Dogs on beaches

Budget as received from Rodas 3 for information

					MIRADOR DE LA VEGA II
	Número	Propiedad	Coefi. Esc	C. Anual	Cuota 1ª	Cuota 2ª	Cuota 3ª	Cuota 4ª
	1	1	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	2	2	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	3	3	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	4	4	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	5	5	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	6	6	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	7	7	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	8	8	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	9	9	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	10	10	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	11	11	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	12	12	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	13	13	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	14	14	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	15	15	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	16	16	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	17	17	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	18	18	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	19	19	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	20	20	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	21	21	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	22	22	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	23	23	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	24	24	1.53	150.99 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €	37.75 €
	25	25	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	26	26	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	27	27	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	28	28	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	29	29	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	30	30	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	31	31	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	32	32	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	33	33	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	34	34	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	35	35	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	36	36	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	37	37	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	38	38	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	39	39	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	40	40	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	41	41	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	42	42	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	43	43	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	44	44	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	45	45	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	46	46	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	47	47	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	48	48	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	49	49	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	50	50	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	51	51	1.60	157.89 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €	39.47 €
	52	52	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	53	53	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	54	54	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	55	55	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	56	56	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	57	57	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	58	58	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	59	59	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	60	60	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	61	61	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	62	62	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
	63	63	1.58	155.92 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €	38.98 €
	64	64	1.54	151.97 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €	37.99 €
			100.00	9,868.39 €	2,467.10 €	2,467.10 €	2,467.10 €	2,467.10 €

HI
150 ODD EUROS PER YEAR,CANT BE BAD.
PANICK OVER ME THINKS
CHEERS

Yes, I agree.  A public 'Thank You' to Lynne for putting all our minds at rest.  Thank you too to EOS for this facility to enable us to communicate..  Without it we'd have been completely in the dark at this point - Cheers.

Dil

Yes, it doesn't seem unreasonable at all. Assuming, and it is their business, Rodas3 have made accurate estimates on the running costs. Does anyone have any news about the committee? Who was "fortunate" enough to be elected president etc. And is there anyone on the committee who has enough spanish to communicate effectively with officialdom if needs demand it. Stuart

Hello - Mick no. 1 has been elected president with Eric no. 22 vice president also the Spanish have their own president.  We start paying the community fees in January and remain on builders supply for the time being! Lou

HI.
FIND IT A BIT STRANGE THAT WE ARE GOING TO HAVE 2 (EL PRESIDENTES BRITISH AND SPANISH) CANT WORK THAT OUT,SURELY THAT WILL LEAD TO PROBS DOWN THE LINE WHEN THERE ARE CONFLICS WITHIN EACH OTHER.(JUST HOPE NO POLISH ,GERMAN,FRENCH,ETC) MOVE IN OR WE WILL END UP WITH 30 OR MORE TO RUN THE PLACE.
HOPE TO FIND OUT MORE ON SATURDAY WHEN WE GO FOR HOLS.
CHEERS

Must admit I thought it strange too!  

Have a great holiday, would welcome any update on your return as not back to Spain for a bit.

Look forward to hearing the logic behind two presidents, mind you I hear John McCain thinks it's a great idea! Will await further information with interest. Stuart.

Hi all..just back from 5 weeks at Mirador ..and present at this meeting.

Regarding the presidents. There was no voting..Which we had expected.  A lady called Mary Carmen was negotiating...and a young lady called Maria.. translating on our behalf. with a senior member of Mahersol present.. giving instruction. 

Mary Carmen simply asked for a president to be selected who spoke English..and one who spoke Spanish.  Mick..came forward. I am not sure if someone suggested him..or he just spoke up himself.  She confirmed he would like to be president....and spoke English. . This was accepted. Then a Spanish gentleman came forward as a president for the Spanish residents. 

Micks wife Pat..asked about other committee members being selected.. But was told non were required. She suggested it wasn't fair to have just one person making decisions....so Eric volunteered to assist mick.

I feel it is very important to have 2 presidents..and  that the Spanish families on the complex also be represented..and involved. We are in their country..and we all have a vested interest in what we want for our community. And their views may differ slightly from ours..      There was straight off a minor dispute over hours for the pool with the spanish contingent.   As to whether adults could have a night swim.. Many of us had done so this summer..including myself.  

With the intense heat in July/aug .and darkness not till 10pm  or later..and still extremely hot.   The pool is very busy in the day  with kids..and evening is the first chance many adults have to use it.  

It  was eventually agreed by both sides..that  it be permitted  until 11 pm ..  children allowed out only until 10pm.

This would only generally apply in the height of summer anyway. At present.. No one is around the pool past 7 or 8 pm. As the water is getting shaded by then and  chilly.  The pool will be open from April until November.

We  also have a policeman from Alicante in our community.. who speaks very good English.    

He is friends with Mick..and will work with him. which could be very detrimental to us at times. Especially If we have any major negotiations with town hall or others..or need to know our legal rights. and require a translator.

.There was also talk by Mahersol..of installing a community phone line..and broadband connection..with free installation. We will pay for the contract..which should be at a reduced group rate. . Also they will pay for British satelite TV. to be connected. They have a british agent who will handle it for the community.Guaranteeing all the UK stations.  Which would be great..

Some mention also of entry phones as well..so you can buzz an apt  on arrival..to contact the person you want to see. Apparently, some Spanish contracts mention them as being part of the security package. And they were to have been included. There seemed to be Mixed feelings on those.

Originally..we were told that the community charges  for the pool and outside areas ..were to be paid immediately. Then the senior exec..agreed to continue payment of these fees as well ..until the License of habitation is issued. In about 2 or 3 months.  So all in all..by appearances..it seems fair and a good package. Time will tell if all the promises are kept.

Sadly, a lot of nastiness appeared when word of this meeting surfaced.  Rumours of dirty deals...slagging of the builder.. All before anything was known.   The spirit of the community went right out the window.  I really hope it doesn't happen again. Mirador is a lovely place to live..with a good selection of people of all walks of life and nationalities. We are all aiming for the same thing..a quality of life and happiness.    wishing you all well in your new homes.  Regards,Carol & Danny

I demand a Welsh Chairman !!! LOL


This message was last edited by SpanishTogs on 9/4/2008.

SECURiTY ISSUE..

One other  important question was raised by the Spanish community.....the low height of the outside walls.. Enabling people to climb over..This will be looked into. And some suggestions for a solution, were already made by Mary Carmen representing Mahersol.

I questioned The park opposite our complex.....it is in a bad way. Everyone walking their dog and leaving the remains.. Overgrown with nettles. Garbage gathering as well. They have said it was designed for the villas nearby..and has not been accepted for maintenace by them...so now it is returned to the town hall. 

Hopefully, when all ithe area is adopted ...it will be landscaped and tidied up..as the other parks around Cox..and roundabouts are. And the streetlights connected.

I did have a bit of cxoncern that a lot of  our residents didn;t stick together.    There were 2 distinct groups. Many brought chairs to sit out of the heat..and the pool filter was making a load of noise..making hearing difficult for them.  

So Half of us stood to the front area to hear...All the issues I mentioned..and the president  being chosen..etc.. were discussed with this half of the group, standing around those representing mahersol. More a private discussion group ...than an all out meeting. Credit to the Spanish families..they were all present in force..and paid very close attention to all that was said.

 Without close attention..pool times..and months of the year for opening ....would have been decided by only a few..Nothing was put to discussion to the entire group.
A copy of the minutes is to be made available to all I believe. .Our Email addresses were requested.  

On the personal side...Awnings were also decided..which is something of interest to me. They will be allowed on both the Solarium..and balcony,Two colour choices..cream or yellow to match the building. 

NO GAZEBO.S... until after the license of habitation. Those already in place.. are required to be removed  until that time. No license of habitation  will be issued if even One is standing.  That is according to the chaiman..Mary Carmen. Best check with Mick ..those that have one up....and see how seriously enforced  this rule is.

There was some private talk  of No sunbathing allowed by the pool....(except sitting on the benches)  as there isn't room,  I can't see the issue here... Even though I am definitely NOT a sunbather myself. Many Spanish & Brits were enjoying sitting there on towerls...and I gave my son a chair one dayy. NO One was present but them.!.The pool is our main centre of the community.
if it is quiet..what does sunbathing matter? 

 Taking a quick dip and leaving..doesn't inspire community relations.  No floats either.That I think may have been mahersols rule.

No towels left in place by the pool.....or aired and dried  over the edges of the balcony. Also a question if local residents..could do some of the jobs cheaper.  . Prices are currently Listed on the community cost sheet.  The problem is..only a handful of people are permanent at present...we hope to be joining them shortly. 

I do  expect all issues to be voted on..and made clear to everyone..We have enough rules & regulations in the Uk in our daily life..I hope common sense prevails here..and Life at Mirador.... is the Happy, Relaxed, place we wished for. Not another Police state.

All the best, Carol

PS..Dil I vote for you in a flash as Welsh president..in fact what about me for the American President.. Been in the Uk so long, that  I forgot I am still a yank! LOL

Thanks Carol, good to hear some feedback from someone who was able to be present at the meeting. I must confess that I'm still a bit confused by having two presidents, though I think it's a great idea that we have spanish nationals on board who will be able to converse fluently with town hall and who will have an appropriate cultural perspective if we have any issues. 
The Horizontal Property Act 49/1960 as amended by the Reform Act 8/1999 seems to suggest that there can only be one president and that s/he will "represent the community both in and out of court in all matters" Sect 13.3. 
I'm sure it's more complicated than that but also that all will become clear in the fullness of time. 
I was one of the individuals who thought there was unseemly haste in the formation of the committee but my fears, at least for the present, re budgets etc appear to have been unfounded. I still however think it would have been better, and we could have had more owners present, if we had been given more notice. Best wishes to everyone, Stuart.

Hi Stuart - you quote: 

"The Horizontal Property Act 49/1960 as amended by the Reform Act 8/1999 seems to suggest that there can only be one president and that s/he will "represent the community both in and out of court in all matters" Sect 13.3. "  

Is that European Legislation or just UK? 

Dil

As far as I'm aware from my earlier trawl through eyeonspain it's Spanish Law but...

Hi All,

A quick question for Carol who was at the meeting - Have all the rules of the Community been agreed and written up? Do you have a copy and can you post them?

We have requested a copy of the minutes of the meeting as we were absent. We would have loved to attend but 7 days notice after you have just returned from Spain is not enough. Our eldest daughter Isabel, started school this week so we wouldn't miss that for the world.

We have grave concerns from a safety point of view for such late swimming at the pool area. So many people are killed in Spain in drowning accidents - between 70 & 150 each year (86% in private & community pools). Most of these were children! The pool is wholly inadequate for "night swimming" given insufficient  lighting in Mirador. Also there is an absence of any safety flotation devices (and I don't mean Mickey Mouse or Nemo) or a life-guard in anyone gets into trouble.

I think adults can make up their own mind on the safety of late night swimming but from a peace and quiet angle, we were disturbed regularly back in August with young children playing unsupervised in the pool up to and after 12 midnight - screaming and shouting. No problem with fun for the kids, I was once one myself (and Jo tells me sometimes that I am a big one now) and we now have two of our own but 10pm is a little late for play in the pool! Most decent hotel pools anywhere in the world will kick you out or close their pool at 7pm! Anyone got an opinion?

I am not advocating all out at 7pm but 10pm for kids is a bit late!

We too are baffled by the 2 presidents! It appears to be against the rule of Spanish Horizontal Law as Stuart has pointed out but it appears that a lot was decided by a little!

I think that we are equal in this community regardless of nationality or the country -location of our community and I think that a little more appreciation should have been made to the owners that live abroad who need time to make travel arrangements etc. I hope that we are shown a little more courtesy for the next meeting.

I am one for a happy, friendly community and I am delighted that we have such a public forum to express our views  - good or bad!

I look forward to getting back out there later this month and to many happy holidays in the future.

Regards to you all,

James & Jo.

Hi Stuart,

The very first thing the chairman..Mary Carmen acknowledged...was the Legal right of the builder to call this first meeting. 

He could do this At any time he deemed appropriate.  She personally confronted those with a complaint ..and explained this point.

For what it is worth..she also said  part of the delay of the letter..was down to the postal service .. Which is extremely poor in spain. She claimed they had  requested the letters to be sent  earlier.. 

Confirming also....that next year .. we will have the option..and complete control..over when and how we run things.
Who we want to vote for..how many people on the committee..and where and when we want to hold the meeting.

However, IF we had tried to postpone or cancel this meeting...(as some had wanted.).or distrupt the proceedings...or refuse to co operate... there would be serious repercussions. The builder can legally cut off all our electric and water supplies.

By co operating in full..he not only continued to pay the builders supply of electric and water for personal use..for approximately 3 months. But also agreed to carry on paying for the community areas.   Until the license of habitation is received.

 We could choose to pay the community fee in installments if we so wished..over those 3 months. A community bank account will be set up..with a direct debit number.  Everyone will be notified of the bank details to make transfers. 

Email addresses were requested to be put on file.

In forming the first committee...a president is  all that is customary at this stage.. chosen simply as spokesmen. To represent the majority. 

We had 2..because of the high level of Brits..who outnumber the spanish. With a language barrier,,,it would be deemed unfair not to have everyone represented. 

This is my understanding of the proceedings. I must add that both ladies did an excellent job of trying to deal with everyones questions..and complaints. Maria spoke Excellent English..and made a point of following down the line to repeat to others sitting by the pool everything that had transpired.
Carol

Yes, my opinion, for what it's worth, is that I think 8 p.m. would be a good time for pool closure.  Not just for safety but when you're sitting on the solarium and enjoying an evening meal, it would be nice to enjoy it in the peaceful ambience of the setting sun without too much racket and also I'd have thought it should be a nice family bonding time too.

Thinking of safety, I'd like to see us debate the benefits or otherwise of the following:

1.  I'd like to see a set of steps put in at the shallow end of the pool.  I'm not a strong swimmer and don't like going out of my depth.  The only way to get into or out of the pool is via one of the two sets of steps, both of which are in deep water.  How will children and non swimmers manage?   Maybe even one of the existing sets of steps could be moved to near the pool gate.

2.  I'd like a lifebelt of some sort which could be thrown in in emergency situation.   

3.  Finally, the other major item of safety which isn't on site as far as I know, is a fire extinguisher/hydrant of any sort.  I'd have thought one of these at each corner of our complex would be  almost essential, especially as our apartments are so close together..

4.  Re height of perimiter wall, that has always been a source of concern to us and makes a joke out of having a high locking gate which we always tried to remember to lock in the late evenings.  It really be very good if that wall could be raised to a more realistic height..

5. Going off on a tangent from safety - for those of you having just returned from Mirador, can anyone tell me whether they've replaced the post box doors yet?   They had put two sliding doors over the post boxes and if yours (like ours) was in the centre of the post boxes, it was impossible to open your box.  We pointed it out to Carlos and he said they'd have to replace the two doors with three. I'd be interested to know whether that's been done.

Apart from all that - I love the place! 

Let's keep talking - it's good.

Hi Jo and James...

Glad you are well and returned safely. congratulations to Isabel on starting school. I know how special these days are. Evie has just returned today  from spain..she is back to school tomorrow..moving from reception to year 1.  

She has passed this afternoon another swimming level. Able to swim 5 metres without armbands. An Amazing achievement. Mainly due to her time in the pool at Mirador. With her dad and stepmum..who is a swimming instructor. She arrived with armbands  10 days ago..(and a life vest from grandad!!. ) 

The  safety issues you raised are very good.  I know only too well about the kids..and the incidents of running around the pool very late unchaperoned. last month.. On the particuliar night you mention..I spoke with them myself.    After which, the grandparents seemed to take a bit more control of the younger ones.   Any children being left to their own devices..running around late..or swimming  alone at any time...should Not be tolerated in our community. 

I am sure most people would agree with this. 

The issue of Night Swims..came about regarding  ADULTS.  It was not intended to extend hours for kids. A good many people..including myself..wanted the chance of a  night swim.. I know there are a lot of for and against..reasons.

But with so many kids about in the summer holidays.. using the pool all day and into the evening..It makes it hard for adults to get the chance to get in the pool and have a quiet swim.. The heat in July/August is intense..and still carries on well into the night. 

Spain is a country we all appreciate for whole generations of families living outdoors during summer in particuliar. Staying up late..and enjoying themselves. Dinners often aren't eaten until 10pm by all the family. So this was an issue of special interest to the Spanish residents as well...as British.and Belkgian.. We didn't want a pool closed at 7 or 8pm. we are not living the same as we do in the Uk... having to be indoors due to the weather. That is what we all love  of our new life...

The night swims would be over a short period anyway....mainly July/Aug.   My son just came home today..and no one is in the pool at mirador  after 7pm.

I am not sure if the 10pm is for the pool for kids..or just to be out and about. I totally agree it is later for them in the pool than I would like. As they have all the day to use it. They should  be supervised at all times..anywhere within the pool area..and a life ring available for emergencies at the side....

A very important and Excellent point to raise with Mick. And it should be noted ASAP

Regarding you not being there..I can understand  fully.. I felt exactly the same when I WAS  present..by chance...and people were trying to cancel the meeting. Your points of view are very important..and  I don't think anything is written  in stone. 

I feel it is more a list to be discussed and negotiated. And I Totally Agree..ALL persons living at Mirador..whether for a few weeks of the year..or permanent..should have their equal say and their input. 

I certainly don't want my life dictated to me by a few...or bogged down with loads of rules and regulations. And this is not to say I expect this to happen. But without us all taking an interest....it could.

A copy of the minutes is supposed to be given to everyone. That is why the Email addresses were asked for.  

BTW...There were an awful lot of residents present..it wasn't just a few. Some I met for the first time.     

Maria, the translator, did an excellent job of trying to inform everyone..she had to keep repeating things over and over moving through the group. As some were sat on chairs further along the pool.

 I don't agree completely about the pool lighting issue..we were in at 9.30/10pm the night you spoke with us..and it was very easy to see ..as it was just getting dark...and the lighting was very bright.   An hour later could be different. and would be worth looking into. 11 pm is closing.. 

I also don't agree that all pools close at 7pm, at hotels or elsewhere. In Derby..the city pool..where my daughter in law teaches.. is open till 11pm. sportscentres..10 or 11..and hotels we stayed at are a mixture of times. 

But the main issue here is..this is not a hotel ..but our home. And just as you want to have a say and have a right..After 50 years working to achieve our home....we should have the  right to take a dip at night if we wish.. And not be forced to go in the heat of the day. It is very special to be able to swim in the evening..coming from such a cold wet climate. 

We just returned with a 2 month old baby..and a 5 year old. and we ourselves..including baby.. went out at night  to beat the heat..  It was really enjoyable seeing all the families out for a stoll..a night on the beach. Everyone so lively ...and temperatures still warm at night.  the kids came home tired but happy. when inside..we had the air conditioner or fan on with windows closed. And nothing could be heard to disturb them..

AGAIN..I AM NOT EXCUSING THOSE UNRULY CHILDREN. or ANYONE Else...causing any  kind of loud unnecessary noise. Nor disrespecting your rights...But I also don't want to find  ..after  raising all of my own children and grandchildren..that I am confined to my apt at 9pm.     I am sure a happy medium can be reached..and Everyone respected and happy. 

I personally  feel VERY glad that  2 presidents are chosen. for one of the very reasons you mention.  TOO Much would be decided by few...if not enough representation were in place. And as far as I know..non of us are fluent enough in Spanish.. to have a proper discussion with the spanish residents. who were very involved..know a lot about Spanish law...and made some very good comments and suggestions.

We actually have 2 reps for the Brits..Mick & Eric.  So I think our views will be well represented..as long as everyone makes it clear to them what they feel is important. And keep a check on what is happening. We all want to have  the life we dreamt of. common sense is all that is needed...along with a few guidelines to keep things running smoothly. Most importantly... respect for each other..and our community.

Best wishes ..Carol


 
 

.

Dil.
.I never heard or saw anything of the post boxes.. Post was mentioned by Maria..who said at present..those without post boxes in town..could receive mail from her office. but it is in Torrevieja. I was of the understanding from Mick..and our neighbours ..that post to the door would be some time yet. 

The low walls were brought up by the spanish resident in No 63 and his parents...he is an Alicante policeman. and speaks excellent English. Mary Carmen took it very seriously..and suggested some solutions to him. She also clarified the scruffy park..which is really rough and dirty now. Hopefully, the council will adopt it..and clean it up once we are established.  

T he policeman, also was the first to breach the night swimming question for ADULTS...as he is at work nightimes..and wants to cool down when he returns. A young Spanish couple ...also permanent..work and  feel the same..as did a great many of the other residents.  8 pm without a doubt is only cloising the pool to ADULTS..kids have enjoyed a full day and they are in until then. So when do the Adults enjoy peace and quiet? the kids certainly make enough noise all day..which I have to listen to with my windows open ..being only one apt away!! Close it by all means to kids at 7 or 8..but leave adults the chance to have a choice. Carol

 No-one's forming a dictatorship, we just need common sense.

Alan and I've stayed in many campsites and hotels over the past 30 odd years and I've never stayed anywhere where the pool was open after 8 p.m.  You also mention municipal pools in UK open until 11 p.m. (?) I'm fairly sure in that case there would be lifeguards on duty to look out for anybody in difficulty or  sort out any tom-foolery.  We obviously have none of that at Mirador and I can also forecast that we'll have more than the odd incident of annebriated adults going for a swim and maybe not living to tell the tale - probably me in the deep end not being able to find a ladder to climb out! LOL      Also, how can we have one rule for adults and another for the kids?  That's not fair on the children and what's more it would be quite hypocritical.  You would then also have to decide what age is an adult etc - do we leave the mature 11 year old swim and turn away the young 15 yr old? - one huge minefield!

I certainly don't want a dictatorship either, and as for colours of awnings and gazeebos, well frankly, I don't give a damn. In fact a little variation would stop it looking like a council estate in my book; but safety, consideration and common sense are all I'm worried about.

Tomorrow's another day - it's good to talk and air our feelings!  Good Night All.