in my twenties during her premiership and I remember a world where you could get a job easily, get trained without having to go to UNI and work your way "up the ladder" of success.  I went from working as a clerical admin to becoming a Personal Confidential Secretary, we got married and bought our first house.     My mother was able to buy her council house, because Maggie believed in people helping themselves and this was the only asset my mother ever owned but was proud to death of it.   There was no need for working tax credits, housing benefit, the nannying state.   You stood on your own two feet and she made you proud to do so.

Many people who are enjoying a relaxing retirement today care of money they earned during their careers was down to her initiatives of modernising companies and improving employment law to enable people to earn a living without a communist stronghold over their lives through the unions.

She had guts and determination and it was needed at the time, she even put the EU in its place, something none of our gutless leaders have managed to do, or who even have the courage to try.

The protests by people now singing and celebrating, it is noted said nothing whilst she was here to defend herself, but waited until they can "dance on her grave", mainly people who never knew her, were never even alive in the 70's, never knew of her achievements, never lived through those horrific times in the 70's where there were 2 or 3 elec cuts a week, rubbish heaped everywhere on the streets, no dead being buried and even the whole of the Public Sector were striking, hospitals the lot.   All they think they know is the hatred a small minority of people have for her (their parents) who lost jobs through companies who were closed down when they would not modernise or become competitive.

I wish we had a leader like her now, we would be telling the EU where to go, Milliband would be put down like the dithering, snivelling idiot he is along with Ed Balls in Parliamentary Question Time and she would once more put the Great back in Britain.

A sad loss of a great patriot.

I wrote this.

What a load of old tosh spoken about someone who hasn't been in power for what 25 years or so, since she left all the following governments have had ample time to fix the problems, face it they ALL seem to have these such wonderful ideas to get the country up and running again but has it happened, has it hell.

It seems perhaps i didn't explain myself enough, i meant  what a load of old tosh spoken about her on here regarding the the bad mouthing of her.

And to JDO1 get your facts correct, Maggie didn't inherit the country's money or squander it, the pot was almost empty when she came into power, she made it, not wasted it like blair on Iraq and Afghanistan....Oops sorry forgot brown and the billions he lost on our gold.

Know nothing about programmes you watch, Eastenders and such.

It's absolutely amazing when you read on this forum the amount of people that did not like her or even hated her. When you chat in a pub much the same, in the office much the same. Where are all these people like me who thought she did OVERALL  a great job? Show yourselves. Now i know that the old saying the MAJORITY are not always right but generally speaking you will find that the majority are normally right. So dont forget that the people of the UK put her in power 3 times on the trot and 2 of them were LANDSLIDES. The nation could have dumped her on the 2nd or 3rd occasion but did not. I wonder why. The proof of the pudding is in the eating. We are all human beings and even with the best intentions make mistakes and she was no different but a great prime minister never-the-less.

Argentina. Attacked OUR Falklands island and we responded and reclaimed it. END OF STORY. They wont try again unless of course they are that stupid, which i doubt.

When i was younger an elderly ex miner was talking to me and said a young man once worked down the mine with him and his fellow miners and the young man was 18 and he was the most obnoxious, self opinionated, loud mouthed, cocky, little know all that you could ever hope NOT to meet. Yes you've got it. It was Arthur Scargill. Say no more.

So at least Maggie got the above 2 right amongst many other things.

Maybe one day the UK may have another great prime minister like Winston and Maggie but for sure i would not hold your breath.

Rest in peace Maggie.

I sat back as a child and watched with amusment the fighting, the strikes and the Unions arguing over greed! always wanting more, more,more!

This is an example BTW for those who dont understand the fundamentals of business.

Take 1 cake

Some people need a slice.

If you deliver the slice of cake on time and at the right price youll keep and have customers. Simples!

Oh but wait a mo, here endeth the peace, the unions.We want what hes got! Why should he get it all?! we arnt going to slice up the cake and deliver it unless we get what we want!

In the mean time all your customers have been let down ( no cake) so they go to Japan for cake as they also found cheaper cake which is delivered on time and without intervention and so they decide to sign 5 year contracts for a fixed price.

The cake slicer' actually work for the Gov, as the cake is solely owned by the Gov. Who as you know, never ever mess with the Gov as you will always loose.

In the mean time the cake slicers decide to back to work due to heavy handed tachtics by the 'POLICE' using probable Gov polycies.

But the cake slicers find that no one wants their cake anymore and that they have very few customers.

Well you know whats coming ? if you dont then this stories meant for you :)

There is no work for the slicers and we're going to have to close down the cake factory.

The Unions who always work in cahoots with the Labour party arm of the Gov have a wonderful propaganda machine and put all the blame on the Tories, and Who gets the flack? the leader of the Tories.

Go back to begining of the story and you'll find the outcome and whom to blame?

The greedy people who want what hes got.Thats whos to blame

Hey, there is a simpler version of this story, The dog and the bone.

The people who understand this story are my type of people, not through any riduclous political party, before you have me shot at dawn, but people who simply understand common sense.