Rough justice yet again!

Whew! Good to se you Maria. Enjoy your week-end too!

MAGICMEG

while there is still such helpful info' coming from several posters that  really can help, then I think the thread could run and run? Bound to go up and down the list, but while there is still so much rough justice in the Spanish system then there will always be a place for a thread that offers advice, support and help. I think if everyone wronged would stand together as they do on this thread, then change would happen much faster, but many don't want to open old wounds or admit to making a wrong decision under pressure and are making the best of a bad job, so are assumed ''happy'' by those who could and should be paying back those for whom the system has so clearly cheated.

So well done everyone contributing, and those who don't have justice problems, please be patient with those who do, and let's hope the posts will be more positive one day when people start to get the justice they deserve?

Have a good weekend everyone.

Just in case you have not seen it elsewhere :)

There are many things to be done depending on how the finantial/economic situation developer in the comiong months.

First thing to bear in mind is that this is going to be a buyers market for many years ahead. And with that no-pressure by sellers and running the show

If you are pursuing cancellation ( action that can also be called: "restore action" as it put balance in the contract after an abusive contrat") You have got several  finantial assets:

-A potential credit against a developer for the refund of x plus legal interests.

- Buying rights on the property in between ( the developer cannot sell to anyone else till the contract is effectively cancelled and your money refunded).

- A better position within the creditor´s meeting ( if that ever happened)

So... it is not just a matter of contract cancellation at whatever cost, it is a matter of re-establishment. Many of the clauses of many of the contracts I have seen duting the last 3 years and a half are corrosively abusive. Repugnant.

I am enlisting some of the games you can play with the above mentioned assets at hand ( but I am not a finances expert.... so please, make your conmtributions! ):

- You can negotiate a great price reduction with the developer along the judicial proceeding and complete on the property at a much reduced price and with much reduced interest rates

- You can sell your buying rights to someone else and withdraw  the claim,  negotiate with both developer and new buyer on the payment of the judicial costs ( it seems German and Norwegian have already some money to look for some sun).

It is all a matter of some fluctuants, not rigid factors such as:

. Evolution of the market

. Flexibility of developer

but the possibilities are there ( together with many other ones, I am sure)

that.... together with the awesome sensation of being back in control of the situation or at least of a great deal of it. What do you think?

Could we all together transform the current situation in a win-win scheme?

Please send your ideas and have a great weekend.

Maria

Good morning all

just thought i'd remind everyone that following a six year battle to get our developer to court for theft, our case was delayed for 12 months which allowed the developer to go in to administration. As if this wasn't bad enough, it's five months today since our court case and stll the judge hasn't  passed sentence, and that should be done in max 20 days.!!!

I don't think anything I could say could decribe just how wrong a system is that still treats people like this. It speaks for itself.

Have you personally written to your EU Minister about this? The more that do so (with specific details)   the better.

Baroness Kinnock of Holyhead (Glenys Kinnock who replaced Caroline Flint in July 2009)

House of Lords

London SW1A OAA

ads

I will this week now the five months since our day in court has come and gone. What makes it more bizzare is that those we are up against our now facing a 12 year jail sentence for fraud!!!.  How much more evidence does a judge need that would take five months to make a decision when we have a signed contract, no property and even an admission of guilt in the form of an offer from the developer minuets before the case started, though deemed unacceptable by our lawyer as he said the developer couldn't even be trusted to honour his cash offer and the only way to be sure of getting anything was through a property settlement!!! 

I know this is difficult to contemplate but have you considered taking a second opinion on how this is being handled by your lawyer?

Would another lawyer like to comment on this situation that Goodstitch has presented and if there is another method of gaining justice from this scenario (even if it's through a PM)?????

It certainly is a classic case to demonstrate the ineffectual justice system that predominates right now.

There are actions against Justice administration at hand.

Could you expand further on this please Maria.

I mean that as almost as any other legal operator, administration and justice administration is subject to Law and corresponding liabilities.

I am translating below related basic provisions:

Article 2. Object.

 
1. By the procedures under this regulation public authorities grant the right to compensation to individuals as provided in Chapter I,  Title X of the Law on Legal Regime of Public Administrations and Common Administrative Procedure, for those damages suffered in any of their property and rights provided that the damage is the result of normal or abnormal functioning of public services, except in cases of force majeure or damages which the individual has to legally bear.

 
This regulation will also apply for the recognition of  liabilities incurred by public authorities acting in private law relations.

2. The resolution of the proceedings or, where appropriate, the agreement for agreed solution will set the amount and mode of compensation, where applicable, in accordance with the criteria for calculating and paying down provided in Article 141 of Law on Legal regime of Public Administrations and Common Administrative Procedure.

 
The payment in kind against money compensation will be used  when it is more appropriate to ensure proper and appropriate compensation to the public interest, formalizing, in any case, by agreement between the government and the concerned person.

 
3. Decisions and agreements  will end the administrative route.

If a group action can be formed, better, in my opinion. That would help to fight for a better justice administration. Yes, we do have rights for that.

Hi Maria

I don't doubt there is some law that covers this fiasco by the courts themselves, but once again is the required regulation in place to assure that the law is implemented?. If not, what are we left with?, just more money and time wasted trying to get those in a position of trust to do the right thing?

Yes, of course there are regulations that implement Law in this aspect.  The one in force now is from 1993.

Best regards,

Maria L. de Castro

OK Maria, at what point can you action this law? Is it at some end point where the purchaser has no other options open to them (many years down the line), or is it available to enact during the legal process, i.e can it be enacted before the developer goes into administration if it can be proved that the purchaser has been significantly compromised up to that point by court delays?

Bottom line, what is considered an acceptable delay? Is this in itself a grey area?

Could in effect the courts suggest force majeure given the volume of cases now being presented and thereby suggest matters were taken out of their hands, or should they have been seen to have taken measures to find extra resources in order to retain a decent timescale for cases to be judged and decisions executed. It's all very vague as it stands.

It is necessary that the  Courts decission becomes uneffective due to delays. I need to consider the particular case. You can aact once the damage is already existing.

Let me go deeper on this and come back to you with a blogpost on this tomorrow.

maria

had our case been delayed for say 4 months and not 12 months, with a quick desicision from the court our embargo could have been put in to action, but if the delay passing sentence was still as long as it has been we still would have lost out as the developer would have still gone in to administration.

Our chance of justice has been ruined by the courts using delaying tactics twice!!!.  If the courts themselves faced heavy penalties for delaying cases or sentence on cases, then I don't think they would be so keen not to serve fast justice. What or who is there to make them act in a reasonable manner though?  Why should I now have to pay a lawyer to make sure that even the courts are doing their job properly?, and how long and how much money would that take?

No, it's a dishonest mess by those in positions we have to be able to trust to do what they are paid very hansomely to do. Sadly and very wrongly we can't trust them, and until that changes then there wont be justice for many.

I fully understand your frustration. Please pm me to see if we can get somewhere together.

Best,

Maria

And in the interim it's imperative to pass on details to the EU Minister, Goodstitch.

It's absolutely critical now that they be made aware of these growing instances of injustice.

Yes !  We must keep up the  pressure on  MEPs and  the UK government and if need be  we should miss out the " middle men " and go directly to the  foreign office (Spain Desk )   . Most replies I get  say " we have past this information to the foreign office "  (Spain desk )    Did they ??????

Lets stop becoming a minor irritation , lets become an annoying, persistent , unbearable rash  that refuses to go away .

I email them all at least once a week . MEPs ,SMPs and  UKMPs if nothing else they now know who  I am and that I am not going away . MM

The promised blogpost on Justice administration liability for delays.

http://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/costaluz/2303/legal-tip-149-responsibility-of-the-administration-of-justice-for-undue-delays.aspx

Legal tip 149. Responsibility of the administration of justice for undue delays.
22 September 2009 @ 13:23

 

Rough justice / sometimes the more simply we state our case the better it is understood .

In 2004 I paid 70,000 euros to a very large and  reputable Spanish Company as deposit  on a holiday home .

I am not an investor nor was I trying to make a fast buck . I just wanted a place for me and my children to enjoy for holidays . (so much time has passed that my children are now at university and holiday on their own , nothing can replace these years spent waiting and hoping  )

This company took my money gave me a bank guarantee and I waited patiently for my house to be completed .They did not build my house and I have spent thousands trying to have my money returned .They have my money ,I have nothing .What part of this does the Spanish legal system have trouble understanding .They took my money I have Nada . Surely this is theft in any language ,in any judicial system this is quite clearly theft .

The finite details of why all this has happened are  an irrelevance to me .I have been robbed and the Spanish judicial system is laughing  in the face of honour ,decency and the basic human right of justice for the victims of crime  .

All the legal jargon in the world , quoting this law and that judgement  is of no help at all  when the system is intrinsically corrupt and flawed to the point of being a total lottery for anyone brave enough to buy a ticket .

I can only thank those like Maria for trying to change the system but will it ever change ,I don't think it ever will . It does not even have the good grace to   MM