Decided to deal.

hi steve 

i appreciate we have differing views on calidona , when you say the only way forward is to deal , can you confirm that calidona are actually  dealing in the real sence of the word or are they just simply happy for you guys on later phases to swap to unsold key ready units .

the reason i ask is that i have been dealing with them on roda and they are simply not prepared to deal ( swap yes / deal no ) .

A swap/deal will only work for those people who have something to offer to Calidona in return, such as bringing forward a completion contract. If somebody has merely refused to complete on a finished dwelling because they are looking for a discounted completion figure then I know that Calidona have in some cases offered a small incentive but as to getting a large refund I wouldn't have thought there was much chance. As far as I would imagine they are concerned and the purchase contract states; the full balance is payable on completion of the apartment or villa once it has its habitation license and should it not be paid then it is the purchaser that is in breach of contract. However I am not Calidona and cannot speak with any authority on these matters. All I can repeat is that Jane and I got a good deal (not just a like for like swap).

This message was last edited by SteveandJane on 26/03/2010.

From what I have heard the latest offer from Corvera to those not completing is two years mortgage free (financed by their own bank) and then they will put you on their guaranteed rental scheme.

If you got better than that Steve you have done well.

Thanks for that info adsyspain.

Any idea what they're offering those who don't want a mortgage? 

And does anyone know what the "guaranteed rental scheme" delivers?

I have no idea what else they will offer. I guess for those people contemplating completion the fact that Corvera are being more flexible can only be a good thing.

Guaranteed rental schemes are generally a complete load of b********s.

Developers usually offer this type of incentive to get people to purchase properties at a price that is over-inflated.  Looking at those people who are struggling to re-sell their properties it is clear that the original contract prices are over-inflated.

http://www.murciagolfproperties.co.uk/Apartments/Corvera_Golf_and_Country_Club

Admittedly, if you are fortunate, you will get some cash-back (perhaps 4 to 5% of the purchase prices for a couple of years) but you can bet that this won't actually be primarily generated by genuine bookings.

For example if the purchase price of your property was 220,000 euros then you would expect a return of  11,000 per annum.  The present rental rates on Corvera offered by the official rental department is 315 euros per week for a 2 bed apartment.  So in order to get the 5% return the occupancy rate would need to be in the region of 35 weeks a year.  Try and find an owner on Roda that is achieving this through Calidona’s rental services.

In the meantime you will be restricted to when you are able to use your apartment and invariably will be left with times of the year that will be the least appealing.  In addition you may have to pay management fees and the furniture package will be expensive.  Consider also the fact that the typical developer furniture package will be in excess of 10,000 euros then you can in effect wipe out your first years rental income.  If the apartment does actually get some use then you can also expect to replace the furniture every 4 years.

In addition to this, the company that manages the scheme will probably be set up as a separate legal entity which means that the guaranteed rental scheme is essentially only as strong as this business.  There can never be any guarantee that this business might fail.  It might be that the scheme is underwritten by an insurance company but there will be so many caveats that it would be virtually impossible to claim against it.  This is further complicated by the fact that you are dealing with such issues in Spain.

In terms of being mortgage free for 2 years, I would urge people to check the arrangement fees, subsequent interest rates, penalty clauses etc.

I don’t think that these offers reflect a sudden generosity on behalf of the developer but are no more than tools to entice you to complete.  They may be suitable for some people but I would urge the buyer to look at the fine detail.

PS does anyone remember Calidona developing their special relationship with De Vere that generates bookings for owners through De Vere clients?

Hi all,

I would agree (mostly) with MrU re guaranteed rentals - they are usually done in such a way in that the property purchaser ends up paying for it one way or the other. The French property market has a 'lease back' system which is along similar lines. I wouldn't necessarily agree that the properties for sale on that website were over-inflated as some are in Phase 1 which was probably at the lower end of the Corvera pricing. If the property market had kept rising, or at least flattened out instead of crashing then it would be a bit different. Obviously those people trying to sell their apartment for a severely reduced price must have their own reasons for a 'stress sale' of this nature. Job losses and denial of further credit could be just two factors here.

As I have said before, I live in Ireland, and we have seen the worst of the property crash here. Property values have fallen by anything from 30% to 60% depending on where you look and who you talk to. In today's national paper there is an article about apartments in Mullingar (decent-sized midlands town, county Westmeath) that were being sold as part of a bankruptcy/ receiver's sale - these properties were going to be sold for around E200K, but around 46 of them were sold over the weekend for between E70K for 2beds and up to E98K for the 3beds. Also, according to our wonderful (not) statisticians there are around 347,000 unoccupied properties in the Irish republic. Yes 347,000! Some of these are holiday homes and some are those ghost estates that are not quite finished due to banks contracting their credit and refusing to finance the completion of the development.                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I mention all this about Ireland just for a bit of context, I don't believe Corvera are necessarily the villains here, they are doing THEIR best to get through this unprecedented credit crunch which is affecting the whole world. I am sure THEY wish things were different and that they could move on more swiftly on all fronts.

I have a friend who has an apartment in Portugal, which is part of an apartment block. Most of the property owners in the block signed up for a 'guaranteed rental' type arrangement which worked well enough for a couple of years, but in the last two years it has 'run aground'. In 2009 the owners were advised that due to the economic downturn and the glut of properties/ rentals available in the area that the company operating the scheme were no longer able to pay the promised rental rates and that they were seeking to renegotiate the deal. For 2010 it looks even more shaky, and though I don't know how bad it really is, I do know my friend and his wife have had to go out there a number of times for various owner/ rental company meetings which has been a nuisance to say the least. He has even talked of having to try and rent it out himself through various holiday letting websites.

When I closed on our apartment last July, I asked the Corvera sales office about a guaranteed rental programme and was told that there wasn't one in place. The only offer that was available was if you bought their way-overpriced furniture pack (E15K for a 2bed 2 bath Tilo!!) that they would put your property on their website and rent it out @ E45 per night and charge you nothing for the cleaning. Whoopee-do. They get their (possible but not guaranteed to occur) cleaning costs up front as part of your furniture costs but I doubt they would be that pro-active in seeking rentals for you.

I would also agree with Mr U that people should look at the fine print and weigh up their options carefully. Everyone will have to do what suits them best, after doing their research and getting the best advice they can.

Best of luck to all.

Ian

An excellent, well balanced post and very informative.

Thanks Ian.

It's been a long wait for this post but the deal is finally done and we have our keys to our new Tilo Penthouse overlooking the 18th green and the sometime to be finished clubhouse.

We arrived on Sunday the 1st Aug and picked up the keys to our rental/loan apartment from security as previously arranged with Sami at Corvera.

In order to simplify certain terms of our deal, we re-negotiated it again on Monday with a slight change to terms but still emerged with a win-win situation that we believe works even better for Jane and myself.

After the legal documentation had been adjusted to synchronise with the new terms, we completed at the Notary's in San Javier on Tuesday and were finally handed our keys. I was extremely interested to note that Johnothan (the Legal Action Groups original solicitor) was in the next room, completing another Corvera couple on their apartment.

Although the furniture pack had already been installed along with the electricity, gas and water being connected; the air-con had not been installed nor the boiler commissioned, so despite our eagerness to get in, we waited until Wednesday to move from the rental/loan to our very own apartment.

Wednesday morning we drove to Ikea and the Nuevo Condominium shopping centre (30 mins) to buy a few additional 'bits' and returned to find the air-con installed and working. It's a wonderful feeling spending your first night in your very own place that you have worked so hard to get.

Thursday morning we went grocery shopping (at last) to LeClerc hypermarket (20 mins) in the Murcia Oest industrial district and on our return found that the boiler had been commissioned, so now everything was up and running and we had 9 days of holiday left.

Out on the golf course I got to meet a dozen or so E.O.S. / Corvera members and it was great to put faces to the names and usernames of the forum. It would have been better I admit if we'd been able to meet in the Clubhouse bar for a drink but that's life! I have suggested a temporary solution to the bar facility situation to the Calidona/ Corvera management team and I know that they are considering the alternatives or at least will be when everybody returns from holidays.

Can't wait to get back out there in October

If anybody else is considering doing what Jane and I have done, then please pm. me and I will gladly put you in touch with the right person in Calidona/Corvera who can make it happen for you as well.

All the best to all.................Steve

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Congratulations Steve  & Jane at last you have completed and can enjoy Corvera!!!!

We decided to deal after  reading you first post on 'decided to deal' and we transferred to phase 1 Menta and completed in June and are very pleased.

Unfortunately we just have not had any spare time  get to Corvera and enjoy it yet.

Shudi

 Good luck, Steve and Jane! 

Incidentally, we also completed on 3rd August,  and we are over on Friday for a few days to continue the hunt/decision on furniture etc, staying in Murcia this time in an attempt to remain focussed on furniture and the practical stuff, not golf and Rioja which is what happened last time!

We are ground floor Tilo overlooking 18th, I think in the block to the right of you, so see you there soon 

Thanks for your wishes Mazbaz, Shudi, Anita and all the rest that have sent them.

It's strange (and wonderful) that at last we have finally started to be able to put faces to the usernames of friends and neighbours that we seem to have known for so long.

It's also great that Jane and I have been able, in our own small way, to help other swappers and even some new prospective buyers to make the right contacts at Corvera with which to find a final completion deal. This is so satisfying and I have no qualms in continuing to provide details to others that may be interested. From the owners we've met at Corvera and those we've talked to but have yet to meet, I strongly believe that we are going to end up with a really tight knit community spirit and the problems we've encountered and still have yet to solve will undoubtedly in my opinion strengthen the bond.

The next stage of the dream will be meeting everybody at a spikes bar or clubhouse bar inaugeration party. IT WILL HAPPEN!

Keeping the faith.......Steve

Anybody thinking of a swap/deal or even NEW buyers, please pm me if you want to discuss or find out who to contact for the best 'direct' deal......... Steve