Report on Herrada del Tollo

 Hi Claire ,perhaps you can tell us the approximate  current market value of a tulipan and an Azucena at  Playa Golf . Then we would have something to compare with Thanks MM

Hell, this is getting very sensible.

Hi MM - prices are all over the place but, as an example, I have 5 tulipans from 107,000€ to 135,000€ and two azucenas for 153,250€ and 159,950€.  All of them are fully furnished resales in PG I and II.  Most of the owners paid more than these prices but have accepted they need to take a loss if they want to sell.

Hope that helps.

Claire

Claire

After all we have been through I hope you dont mind me asking if there are any outstanding debts on these properties and what are the reasons that these people are willing to sell below what they paid.  I think it would be very difficult for any of us not to ask these questions because during the past 2 years or so our confidence has been battered by the lack of should we say honesty.

Regards Chrissie

Hi Chrissie - of course I don't mind. 

Part of our job as estate agents in Spain is to check if there are any debts on properties.  One of the saddest things about the current situation is that many people have such high mortgages that I can't take them on - if the mortgage is higher than the market value of the property then I would just be wasting people's time and giving them false hope.  Many people in this position have just handed their keys to the bank and lost everything.  The banks own a lot of property on Playa Golf!

People's reasons for selling are varied - probably the main reason is that it is much harder to get rentals than people were promised (I was told I would get 30-40 weeks per year!) and they are not getting enough income from their properties to cover their costs.  Add to that the uncertainty over jobs and the problems with the exchange rate, some are deciding to cut their losses and sell.

Hope that helps.

Regards

Thanks for that Claire ,I have been scouring the markets recently and would say your customers selling at the lower end are being a bit  more realistic .I have seen some even  cheaper . I have the details of the deal being discussed and have compared it with the prices on the open market and it confirmed what I thought  .

I wouldn't touch  the other deal with  with a barge pole .Anyone with half a brain will see right through it .The prices are way to high .

I am getting really sick of scams and deals from people  who seem to  think just because we have been robbed by SJ that we must be stupid and will fall for anything . Thanks for the info . MM

This message was last edited by MAGICMEG on 4/20/2009.

Hi Claire

Thanks for your quick and honest reply.  I think its going to be very difficult to commit to anything for some time and indeed we have all learnt a lot from what has gone on.  Building confidence is going to take a lot longer and there is going to be much work to do from anyone trying to sell properties to people like myself who have been totally shocked at the injustice that is happening to 1000's of people.  Although we do personally have the funds to buy outright I feel that spain does not deserve to be invested in if its going to treat us like fools.  I am sure there will be bargains galore in the coming months and it is sad to think that so many people are now suffering in order for us to be able to buy a cheap property.  I dont think I could bring myself at the moment to snap up someones house whose only choice is to give up their dream.  Call me a softie if you like but this is how it feels to me at present.

Kind regards and if my confidence lifts I would not hesitate to call you.

Chrissie

Hi Chrissie and MM - I know from all your previous posts what a rough time you are having with the whole Santa Anna debacle.

However, please don't give up on Spain altogether!  It has a lot to offer and things are beginning to change, albeit slowly.  I have ranted many times on this forum about all the regulations, injustices and red tape that I had to get through when I moved over here but I always try to bear in mind that it was a British company who lied to me and misled me about buying my property, not a Spanish one.  

If you buy a property that is finished and has it's paperwork in order then you won't have all the problems you have had to face with Santa Anna.  I know Chrissie what you mean about buying someone else's dream but if they can't sell then it will be even worse for them - yes, the buyer is getting a bargain, but the seller is at least salvaging something from the deal.

Spain is a very new democracy and there are many things that need to be changed, but the people are generally relaxed and friendly and the sun shines a lot!!  I do hope you give it another chance.

Regards 

Chrissie you are not a softie if there were more people like you around we wouldn't be in this mess .I don't know  how SJ and co can sleep at night .

I have to agree 100% with what Claire has said.  Luckily John and I had a little bit of money left, and have managed to buy a new apartment on the edge of town, here in Jumilla.  We are renting until the end of this month, to allow us time to move our belongings from the rented apartment, and have new furniture, white goods etc delivered.  So far this has gone reasonably smoothly, even though when we paid the deposit the apartment wasn't quite finished.  Everybody in Jumilla has been very helpful and friendly towards us, and we have already met some of our new neighbours (none of whom speaks English!)  The sun has been shining most days, the pace of life is a lot more relaxed, and we are more than happy with our decision to stay in Spain.

Of course we understand how badly this has affected other people and can sympathise with them.  We can't afford to lose the money we paid for our Azucena, but without a bank guarantee know that there is a strong possibility we may never get it back.  We now have to watch every penny, but if we had stayed in London that would have been the case there, and at least we have less stress and more sunshine here!

Sue

I give up!

Think I'll just carry on with my life and forget passing anything on to other people on this forum.

Dave

Good idea if this is an example of recommendations.

What about details of the Company so people can research?

Why? You've already made your mind up? I've sent details to those people that PM me. I've not broken the forum rules by not advertising a company that has not paid the site fees. I haven't slagged anyone off! It's up to the people that have taken advantage of this offer to decide wether they want to post on the site, not my place to give out their details. I've done what I promised Soane PropertiesS.L. and Richard Maher I would do! If people chose to investigate further or chose to ignore it thats their choice. I don't force my opinions on others wish others on this site would do the same.

Dave 

I hope that the negative comments that have been made don't deter Dave and other people posting on here when they have information that may help other buyers.  If John and I hadn't already bought a property in Jumilla, and didn't prefer living inland, we would certainly have sent Dave a PM for further details.  As he said, that is more appropriate than posting information on the forum about a company that isn't advertising on EOS, and possibly breaking the forum rules.  I'm not saying that we would have taken it up, as I don't have the details, but it might have offered us a way out of this mess.

FIN, please remind me whether or not you were buying at SADM?  Many of those who were doing so know the Laird & GAL, also Linda Needham (with reference to another post).  When we see posts from them, we are in a better position to trust what they are saying and make our own minds up without the need for derogatory statements, as we know who they are.  We have all had our fingers burnt, and we may not agree with each other all the time, but if there are alternatives for people to consider let's have them posted on here and not put them off by sarcastic and negative remarks.

Sue 

 "FIN, please remind me whether or not you were buying at SADM? "
A simple search will answer your question.

"Many of those who were doing so know the Laird & GAL, also Linda Needham (with reference to another post). "
So, does that mean that people's money is safeguarded by acting on whatever they or anyone else says?

"When we see posts from them, we are in a better position to trust what they are saying and make our own minds up without the need for derogatory statements,"
Perhaps that could be a reason why many are in the situation they are in (no reference to the people you mention), but some will listen to others they know and think that they know the system, rather than paying for good professional advice.

"as we know who they are."
In the same way as there are probably many who felt they knew the friendly salesperson, agent, linked lawyer, etc., and trusted their money with them. Just because someone knows someone else, doesn't mean all should trust what they say without question.

Dave has recommended something as being considered a good deal.
Good, hope it is for some and helps them out of their problems.
Why is the unknown company owned by "Richard Maher" and the company  "Soane PropertiesS.L." being touted.
Is this through friendship, or is Dave acting as an agent?

I have asked the question if anyone has searched on Soane PropertiesS.L. and its single shareholder.

Look people,

Laird Dave ( & others) are trying to help with the HDT SADM situation with information & contacts they have or have made, this in my humble opinion is what the EOS forum is all about (or supposed to be about) as I understand it's purpose anyway. - To help & support others.

I have (at my own request) sought further information on what Laird Dave has on offer through Soane Properties & whilst it's not the cheapest deal based on property prices in the area (again thanks ClaireT for the comparision information), myself & Jo are taking a plunge and coming over to Spain to review whats on offer to help get us out of the SADM \ HDT mess.

What I do know is that if we sit and do nothing and just wait for HDT's liquidation (& IMHO it aint heading anywere else) then we stand to lose out altogether &\or get next to bugger all back in 5 Yrs time!

I thank you all for the cautionary tales, but I hope I am not stupdi enough to get caught by a scam a second time.

- AS AT LEAST 1,700 OF US DID 1st TIME ROUND IN SIGNING UP TO SAN JOSE & HERRADA DEL TOLLO's LIES.

I have already looked at other opportunities to realise & safeguard my contract deposits and discounted them after reviewing the information, and if the Soane Property deal\offer isnt right then i'm sure that we are (all) now cautious enough to not take matters further.

But there aint no harm in looking is there?  

So I say thanks, because until myself & Jo got the heads up from Laird Dave, we were out of options that gave any kind of positive outcome.

Regards.

I have asked the question if anyone has searched on Soane PropertiesS.L. and its single shareholder?

Now, what is the link between them and Richard Maher?

What company is Richard Maher offering the properties through?

What Country is that Company registered?

Nothing sinister I believe, just simple straightforward questions anyone would should ask first.

Hi nweatheral of course you would be crazy not to look at all your options and I also got the info from Dave .Am I missing something I can not see how buying a way over priced property will sort out the loss of your deposit .I would love someone to explain to me how this works in our favour  .I have seen Daves explanation of how it works and can't for the life of me see it .I would genuinley like someone to explain why this is a good option .  You could buy the same properties for 40k less so what is the difference  you will still pay the same .I would love to see this but can't figure it out  !!!!!!!

OH, say you have a 40K deposit you are owed.
You buy at an inflated price of 140K
140-40 = 100K
So if you can buy for 100K elsewhere and without your deposit, which you have to write-off.

Let's forget the inflated prices and your deposit etc, etc. what about the costs incurred and taxes, which are based on the purchase price?

Are you hoping that in the first example, everyone will deduct your deposit for the SADM premises and then say, let's help you and base fees, costs, taxes on the 100K and not the 140K?

Yes I agree you can easily buy resale properties around this location for a lot less than 185,000 euros, thats exactly what we did.

However new, key ready, unlived in properties of this size and style, no chance.

So in my opinion, you basically have these options available to you.

• Do nothing and await the outcome of the courts with regard to your deposits paid.
• Buy another property either resale or new and await the outcome of the courts.
• Transfer part of your deposit debt to another builder/developer in exchange for their properties.
• Walk away and forget your deposit exists.
• Join SARC, live in cloud cuckoo land and await the build of Santa Ana Del Monte.

The choice is yours. Transferring part of your debt is standard practice here in Spain and has/is being offered by many builders/developers. Before we purchased we were offered a new two bedroom apartment by TM in Villa Martin, a two bedroom bungalow at Succina.

Cheers

Dave