Is Spain still the best option for retirement abroad?

Having read the latest 10 posts or so on this thread I was struck by the polarisation of views ie really fantastic or irritating problems. I was particularly amused at the reference to the local estate agent in campsol and how great they were. Now that struck a chord as that individual operated further south at one time and it was not a bed of roses. My experience in Spain is that there are many people trapped in Spain from a property perspective who can't sell or move due to the property market. That creates stress and worry.

The sad reality in Spain is that getting anything done admin wise eg iba, car matters, communities meetings, taxes/ paying them, running a business legally etc etc is way more challenging than the UK. However the upside is as I write this its clear blue sky in January, a bit of rain sometimes, 10 minutes drive to a wonderful beach to both walk on, watch the surfers, and then sit beach front with a coffee and piece of yummy cake etc etc.

Everywhere has good and bad points Spain and the UK included.

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I live on Camposol D and i love my life here.  I fill my week with a little work, football meeting on a Thursday and Football on a Sunday, The Camposol 2013 Fiesta committee, Sector D community reps group and occassionally I have time to eat my lunch in the sun in winter and go to the gym.  People who are not happy in Spain and particularly on Camposol are normally people who don't want to participate in their community affairs and have too much time on their hands.  Oh, and i'm going to a hypnotist show tonight at 10€ a ticket where a pint will be 2€.  Where would you get that in the UK?

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 In reply to eos-ian's question about a better option than Spain, the answer must surely be Bulgaria or Romania.

 At the end of the year these countries will export all ( or nearly all ) of their population to the UK, so there should be plenty of room!

There will be loads of money flowing back into these countries once they all start getting family allowance & benifits they will send it home to pay for bricks & morter to build their palaces. 

 

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mentioned in an early post.Camposol has a 5 star Hotel next to the Golf Club,wrong closed in November 2012 and doubt very much if it will open again.

M.A.S.A.has not gone bust he is still building in parts of Spain,he left the majority of Camposol in an unfinished state.

Residents groups are working hard to improve Camposol,but no we will never have the man power or money to finish it.

From some one who has lived on Camposol for 7 years and who loves nearly everything about it, not perfect and we personally have many problems with our house all down to M.A.S.A. incompetance,but we still live life to the full and hope to do so for many years to come.

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 How about Malta & Gozo

 

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I have a rather different perspective due to the fact my wife and I are both Canadian ( we can live here because she has a German passport). We spent 6 years in Germany and another 6 in Madrid and preparing to join the mass exodus due to La Crisis. Part of the reason for returning is work, choice of moving or be laid off, but also that my Wife is turning 50 this year and would prefer to be on the German pension system. Sadly had we been a wee bit smarter we'd be discussing moving for retirement rather than for work;(

Anyways part of the move discussions have been retirement planning where would we want to live. While we enjoyed our time in Spain - biggest surprise the coast, heard so many stories about the wall of concrete that it was a pleasant surprise at how nice the coast is. Anyways for us the biggest problem is the cold followed by the heat. Madrid is COLD and heating costs a fortune, and we both found the sun to be too strong during the summer. Spring and fall are awesome, and if you get a mild winter like last year it can be very comfortable.

So on to life in Spain,first off being 8 hours from our families hasn't been a problem, we go home every 2-3 years and someone usually visits off years. Also Skype, FB email keeps us all connected (got an on going argument with my brother at the moment). It helps that communication is so cheap ( when we first arrived in 99 it cost 50 cents a mint to call Canada - now it's all about free) even handling the death of my parents and estate issues hasn't been the problem you think it would be (except for the costs of last min flights ouch)

But in living abroad there are two main issues one must adjust to. One unless it's an English speaking country it's not home and one must adjust, not just learning the language but navigating the cultural differences (healthcare shopping etc)

But the biggest issue - cont'd on next post

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On iPad on free hotel wee fee and didn't feel like losing everything. The best thing about being an expat is also the biggest downside. Making and then saying goodbye to wonderful friends. We had a very close friend, whose idea of a relaxing Sunday afternoon was to invite 20 (seriously) of his, ours, closest friend over for a BBQ and loads of Spanish wine. He was well known and well like. Well he got relocated to Miami and now being nothing unusual ( English speaker in America) he's really struggled to make friends. When I tell people that everybody's reaction is the same. Surprise.

But the crisis has completely changed everything, we've said good bye to so many good friends and are now are saying good bye ourselves (will the last person to leave please turn off the lights). A friend mentioned that the local women's club has seen membership drop 50% from per crisis highs, we've also seen more than half our friend leave. This my friend is the biggest issue of leaving your hometown. Yes expats are wonderfully friendly but you say good bye to so many people it just breaks your heart.

Soooooo after that long rambling post back to the question at hand. Is Spain still the best place, if you go with your eyes open and can handle both the cold and the heat than yes. Personally I'd suggest renting and going half and half. Also for my wife and we are debating where to go. We do know we want to spend 6 months a year travelling America/ Canada in a RV but the question is where to spend the other time. Munich is a wonderful city to live, loads of expats, without the churn you get in Spain, but it's also a bloody expensive city and more importantly it snows here in the winter 😱

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Soooooooo see what happens when your in a cold city (Munich) were you can't understand the TV, you waste hours rambling on in strange forums:)

Anyways a lot of Canadians go to Mexico and Latin America, much cheaper cost of living than Spain and generally speaking better weather but crime is a big problem. A good friend goes to Mexico from Madrid every year, dirt cheap living but day time highs in the mid 90s are too much for me.

So where to spend 6 months a year, hmmmmm good question but thankfully I've got 15 years to solve it:)

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 I just asked my husband, Rob/Brian, and he suggests Wales as we've got the lot.  When people come they just don't want to leave. We've got mountains, a beautiful coastline, a mild climate, a rugby team which just beat the French, friendly people, lovely castles, magnificent coastal parks, great places to eat and drink, modesty, we are close to Ireland and England for a change of scene... you get the picture.  Who could ask for more? (well it is raining at the moment, but that creates atmosphere)

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So Egg Cup..... Wales has got a better climate than the rest of UK.... ?  And you didnt mention Ireland won last week .  This posting is about Spain but if we are going off track you have to say Cumbria and the Lakes has it all. and twice as much rain as Wales so you can doubly appreciate Spain when you arrive in that hot sun and its not raining.

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 Yes Wales needs the rain so they can feed the water to England. It was nice to see Wales beat France but it is nice when anyone beats France.

Back on track, I purchased my apartment in Spain a few years ago. I thought I paid a resonable price then but if only I had waited. I should have retired last year but decided to carry on for another year to give me a chance to downsize and my plan is to spend summers in the UK and winters in Spain.

On my visits to Spain I see the increase in the cost of living but generally find it cheaper than the UK. So I look forward to retirement in June and can't think of anywhere else I'd rather be.

Regards.

Tech. 

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8 yrs ago when we bought out apartment in Algorfa, Spain, we loved our holidays there and planned to retire there.   However as a big family person I came to the conclusion that I could not retire there without access to regular family visits which increasing flight prices have put a stop to on our limited pensions.   We therefore decided to sell it as my daughter wants to go and work and buy in the Costa Del Sol, we decided that as we loved Spain so much, we would go too sometime this year.    Last year we spent 5 weeks at our apartment before handing the keys over and we were having second thoughts about selling but my original doubts held true as the property market was dropping like a stone and we returned to the Uk where we are retired here.    Having had 2 awful winters here, we are yearning to be back in Spain and with the economic and political scene here deterioriating for the majority of British people, our future is looking more rosy in Spain.

Having said that, I feel the ideal solution for us will be to rent out our house in the UK and intend to move further into the rural areas of the UK away from the dumping ground of the cities,  to fund our renting in Spain (if we decide to rent), but we have toyed with the idea of buying a mobile home on a site with pool etc. as this is what our daughter is doing.  I would always want to keep a foothold in the UK as who knows what we would want to do in the face of illness or one of us being left on our own.

The UK with sunshine would be the ideal (as we have the best countryside and places to visit (historically and culturally speaking) without taking into account what has happened in the last 20 yrs here where our town has changed out of all recognition.    It is now a dumping ground for the dregs of 3rd world Europe (at least where we live is which is just outside Birmingham).   At least people for the most part who retire to Spain go with the intention of retaining their lifestyle or improving it with their own money.    Immigrants who come to the UK, for the most part, come here for what they can get for free and that is why the UK is no longer the place it used to be.

As for the comment about retiring to Bulgaria or Romania, who in their right minds would want to retire there, where people live on rubbish tips and many would cut your throat for a shilling !

So from our point of view, the ideal country would have to be Spain (although I have lived in Australia for 4 yrs with my parents in the 60's and have a distant relative there), but would agree with the previous comments on Austrlia, therefore being 2 hrs from the UK, with unlimited sunshine and laid back lifestyle, Spain wins hand down for us, but only on the proviso I could come back to the UK for a few months here and there when I needed to.

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" As for the comment about retiring to Bulgaria or Romania, who in their right minds would want to retire there, where people live on rubbish tips and many would cut your throat for a shilling !"

 

I think you will find the latest statistics show that almost a million individuals from these countries are now residing in Spain, many living on rubbish tips or similar around the cities. That is more than Brits on the Padron

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Not withstanding that I feel sorry for their way of life, I believe that money should be sent to their countries to help them there.    I think it disgraceful that they are spreading "the rubbish" around the EU to be dumped in the midst of people and countries who have built up their own countries only to have them knocked back down (in the case of the UK) to Victorian living conditions (i.e. now introducing the bedroom tax for all social housing in the hope that smaller families in large houses will move out or remain overcrowded with their grown up children), which has been caused by mass immigration too fast into economies that are already struggling.    As usual the governments in these countries expect the ordinary public to pick up the tab !

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So Romania and Bulgaria are full of people "living in rubbish tips"...eh Man United.. "hugh..man" . Thats a bit of  generalisation dont you think about about two whole nations . When people say "all man united supporters" live DOWWN SOOOUFFF i didnt believe them... but now i see you "hugh  man" live in Kent. So it must be true... All real manchester people support City 

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I certainly think Spain is the best retirement option for British people. Yes, prices have gone up, but it's still cheaper to live here than in the UK, which means your pension will go further. Also, it's easily accessible, for visiting relatives and for trips back.

One thing that decided us on the Costa Blanca was that there were so many flights from Alicante back to the UK every day. If we had to get back in a hurry, or someone needed to get out here to us, you could do it on the same day if necessary. We usually drive  back - either to Santander or up through France in our motor home, but it's comforting to know that if we needed to get back in a hurry, we could.

Another thing that is great about Spain is the climate. Old bones are much more comfortable out here than in cold, damp England. I have rheumatoid arthritis and lupus, and winters in the UK were becoming unbearable, as I was practically housebound. Here, I still have problems, but I can get around a lot better, and I'm pain free a lot of the time.

Then there's the people - they just love life, and they carry you along with that. Yes, Spain is still worth retiring to.

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 Used to live in Spain going back 25yrs, now live in Gozo, Malta, similar climate matbe a little  warmer, everyone speaks English, much easier to get residency etc, very laid back, virtually no crime on Gozo, cheaper than UK and fantastic lifestyle so all things taken into consideration much prefer Maltese islands also flights home cheap, just been back to UK for a few days £100 return for 2 of us!!

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JWhite

Having had 2 awful winters here, we are yearning to be back in Spain and with the economic and political scene here deterioriating for the majority of British people, our future is looking more rosy in Spain.

What an odd thing to say.  You don't think the "economic and political scene" is deteriorating in Spain?  The UK is paradise compared to the Spanish economy and Spanish politicians.

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Sanchez -

 

As I went to great pains to point out, it is not altogether the economical situation here which is depressing us but the dumping on a massive scale of the rubbish of the EU and given the choice "in retirement" which is what we have been discussing, it is much better to be able to sit out in the sunshine and drink your wine in the company of like minded people who want to live in an area without beggars, druggies, muggers and Big Issue Sellers ! 

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 Interestingly, Sanchez, you say UK is a "paradise" compared with Spain on the economic and political front.  Even after UK has lost its credit rating?  It has a national debt of 86% of GDP compared to Spain's 69.3%.  UK owes around 1.5 trillion euros compared to Spain's 0.76 trillion so almost double.  Yes, Spain has a high level of unemployment but the UK is catching up, especially in the 18 to 25 age group.  On the political side, the UK is currently run by a bunch of amateurs (with even more amateurs waiting in the wings) and the bank owned by the public (RBS/Natwest) just publishing a loss of 5.2 billion pounds but still manages to give out 607 million quid in bonuses.  Now, don't get me wrong, I love the UK.  The places to go, the countryside, the majority of people being very nice even though inner cities are getting to be no-go areas.  The government puts more emphasis on stupid policies like gay marriage, reform of the House of Lords and so on when the economy should be its priority.  The reason the pound is losing ground daily is due to the ridiculous policies.  Inflation is incredible compared to Spain.  Savings give you pennies due to the BoE poiicy of keeping interest rates so low that it would be impossible to keep up with inflation.  They're now talking of minus interest rates which will mean no interest for the majority of savers.  The borrowing in UK adds 138 billion pounds every year and until that goes down there will be no way of getting out of these doldrums.  

I'm in no way saying Spain is a paradise but neither is the UK.  At least here I can sit and fume at stupid governments in the sunshine (yesterday excluded, of course).

 

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