| The Comments |
Gillespie, Yes agree with you, and still cannot understand why something like this is not in place. Ok too late for the likes of us, but something needs putting in place and not just for the foreigners, the Spanish are affected to. If we lesser mortals can see the way forward , ( I personally dont think we are the lesser mortals, I think they are , it is just a figure of speech) why cant the people running the country see !!!  makes me angryyyyyyyyyyyyy
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I have not seen any more reaction for a couple of days and if we really want to do something we must keep the anger going. We are today writing to our MP and all the MEP's for our area. I don't live in hope of much action, but if you don't try, nothing will happen. As the National Lottery says "You must be in it to win it". This is just a first shot; we are now looking for the e-mail addresses of those likely to be more influential, so if anyone has useful e-mail addresses, can you please publish them? I have also seen open letters to the European Parliament, again, I don't know how much good it will do, but I am willing to try.
Please don't make it too late for people like Janny, if we have the interest and will to succeed we are 50% of the way home and don't forget the other old lottery addage "It could be you"!
Also, there is the issue of a fund. The only person I can think of to hold any money would be Justin at EOS. I don't underestimate the difficulties we face in getting this done, but how about it Justin, are you willing to give it a try?
Mike & Gloria
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Yes we all need to keep on with this. In our area we have been trying to set up an action group, well we have set it up but at present there are only 5 members that are regular and keen, people are still very wary of coming forward. We also want to use our group also as a place where people can come and discuss their housing problems , without having to pay anything , or sign bits of paper , and once they start talking who knows , I am sure they will then join us, knowing that it could be them.......next
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Mike and Gloria , yes , re the fund, Justin at EOS would seem like the perfect choice, if he would like to do it.
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_______________________
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Suzanne on the other forum who also has the Spanish Property Scandal Petition was in touch with Michael Cashman last year, not about this matter obviously, but about the state of the Spanish property market in general. I believe he was helpful, although unable to do anything about the situation. May be worth a few other people contacting him again? This is a quote from one of the posters:
"Michael Cashman spoke about the case on Radio 4 this evening. He said: Don't think once, don't think twice. Think ten times before buying a property in Spain. He is on the case of thousands of people caught up in the Spanish property debacle. He says it could go to the European Courts of Human Rights in Strasbourg."
On the other site as well was an email address for the "main man" at the Junta de Andalucia. As it has already been in the public domain, I see no problem with posting it again: manuel.chaves@juntadeandalucia.es. There is another email address under "contact Me" on their site, which is jacg.averroes@juntadeandalucia.es. I emailed the latter, but got no response!!
Mark
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Hello All
Does anyone know if there is more security of a property if it has a mortgage rather than paying cash?
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Hi Gina,
The common sense answer to you question would seem to be yes, but does common sense apply to Spain ?
It doesn't seem to matter how many lawyers are involved things still go wrong. I can't believe that at least some people who's homes face demolition haven't got outstanding mortgages, can you? Obviously whatever happens the banks will still be owed the money!
Perhaps anyone in this situation could let us know.
Gloria
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It is a good question - the current tinking is if you have a mortgage, it is effectively a loan that is secured on the property as an assett. If it is demolished, in theory the bank can claim against you for the outstadning debt! But in that case, one would say surely - ok mr bank, I cant pay you - have the property!
They will still take the land I suppose!!
This is the problem in Marbella. I know people who cannot afford the mortgages and are letting repossession happen. In which case if there is no licence on the property, it cannot be resold until there is, so the bank will end up with a stock of these!!
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Quite frankly m'dear, I don't give a damn!
www.herbalmarbella.com
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Perhaps that's a good thing, Rixxy. If the banks are affected they may be more inclined to fight this. After all the land is not going to be worth that much without permission to build. My guess is though that they will still expect mortgagees to cough up.
Gloria
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Yes that will be their fist recourses, but if people havent got the money it will be a debt payable at 5 euros a week!!!
And what if that person goes bankrupt? Where does that leave the banks!
_______________________
Quite frankly m'dear, I don't give a damn!
www.herbalmarbella.com
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In terms of action, has anybody any ideas of what we could actually do that would make some sort of impact here? There are thousands of homes earmarked for demolition. It's just mind boggling and it's difficult to see where to start.
We should certainly keep this thread running and post ideas and suggestions. I'm up for anything and I've already got some media contacts lined up to follow us wherever we go!
But I think we need to act fast before more people suffer the same fate.
Justin
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Schools in Spain Guide | The Expat Files | Learn Spanish | Earn a living in Spain
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Justin,
as I said to you in an email yesterday, we would be up for revising the administrative file which ended up in the demolition to see if any illegality, irregularity has been committed by the Administration and if there is any possibility to find any liabilities.
Just send the paperwork to us for a revision,
Best regards,
Maria L. de Castro
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Maria L. de Castro, JD, MA
Lawyer
Director www.costaluzlawyers.es
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I was also horrified in regard to that unjustified demolition!!
WE must take action now with a home owners union formed and arrange an initial protest, maybe a march to the jda's office in almeria, creating publicity etc .
I am horrified that the Mayor in Vera is still in a job and the unsuspecting couple are out home and pocket.
Is this man not interested in the Tourism and Real Estate business in his homeland!! which contributes a massive amount to his countries economy?
I also have a newly built apartment in Al andalusas, Thalassa in Playa Vera, I am now wandering if this is safe!!!
Justin, please help us to arrange some sort of protest as we need act together, all the ex pats in Spain need their voices heard , NOW!!!
Regards
Noel
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In todays e-mail from Justin he wisely advised everyone considering purchasing a property in Spain to find a GOOD lawyer:-
Remember, if you are buying in Spain the best advice is GET A GOOD LAWYER and don’t take any risks.
The problem is of course that those most effected are those that have already bought into the dream.
There are 78 units in our complex and we all had different lawyers.
How can we ever tell if they are 'Good' or not, until it's too late.
We have not yet been informed that we are illegal and I fervently hope that we aren't.
Nevertheless our whole community is in sympathy with the Priors and anyone else in this awful situation.
Is there perhaps someone with an 'Excellent' lawyer who could organise the owners deprived of their rights to petition the European Parliament?
Perhaps several hundred, if not several thousand effected owners might just find some justice in the European Court.
As Justine clearly states, the 'Villain' is not the owner, who was duped into a dodgy purchase, by greedy legal local officials.
These real 'Villains' are still in power and reaping the benefits at the expense of innocent investors in this wonderful land.
Surely the European Parliament will see this travesty of justice and put it right.
But it will have to be shoved up their noses many many times before they feel they need to act.
I wish you all luck and perseverance in your efforts to bring some justice to Andalucia.
Isn't there already a similar case in progress for dispossessed owners up on the east coast of Spain ?
Cheers
Leo
This message was last edited by Leoleon on 1/22/2008.
This message was last edited by Leoleon on 1/22/2008.This message was last edited by Leoleon on 1/22/2008.
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Is there any fund you can make a donation to for this couple??
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Spain should get its legal system sorted out so that this cannot happen, it is outrageous and the people responsible should be brought to justice.
This message was last edited by Fred Plant on 1/22/2008.
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So glad that so many new people have joined in this thread- it just shows that we do care and would like to contribute in some way.
I think that the EU is really the only way we can 'persuade' the Spanish authorities to examine their ways. It's about time that they knew that ex-pats can't continue to be pushed around. I really don't like the idea that we should try to interfere in another country's laws BUT when they are blatently unfair I think it may be time to take a stand.
Gloria
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Hi, i am an agent based in almeria, the people who live here have known for a long time that some houses are under threat of demolition, so why is it a big surprise that it has finally happened? the only thing in this particular case is that for all intents and purposes the house was 'legal' and the junta have made an example of the wrong people, the mayors and local council should be held to account, but we all know that all foriegners here are treated as second class citizens and the spanish just do what they want. By doing this stupid act of demolition they have killed off what is left of any property market in this area plus the media in the UK have not published the full facts and gmtv has said for people not to buy in andalucia, so we are getting shafted from both ends.
are we really living the dream?
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Very sad and a short sighted solution by the authorities, search for the Guilty and punish the inocent !
As someone has said it makes us all feel vunerable.
Two questions, a) When built the villa must have been subject to IVA (VAT), do the authotities collect IVA on illegal ventures ? Should this be paid back ?
b) MEP both in the Home Country and Spain ( I mention Home Country as it effects Brits, Irish, Germans Etc) write, e-mail, pester, make them work along with your local MP.
I cannot believe that the Mayor is still in the town Hall who granted the building permission.
Something very wrong in Spain friends!
Barry
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Frustrated Los Olivian but not for long
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More like the nightmare!
Its wrong that innocent individuals should pay for the greed and mistakes of the people previously in power, enstrusted to look after our interests. It is them who should be punished and the current town hall, the junat and the governement should take responsibility.
Why not draft a petition in english and spanish protesting as this is affecting all of us, both Spanish and non-spanish in our businesses, lifestyle and childrens future, residents and non-residents alike, we are compbined and it is also affecting our freedom.
People who own so called NOW illegal homes, who bought in good faith with mortgages cannot sell if needed. Thousands of people face lifechanging financial ruin, stuck within the red tape tangles of the political and legal system.
If a theif breaks into a shop and robs the owner, it is not the customers who pay for the loss, it is the thief.
It should be no different in property
The Higher echelons in the government need to be made aware we as a whole will not sit down and take this.
Lawyers, estate agents, property managers, bar owners, restaurants, builders, the second home owners, the retired etc etc etc etc etc are ALL affected by this, mostly directly but also indirectly.
Perhaps a new thread ought to be started and we can all suggest clauses to the petition - also from the spanish. Then translate it into both languages and get as many signatures on it as possible to present maybe to Michael Cashman or someone who will listen.
Our voices combined should and will be heard!
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Quite frankly m'dear, I don't give a damn!
www.herbalmarbella.com
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