Is living in Spain really that bad now???

Hi to all,

My first posting on EOS.

I lived and worked in Ibiza for the best part of four years and hope to relocate to Spain in the not too distant future.

I seem to hear nothing but bad news about how Spain has changed, How 1000's are looking to sell up and return to the UK, is it really that bad now? I ask as I would like to know the feeling that you have, from ground level, so to speak.

Ok, I know the Euro has made life difficult, and ney on impossible for people who survived on a pension from the UK, but what about the quality of life you have? The stabbings and shootings over here (I live in South East London, by the way) are now on a daily basis, I dare not go out at night to see a film or a play as the amount of danger and abuse you get on the way home is just not worth it (its a disease that effects all the UK now, even the countryside!! As I am sure you are all aware). Most of the local incidents don't make it to the papers, its all word of mouth now (think the papers do not have the room to report it all anymore, and people have just become immune to it anyway) 

I know Spain has its fair share of crime, but the Guardia Civil do appear on the streets now and again, don't they?

The police here are scared to get out of thier cars, its pretty lawless after 9pm.....gangs of youths (20+) hover around, boys and girls on station platforms, no staff, poor lighting..............its not much fun and I know lots of people who have become hermits,like me, its safer!!!

I have lived all over London, its the same where ever you try to stay, and on top of that the going rate for a small one bedroom flat to rent with all bills taken into account is £1100 per month!! That leaves nothing to socialise with anyway!

With the comming elections, all the partys are going to cut back on all services!! They even admit to that now, so its going to get very very hard to stay here or want to in the feature!!!

So please, any good news you can offer would be a lift!!! for my future dreams!!

Thank you,

Fergus. 

Hi Fergus, welcome to Eye on Spain.

I think that firstly, Spain is a huge country and every area is different.  We moan about the ridiculous price of things along the coast but drive inland for half an hour and prices are what they should be.  Many people can no longer afford to live here on their UK pensions and so have returned back to the UK.  Many have also been caught out by the recession here and cannot make ends meet which is why they are returning "home".

There is crime everywhere and petty crime is worse in Spain now as unemployment approaches an anticipated 25% by the end of next year.  I suppose when you live in London you're going to be aware of a lot more compared to others who may live in more rural parts of the UK.

I think the important thing to always realise is that nowhere is perfect.  There will always be a compromise.  Many people seem to view Spain as the answer to all their problems but it's rarely the case.  You still have to work and earn money here and jobs are very scarce and the salaries lower than in the UK.

We are very happy here.  We do like the Spanish way of life for our kids especially.  They are happy and that is what matters most to us.  I don't think it's so much the weather for us, although it does help to be able to do more outdoor stuff.  We have made some good friends here and although business is tough we are still keeping our heads above water and as long as we can do so we'll hopefully be staying put for many years to come.

Maybe we'll see you around in the not too distant future...

Justin

 I have just returned from the UK, it was my first trip in over a year.........I would not move back there if someone gave me a house, a car and ten years spending Money...........

Spain is not perfect by any standards but in my opinion is far better for my  family here.

We used to live in a nice little village that has now 70% of its pubs closed and is patrolled by gangs of youths.......after 2 days my wife didn't feel safe and wanted to come back.........

Don't believe all the hype about how bad it is here........i speak to hundreds of people that love it and would never go back.

If you come here for the right reasons you won't be dissapointed.

I won't go back to UK either after living over there for over 26 years.

Canada (Vancouver) is better than UK  but I'm willing to try Spain as the weather is nicer. Crime is everywhere nowadays. We were burgalared in Uk & in Canada.  I've heard about  crime in Spain but I'm willing to take a chance.

Dear All,

don't recognise any of it in my area,

but if life is that bad you need to get out,

what about a room in Herne Bay at £315 or self contained at £500, that should leave you enough to commute in if you are safe on your own,

but if you need a lift to Dover to exit the country, let me know,

I am sure I could help.

Regards

Norman

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes!!!

Spain has done it for me and my Venezuelan wife!!

We had to go back to the UK last September, first time in four years and I felt claustrophobic!!

I felt a prisoner in my own country!! I am English, born in London, felt like a stranger!!

There are problems here, worsened by the unemployment crisis, etc., but as long as you are reasonably "street cred.", you can enjoy a good lifestyle in a very pleasant climate.

From what you say in your thread, if you gave me 10 minutes to pack, I would not know what to do with the other five??

Go for it and good luck!!

Thanks Guys and Gals!

Its appreciated!!!

Viva Espana!!

Ferg

I am not one of the rose tinted brigade who refuse to accept that Spain has its flaws among them are dog poo on the streets, poor customer service and consumer rights but I won´t go on as I have just been to the park with my children until 7pm where the other mothers from the school chatted to me and make me feel welcome where they could just ignore me as a foreigner. I would rather walk into a party full of Spanish strangers than a party ful of English strangers on the whole.  This is just one example.

Susan

We made our permanent move to Spain this March and we couldn't be happier. The village in which we live is lovely - people, atmosphere, everything.

Spain, and especially Formentera del Segura, has made us very welcome - we even got married at the Town Hall for free! - and I can't think of a better place to be.

Yes, there are some unpleasant moany people here, but there are people like that in the UK. The roads are clearer (4 cars and it's a traffic jam). Spaniards mostly take pride in their towns/villages: the ladies still sweep outside their houses every day, like they used to in the UK, but don't any more. Neighbours TALK to one another, like they used to in the UK, but don't any more. We've made some wonderful friends here who would go out of their way to help, making friends in the UK is harder because everyone hides behind the closed doors. I guess we're lucky because I am not aware of an increase in crime, in fact I am not aware of ANY crime in this village. The street cleaners come and sweep regularly, the bins are emptied daily, we've got lovely new pavements and lights, everyone speaks to us. The Spanish are excellent at putting on fiestas; when was the last one you remember in your old home town in the UK? ... oh and finally, there's the weather!

¡Viva España!

Being positive in realism... that is almost what is needed to take the best out of the place you chose to live in.

So, yes, maybe.... being realistic before coming to Spain is essential ( even having it written on a paper) ane once here, do not forget why you came and try to make the best ou of your life here.

In many occassios simplicity brings joy and freedom so do not committ to many expenses and look for easy , simple ways of living. Look for the meaning of culture, food, idiosincrasy... to know where you are swimming in and get orientation.

Look for good, real friends ( it is not easy but is possible and brings so much satisfaction)... and read, study, converse....about Spain and the spanish culture: integration.

And again... try always to stay positive in realism.

Hi Fergus

Just a word or two of warning. 

There is a very ugly side to Spain that has hardly been mentioned on this thread. The justice system!!!  It is a farce, it really is. That's not just me being negative, it's fact. If you haven't seen my 'rough justice' thread, I'll sum up. After 5 years of being conned by one of Spain's largest developers I got the courts to accept my case. It then took them two years and three months to reach a decision, (which I won!) in which time the unbelievably long delay meant the developer had gone in to administration.  The reason given that there have been so many cases of corruption in Spain that the courts are way behind dealing with cases. Not acceptable by any means, and at the moment i'm left with nothing!

Lawyers Maria and Lawbird have been very helpful in doing what they can to help, but they have to work with very poor regulation and what has proved to be a very poor and slow justice system for many people. The laws are there but often not implemented.  There are some very good people doing their best to force change, and I'm very grateful to them and the support of Justin and the team and various forum members for supporting the fight for justice.

I had dreams of living in Spain for years, and this thread amongst others proves there are many people very happy with their life in Spain, but this has left me with a very bitter taste. If I do get justice one day then I hope my former love of Spain will return, but I want people to know a seriously bad side to the country that I have experienced first hand.

Good luck, and as has been said there is good and bad to Spain and the UK, I don't think either is ''better'', it just depends what's more important to you.

Goodstich: you are right:

You may like to read this:

http://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/costaluz/2400/legal-tip-159-new-money-for-justice-in-spain.aspx

Thanks always

Maria

Hi Maria

I'd better post on the 'rough justice' thread.!

 "Good luck, and as has been said there is good and bad to Spain and the UK, I don't think either is ''better'', it just depends what's more important to you."

Well said goodstich.

After my visit to the UK  and never having any problems with the Justice system here i can say with Hand on Heart that my enviroment is most important thing for me and my family........no competition i am afraid.

Georgia

I think unless you have to rely on the Spanish justice system for justice then you wouldn't know just how bad it is compared the UK, and I have used both.  Having said that, if it wasn't for Spain's hopeless lack of regulation when it comes to crooked developers, lawyers and council officials etc, and  to make matters worse a lack of any decent consumer protection body, then many people wouldn't have been cheated. Crooks will prosper where they can get away with it.  The mess Spains property industry is in is a reflection of the faults i've mentioned amongst others. It was bound to end this way.

I agree though that the environment is what most people prefer about Spain, me included. (In the places not ruined!)

We moved here last November and I love it.

It reminds me of life in the 1950s/60s when people used to sit outside their front doors and chat together. The Spanish are a very sociable bunch of people and my neighbours are wonderful.

I enjoy having sunny days in winter, instead of constant greyness.

Prices are reasonable around here, not like the holiday areas but not as cheap as they were when we had around 1.5 euros to the pound of course. I would love those days to return.

There's only one thing I don't like and that's the mozzies. I seem to be very tasty meat indeed..

Laury

I have to echo the positive comments about the way of life here. We've live here for over a year and would not move back to the UK, like Laury says, it's like turning the clocks back 50 years to a time when people had time for each other, when the pace of life was healthier and the streets were safe.

Yes, there are negatives too, but we find for us, they are far outweighed by the positives.

Jacqui

 Yep, us to. We moved over in Feb and love it. Everything we have had to do over here ,like NIE ,Residencia, Medical cards etc, has gone smoothly.More than I can say for getting pension and taxes sorted out at the UK end.They are still messing us about,"losing" letters etc.

I think the weather must have a lot to do with it but people ,even fellow brits, generally seem to be more relaxed and sociable over here. Crime? we definately feel safer over here.

We have had a lot of family and friends over to visit and they all envy our lifestyle. Having said that it would not be the same if we were not retired.

We moved here a year ago after living in Prague ,Czech Republic for several years and are very happy with our new life in Spain. The weather, quality of fresh food, service in general, friendly people-all much much better in comparison.  A lot depends on your attitude and expectations. We live in a quiet, residential area, a 'proper' street not an urbanicacion, our neighbours are Spanish.  We are happier being in a non-Brit-dominated area but it's good to be able to socialise with our compatriots occasionally. Yes, there are serious problems here with the poor state of the economy, the corruption that seems endemic in local government and anyone who faces losing property because of town hall corruption or incompetence deserves sympathy and understanding.

The same cannot really be said for those who thought they could make a quick buck from investing in 'cheap' property.  Greed has led to the downfall of many short-sighted would-be property entrepreneurs. At the end of the day, we are here as (mainly) welcome guests and anyone who is desperately unhappy has the option of leaving. To those who would say in reply :'I can't , I've nowhere to go' I would point out the folly of leaving yourself without an exit strategy.

Well.....

10 months on and we are still very happy with our move to Spain and our new lives together.

The quality of our lives is so much better and I think this is down to the fact that everything is better than our expectations.

The quality of fresh food, a happier and more relaxed attitude to life and the struggles one faces... and the weather does help... oh yes!

Even though we've had the good and the bad since we've moved, we wouldn't go back.

And before anyone says that things are bad in Spain... yes they are, but look around where you live, and you will see similar things going on... but things can only get better... and if it takes longer than elsewhere then so be it... at least we are at ground zero ready for the next boom!

Also, sitting in the Jacuzzi/Hot Tub at 10pm every night, looking up at the stars, relaxing, chillin' .... yes! that may have something to do with it!

Oh! And I'm 41, am not retired and do not receive a winter fuel payment, so that doesn't pay for my Cava!!!