Community matters! DJ I

 My estimate is that over 70 percent of the people in Don Juan don't receive David's e-mails so it's not a very democratic or representative tool.

So if you state it gives a good overview of the situation how can you judge that if it's never discussed and not shared with the majority of the owners? Maybe the majority of owners would disagree, but how are you able to tell?

Stating that 'Please observe, the content of the report is to be treated as “internal use” and shall not be posted on the EOS nor be divulged to anyone who does not have the need to know.    ' 

is an official comittee point of view? Are you a new member of that comittee?

I don't think broad statements about undisclosed information do help. Either publish them or stay silent about the privileged communication you got.

Max.

I shall like my community matters to be kept within the community and NOT posted on EOS, regardless of the contents. What has been reported has taken place after an event and should only be based on facts. We must of course allow for errors due to translation and sometimes misinterpretation but these errors can be fixed easily.

The suggestion that the report contained matters not discussed and cannot be judged is surely conjecture. If you claimed not to have received one, then how could you possibly know its contents!?!?!?!?!?!  I do not see any other resident owner speculating on the contents of any report - non-resident owners often do not know what goes on but we don't speculate on EOS.

May be the trick is to ask politely for the information you need and then to accept it at face value?

This message was last edited by Jenx on 08/09/2009.

 Hi Jenx,

Could you do me a favour and use a larger font size. I'm not as young as I used to be so I have diffculty reading your post.

I don't know what you are saying about reports given after an event. The ' secret'  report from David is not about the actual meeting at all. Maybe you got another one than the rest of us?

Your suggestion that we fix translation and other errors after the meeting where we voted for a document as presented to us is hopefully a misinterpretation by you. It wouldn't be allowed by any law I know. You vote for the document you get. It was difficult enought that most people didn't get the actual document until the meeting itself. It should have been distributed at least a month in advance. 

My sources of information are in good order. Usually I know more than the comittee does as I'm a concerned owner with good access to all the public sources.. I know the local counsilor, know the law, represent lots of owners in my professional capacity and have very good relations to a lot of serious lawyers in this area. I don't need a report to know what's going in the development I live in.

Max.

Max

I do not want an on-line spat with you. You have this tendency to contradict yourself - if you already know more than the committee, then why are you making such a big deal about the lack of a report post the recent EGM? I also cannot see the urgency about the post meeting report because you would have heard everything at the actual meeting and you seem to believe that nothing can now be changed anyway.

Hope this font size is more to your liking.

 Hi Jenx,

I make a big fuss about the whole communication issue because I' m convinced that this is the biggest issue for any community.  It's not importamt that I know about the the things going on. It's important that the other owners know about them.

The report (the minutes) of the last meeting are already written and registred. I will have access to them, but almost 200 owners won't. That worries me.

Max.

 Max, How did you work out 200 owners won't have access to the official minutes of the meeting? This document is posted in everyone's post boxes and is also emailed to many owners and if there are owners out there who do not ever come out to DJ and do not receive the emails from the administrators then they can contact the administrators and request a copy and make sure their email address is registered to receive future updates. 

The email circular sent out by David is just an update of matters and not an official report or minutes of the meeting (any meetings) and so has no relevance here. As I have stated before it makes sense to keep confidential community matters out of a public forum like EOS. EOS is not the place for discuss or argue about private community issues.  

 RG, 

You confuse two issues. I stated that at least 70 percent doesn't have access to David's emails.

The other thing I mentioned is that I problably will be abte to read the minutes of the last meeting weeks before other people get them. That last part was a reaction to Jenx who claims to have access to a report of the last meeting and proposed changes after that meeting without us (attending) or the proxie users even knowing about these changes AFTER the meeting. I understand why you were not there as sitting there for hours to hear all votes on that important document will be evaluated later and  where needed changed is indeed a waste of time. But it's good to hear that at least one proxy voter (Jenx) knows what will happen with the document,

Max.

 No, I am not confusing the 2 issues in you last post you stated that 200 owners wont receive the report / minutes of the last meeting and that you are 'worried' that owners don't get reports that the committee send out which is totally false as I have explained in my post.

You claimed that you understand why I was not at the meeting but do you really really know why? seeing as you haven't spoken to me directly nor that you can read my mind I somewhat doubt it. Seeing as you are not on the committee it begs the question as to why you need to get your hands on the minutes way before anyone else may well be a positive sign of a man with way too much time on his hands and way too little to do. As someone else on this forum has suggested, golf is a great game in which to kill time.

Max

Read my post carefully - I made no undertaking about the receipt of a report. What I said was if by your logic, nothing  can be changed, then surely the report can only be based on facts.  You keep shooting yourself in the foot by making outlandish claims wholly unsupported by facts - even to reading into words which are not actually written. You are being very libellous again.

If there is any skullduggery. it is all to do with you - you claim to have an 'inside track' to everything including minutes of the last EGM. BTW, I am still waiting for an offical account of the matters discussed at that meeting from GICS, so your assertions are again wholly false and unsubstantiated.

To satisfy your curiosity, yes I do get all other communications by reason of being a DJI owner but the e-mails I get for social purposes are personal. Presumably you already know about this !

Lastly, I prescribe membership of several golf clubs which hopefully will help you kill time.

 A confusing message Jenx, maybe you can reword it?

Max.

 It's by the way remarkable that out of the fifty clients we have in Don Juan I there are just two people who refused to pay their bills. They also are often on the list of debtors of our community. Yet they are very active contributors to this community forum. The new rules say that these kind of people are not allowed access to the pool, unfortunately this is legally imposilble why I opposed that rule. However I would support the idea that they are not allowed to discussing community issues on a public forum.

Max.

The idea that no confidential community matters be discussed on a public forum such as EOS was already raised at a recent EGM and everyone was in favour of that except you and there is no one else except you who keep raising and posting confidential community issues on this forum. If you have non paying clients perhaps this is because the service promised was not delivered!

That hasn't been decided on any EGM I ever attended which happen to be all of them. I also can't find it in the minutes.  However I would never discuss confidential community matters on any public forum because I don't want to harm DJ. 

As you are aware I have been vice-president for longer than the current comittee is sitting and I can assure that I never posted anything confidential. I still don't; I keep people informed who clearly appreciate that judging by the PM's and e-mails. I have stated before that the well-run communities in Spain usually have public accessible websites with all the minutes, financial information etc. It actually encourages people to buy into these communities because they clearly are transparant and accessible. Hiding stuff is usually a bad sign.

Max.

Having read the discussion of what can and what should not be posted on the open forum EOS I like to give my view on this.

Generally on an open forum like EOS one shall newer post messages what can gives the reader an impression that the place is an open battleground.

Thus, confidential information shall newer be posted here.

Internal use information is information is only intended for members and shall not be posted here ether.   

Messages accepted shall be written in a positive way.

Create an Attitude of “YES”. Develop a mindset of cooperation and “can do.”

Build Mutual Respect, Kindness and Support. Listen and learn from one other.

Messages that do not meet these simple rules shall not be posted the same day. Wait until tomorrow and consider if the message really solves any problem. Messages that create more heat than light shall never be posted.

Thank You for consider these simple rules.

Hi Wilander, my post of 13 Sep 2009 19:24 in the online spat discussion is very similar so let's confine all the criticism on individual neighbours to that special thread. This is about community matters.

Today the locks were in place for the pool (well in advance of the minutes of the last meeting). There is a notice that you can get a key if you apply for it at the little booth. Unfortunately this being a Wednesday the administrator was not available. So you can imagine there were a lot of people standing at our door complaining. I assume this will go on for a month or two as most people don't visit Don Juan on a regular basis. 

After our experience with the garage locks which drove us crazy with daily demands we will now ask Irma for all the keys for our clients. But others should be aware that renters, friends, etc can't access the pool anymore.

The second pool is closed for maintenance, just like the pool of phase II so the pressure to get these keys is high. It would be good if the committee explained on a notice board that we actually have two pools (lots of people are only aware of the first one) and that the other pool is solely for phase II owners due to arguments between the two phases. At least it would save me a lot of time and would spread the usage of our own pools. This would be beneficial for all as maintenance and wear and tear could be better managed..

August was very busy, but now the usual quiet atmosphere has returned. I still have to find illegal users of the pools as has been reported by some, but they are anyway very quiet again. 

Max.

The cholrine dispenser in the block 8\10 pool stopped working yesterday and it was decided to close the block 6\7pool and put its dispenser in the block 8\10 pool so that it could be kept open. The block 6\7 pool would then be closed until the dispenser was repaired. If both pools were closed today I do not know why but it has nothing to do with the keys and assuming we have a functioning pool tomorrow it will be open.

 David,

For months you have told that the pools were open when they were closed which was visible to all residents. I don't want to start the same discussion again about these keys. I know when people are standing at my door, but a picture is worth a thousand words so they say, so here is two thousand words:

There is a trick to open this door without a key, but it's not very convenient and only possible with small hands. The same problem btw they had with the phase II pool so I assume our contractor will be called back and earn some extra money to fix that as well.

Max.

As I have said before - it is imposible to please everyone.  I have no doubt the committee is doing its best in the interests of the majority despite the constraints - I feel able to say this having only met one member of the committee.  It seems to me that some of the complainants are expecting the pools and gardens to be in the same condition as a private house/villa  where the facilities are lavished with personal care and only for personal use. Of course we must strive to attain that standard but we need to give it time for improvements to be made.

It certainly helps for everyone to remember that our committee is comprised of volunteers. For those of you who have complained repeatedly and think you can do better , I hope you will put yourselves forward to serve the community at the next AGM. Otherwise it is a case of put up or shut up!