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"Who says Britain would kick out existing EU citizens living in Britain? I've never seen that stipulated by any party." Because immigration is what got UKIP their votes in the recent council elections, and what has got the Conservatives in a pickle. OK the people who complain about immigration do differentiate between different nationalities, but it is harder for laws to differentiate. One of the triggers (for those who complain about immigration) is the eastern EU member states. The only way to address this, if the UK leaves the EU, is to remove the right to stay in the UK from all EU citizens. I can't see how they could ask - say - Romanians to leave but allow Spaniards to stay.
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I tend to agree with the majority here.
Spain would treat us fairly and we would still have rights and privileges just like now: Wealth Declaration on worldwide assets, Patrimonio tax of worldwide assets, income tax on income derived from work and contributions in other countries, new regulations to obstruct owners who want to let their holiday properties etc. etc.
And as long as they keep the reciprocal health arrangements they will still get £3,500 p.a. per person from the NHS for each Brit registered for treatment in Spain.
So nothing will change really I guess !!!!
This message was last edited by johnzx on 17/05/2013.
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But no party has said that. You're putting words in their policies that aren't there. Even UKIP hasn't said they'd expel all EU citizens. I don't think that would be too popular with Farage's missus as she's a German. Stopping benefits for non British would be as far as it may go. There are far more non-EU people in UK anyway. As I said, no-one knows what would happen but misinformed guesses seem all the (fa) rage.
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Spain would treat us fairly and we would still have rights and privileges just like now:
How would you have "rights", precisely? Rights are derived from laws that grant them. Those laws apply only to EU Citizens - which of course, you would no longer be...
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But no party has said that. You're putting words in their policies that aren't there. Even UKIP hasn't said they'd expel all EU citizens.
I quote what they have said below. They say that after seven years residence, EU Citizens in the UK would be eligible to apply for leave to remain IF they "fulfill certain criteria" (unspecified) and are eligible to apply for work permits.
How many do you think that leaves? Apply it in reverse. Do you qualify?
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And you really think UKIP will form the next government? Or the one after that? And, yes, I think if I stayed here 7 years I would meet the criteria. I get nothing from the Spanish government, I don't claim benefits here so am hardly a drain on resources. If healthcare stopped, I would have to look into private insurance. If that were too expensive I may have to rethink. However, the way it's going, I don't think there'll even be a referendum.
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However, the way it's going, I don't think there'll even be a referendum.
The way things are going there may not be an EU by 2017
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I do not think UKIP will form a government, as it happens, but I do think their xenophobic policies are becoming ever more pervasive and are influencing other parties who might form a government. As such, it is important to recognise the trends. The popular press in the UK is constantly pushing an anti-EU, anti-immigration message, and it is clearly having an effect.
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17 May 2013 8:15 PM
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Until we know what "improved terms of EU membership" would be sought by the government of the time ( in 2017) as a general election is planned. No referendum could be implemented before then, its absolutely impossible for anyone to come to any sensible conclusion.
Just a general guide would be welcomed as follows :-
OPTION 1........ If we stay in the EU ... what if anything would happen.
OPTION 2 If we leave the EU .... what changes would happen.
So, the whole question is up in the air until then as far as im concerned.. but I have to say im pro european membership.
No Doubt, the same questions will be asked about the Scottish Referendum Yes or No vote. , and to me it will be a sad day if Scotland ever leaves the UK. When it comes to the crunch all those daming EEC membership and regards Scotland, ties with the rest of Britain everyone will need to know the facts in full before they go to the ballet box . ......
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Until we know what "improved terms of EU membership" would be sought by the government of the time ( in 2017) as a general election is planned. No referendum could be implemented before then, its absolutely impossible for anyone to come to any sensible conclusion.
Just a general guide would be welcomed as follows :-
OPTION 1........ If we stay in the EU ... what if anything would happen.
OPTION 2 If we leave the EU .... what changes would happen.
So, the whole question is up in the air until then as far as im concerned.. but I have to say im pro european membership.
No Doubt, the same questions will be asked about the Scottish Referendum Yes or No vote. , and to me it will be a sad day if Scotland ever leaves the UK. When it comes to the crunch all those daming EEC membership and regards Scotland, ties with the rest of Britain everyone will need to know the facts in full before they go to the ballet box .
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Re my post at 10.09 17th May.
"Spain would treat us fairly and we would still have rights and privileges just like now :-
Wealth Declaration on worldwide assets:
Patrimonio tax on worldwide assets:
income tax on income derived from work and contributions in other countries:
new regulations to obstruct owners who want to let their holiday properties:
Second home tax:
etc. etc. "
Just to clarify it for some: It was of course an example of Sarcasm
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Just yesterday a British friend in the financial services industry had this to say:
1) The UK has little manufacturing for export, it is primarily an economy based on services and service jobs;
2) Financial services would shift from London to Frankfurt; Frankfurt would replace London as the economic and financial center for Europe;
3) Europe would boycott the UK, trading and transacting only with its partners.
4) The UK would become isolated and the economy would decline much farther than it has.
All possible.
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I don't believe that E.U. nationals would ever be expeled from the UK if GB left the EU.
Since 2004 when the Eastern Europeans came over things have greatly changed. Take the service & leisure industries for example, the Poles came over to work as kitchen porters or care assistants, & through hard work & adult vocational learning have now risen to middle / higher management levels, many are buying their own homes & puting money aside to send their children to uni.
GB can't afford to lose these new citizens & IMO they will play an ever increasing roll in business & our future prosperity, much the same as the Jews did all those years ago.
So, I believe that if we don't kick out the E.U. immigrants then other countries won't kick out the ex.pats.
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It never ceases to amaze me how the 'little Britisher' seems to feel that Britain leaving the EU is fine and dandy, but can't understand why Scotland would want to leave Britain for exactly the same reasons.
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DonLochnagar,
What do you think would happen if at the same time as a Scotish vote on independance, the English, Welsh, & N. Irish were given a vote on whether Scotland should be able to remain part of the UK?
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Wodger, first off all I don't think the Scots will vote for independence. There are too many Unionist forces lined up against them, the media, Government etc. when the time comes they will be scared out of taking their own destiny in their hands. I honestly think however, that if the rest of the UK, well let's keep the Welsh out of it, had the vote on Scottish independence they would vote against. The Scottish economy is and has been, contributing more to the British economy than it is getting out. That's why the British establishment is desperate to keep us together.
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Icaru.
Sorry to disagree with item 1. The u.k has little manufacturing for export. It is primarily an economy based on sevices and sevice jobs.
Google: United kingdom exports and you will see that in March 2013 the u.k exported 41,316 million pounds worth of goods. Well i would not call that, THE U.K HAS LITTLE MANUFACTURING FOR EXPORT, would you?
Item 2. I cannot for the life of me seeing London's economic and financial centre, one of the largest in the world being transferred from the 1 square mile in the city of London to anywhere let alone Frankfurt.
If the u.k left the E.U why would Europe boycott them? If their prices were competative, delivery dates on time and product quality good, Europe would buy. They would not boycott them just because they were not one of them. Europe buys from the states, China etc., and they are not in Europe. Business is business.
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If England left the EU and Scotland left the United Kingdom (neither of them allowing me to vote on the issue, since I've lived in
Spain too long), then I think that Scotland would try to join Europe and as for me, I'd be trying to get a Scottish passport.
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Don't worry , all you lucky people who live in Spain , The UK will never leave the EU , we have lost our way big time , full of no hopers, leader's who have no guts, who never tell us the truth about the state of our economy, we who still live on this small overcrowded island are so fed up with every day life. we will all vote to stay in the EU, which offers us the only chance to escape our fate.
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I believe sometimes people forget how lucky we are when moaning about life in the EU, life in the UK and life in Spain. Spare a thought for people who risk their lives trying to get away from dictatorships and hell in the countries they live in .
For hundreds of years the british, Irish, spanish, french, dutch etc spread their empires around the globe and now that some others seek to try their luck and better their lives in another country thousands of people are up in arms. Hense the rise of UKIP... Close the borders they all cry !!. Leave the EU ..
Time changes everything, but always remember WE started mass emigration .
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