Is living in Spain really that bad now???

Goodstitch, the problem is (and sorry for REPEATING myself), as always, you have yet again posted about your battle, it would appear, on a thread that wasn't initiated for that purpose!  Have you ever lived in Spain?  Anyone who needs to know, as I have stated MANY times before, can source information about the cons of buying in Spain (or any country in the world) and the injustice of certain legal systems (again, anywhere in the world - have you experienced the middle east???) and the difference in cultures without having people hijack threads on EOS to vent their personal dismay at the legal system in this country!

That doesn't mean to say that people don't care, it just means to say that people have accumulated their own knowledge/have their own agenda and don't need to be constantly reminded about others' personal gripes - because they can (and probably have done!) seek out that information all by themselves, believe it or not without their questions being hijacked for others' personal issues!!

Sorry folks, just fed up with the usual hype that seems to appear on every thread that's started!!!

Must agree with Pitby having lived in Singapore,Oman,Cyprus,Malaysia but not yet Spain although we are still looking.

There are differences in all cultures and justice systems.

I have also lost around 100K but it will not destroy my life.

Having stated your case Goodstitch you elicited a good amount of sympathy but you are fast becoming the dinner party bore and your level of sympathy is becoming greatly reduced.

Suzanne etc have worked extremely hard on all our behalf but she limits her comments to the appropriate threads and her case is held in greater esteem.

However I wish you and all those who have been robbed well for the future.

I imagine forums like EOS are one of the sources people use to find out about the pro's and cons, and justice system etc. Non residents can be affected by these things so it would seem reasonable that they are qualified to comment honestly  on their experiences which are relevant to the original question.

Roberto

must you take every comment I make as being 'anti Spanish?'

Goodstich, I never said you were anti Spanish. Again, you seem to be cutting and pasting and taking things out of context to suit your own agenda, on yet another thread that really didn't need hijacking by you. As others keep telling you. WE HEARD YOU ALREADY!!

Poppyseed you said "I imagine forums like EOS are one of the sources people use to find out about the pro's and cons, and justice system etc. Non residents can be affected by these things so it would seem reasonable that they are qualified to comment honestly  on their experiences which are relevant to the original question."

Yes, you are quite right - but there is a place where they can they do so!!  On the appropriate thread or one started by themselves or others for that purpose!  This thread was initiated for those to comment about living in Spain - or those who are qualified about living in Spain!  If you haven't done so, how can you comment! 

Obviously, if you have had an experience about 'your intention to live in Spain' then you may well also have something to post - but to reiterrate what has already been reiterated on numerous threads through-out Eye on Spain forum is just beyond acceptable!  We've all heard it/read it a hundred times when we didn't need to read it again!!  We can all choose to read what we want to read!  We don't need to click on a thread to read the usual diatribe of the usual people who usually hijack any thread going!!

Good Morning everyone.

ok folks, i've well and truly got the message.  I agree that  my posts are very often about myself and others being cheated, and I shouldn't bang on about it in every thread. I'll try and stick to the injustice threads in future, but it's difficult when you read about the Spanish pro's of 'the difference' between the the UK and Spain, with no reference to the cons that have hurt so many.

Sorry about that, and continued thanks to those who show patience and understanding to the rants of those wronged.

Morning Goodstitch...Well done!!!

Pitby is right though, how can we comment if we don't live there. I lived in Sabby 20 years ago, when morgtgage rates in England were at 13%. Spain then seemed like a good option. I made some good friends, English and Spanish, and had a wonderul time. Unfortunately circumstance forced me to return to UK some 2 years later. But hey, been back this year, the new wife and myself have bought an apartment, so next year more trips out for us - Hoorah. Mind you it will be a while before I can live there once again.

The time we have spent in Sabby this year I notice, there is still the community spirit that existed then. The spanish are still friendly. The sun still shines. The only down side for me is I'm 20 years older.

Also had my taste of 'New Language' this week. I mean, had to talk Spainsh on the phone to my banks customer services. Whist I can hold my own in a conversation, its alot more difficult over the phone, and having to understand what the robot voice is saying - well I rest my case. New words like 'digital signature' ; 'internet banking' etc. Think I may have to go back to college for a brush up.

Keep the faith

Phil

Just to get back on track. I have lived in Spain for 5 years, so think I have served my apprenticeship, and still love it although could do with the exchange rate to improve.

But then I loved living in UK as well. Neither countries are faultless. Name me a country that is.  Nowhere is perfect and constantly comparing like with like ends up in ever decreasing circles, The latter comment having NOTHING to do with the property market.

Retired people  whose former residences have been within spitting distance of superstores believing living up a Spanish mountain or off a long dirt track is going to be heaven are in for a rude awakening and consequently will soon become disillusioned. Equally so will those who live nose to tail on purpose built ,mainly 2nd home, communities when they have been used to more space. Even if it meant a 5 mile drive to the golf club.

Happiness is when choosing a new location, anywhere, prioritising what you like and need from your current abode and sticking to it.

Philevans

just one point, I feel those who have had quite alot of experience of how a sysytem works , been through the courts etc, are at liberty to comment on that part of Spain. though of course not all the other aspects of living there.  

Dear All,

just back from three weeks in the depths of French "compagne" south of Poitiers in a "gite" type accommodation.

good weather but no balmy "hot tub" nights.

enjoyed it, been before and enjoyed it more, things have changed.

7 franc routier meals are now 11 euros, locals claim that their ten franc intro euro is now worth one franc.

MacDonalds are everywhere.

lots of goat's cheese but no goats, all locked in air-conditioned luxury sheds, good Muscadet, recently £1.50 now £3.50.

It seems that the domestic accommodation and gardens were an oasis of sanctuary for every pest and bug imaginable with trillions of millions of flies.

learnt the Aussie salute with both hands and wore out three fly swats, body heavily insect bitten but no sign of human aggression.

watched locals eating outside, hardly noticing the flies anymore than they noticed their bald pates playing host to the sex and aggression games being played out there.

enjoyed practising a tiny amount of french with much enthusiasm from the locals.

everywhere it seems changes and many posts here must be congratulated.

getting old brings much dissatisfaction especially with the young and more so with other people's young.

but cannot share all the UK complaints posted which seem a bit much.

no reply to my offers of fast car exit or sanctuary, so assume the original post was also a bit overdone, a bit like techno's "driven out by knife wielding gangs of five-year olds", perhaps?

liked Chimps post on our MPs hope it is truthful, had recent experience of local planning fraud enquiry, advised by experienced police officer that local political corruption is widespread, also believe that from my own agricultural applications with the local council which is Canterbury.

recent dealings with some of their building control officers suggest also that they may be asylum material.

like the idea of generous unemployment for short period with forced employment and study.

not sure who is right but like the sound of living in Spain and wish all who try it well.

Regards

Norman

Thought I'd add my twopennorth...........................Living in Spain is fustrating in many areas, it's time consuming

( the manana syndrome ! )and the language is spoken fast and furious and usually loud. The exchange rate has

devalued my pension and my worldy wealth is not worth as much when i transfer it from UK. The 'community' Urbanisation

system over here is fraught with stress, especially if you're married to El Presidente. It's either red hot or too cold and there are no

seasons as in UK.

The summers are full of holiday makers and you can't get a place on the beach or in the communal pool !!

WOULD I GO BACK TO THE UK ??????

NOT ON YOUR ( or my ) LIFE....................for all the fustration etc. etc. etc............I'd rather be here...Ilove it !!!!!

Quote Norman : "a bit like techno's "driven out by knife wielding gangs of five-year olds", perhaps?"

Norman, sorry but I must contradict you.

Seeing as you have unearthed a partial truth from on old post of mine, I thought I would comment further and state for the record that I never, ever said knife wielding gangs of five year olds! I did however mention that the yob culture in Britain was a major contributing factor as to why we left the UK. The fact that successive Governments of both Tory and Labour have been unable to deal with the problem.

One of the route problems is lack of education of the parents as to what their kids are REALLY getting up to when they are supposed to be around a friend's house... they are actually down the street a mere few hundred yards away inside a bus shelter drinking alcohol, smoking, brandishing knives and hurling abuse at anybody who passed them by... including young kids and pensioners. They once did it to me... all I can say is that after a few more direct altercations they didn't do it again and even left the scene for good!

This is my own actual experience of where we used to live in the UK, and when we visit my parents, it makes me cringe to know that the same happens there... until I turn up.... and then for a few days or a few weeks the yobs disappear... only yo re-appear when the know I'm not there!

Also, more Police actually on the beat with more powers to deal with this sort of antisocial behaviour, allowing them to arrest and detain in a Police cell those yobs who would transgress the law, and then get the parent(s) down to the Police Station and start the ball rolling by giving the child and the parent(s) community sentences. I think if the parent(s) had to 'do the time for the crime' in addition to the child, they might reconsider letting their kids wander the streets at night?

So, now to getting this thread back on topic... Is living in Spain really that bad now???

I must point out that the only yobs I see around the Manilva area are the kids of those that have come here on holiday, and the parents themselves are so hell bent on enjoying themselves that they don't care what their kids get up to. Thankfully it is the minority of those holiday makers that attend these parts that allow such to happen. However the ONLY time I've had words with yobs out here, it has transpired that they were British and they were also very, VERY drunk... and when I pointed out the error of their ways... and that the Police were just around the corner, they were very quick to shut up and leave the area.

We don't get any trouble from the Spanish kids, in fact they seem very polite, as they know what they are in for if they get into trouble.

Again, one of the main contributing factors of why we moved to Spain... Family Values!

It made me laugh to see a spokesman for Tesco's last Friday stating that the new method of acquiring produce from, guess where... yup! SPAIN.... would allow them to deploy these goods to stores within 24hrs and the goods being so fresh having only been picked the previous Monday!

Previous Monday!!!!

When we go down to the Market on a Friday, the produce has been picked that morning!!!! Maybe the latest the day before!!!

Another reason why we consider living in Spain is not that bad, especially when you even just take these two factors into the equation: Live in the UK or live in Spain?

For us, we have a better life in Spain than we did have in the UK... even without the balmy nights in the hot tub!

We have always maintained that living in Spain is not for everyone... but until you've tried it... don't knock it!!

getting old brings much dissatisfaction especially with the young and more so with other people's young.

Yes, Norman, but also with the not-so young, who really should know better! Great post, by the way.

The 'community' Urbanisation system over here is fraught with stress, especially if you're married to El Presidente

Karen, SO true - worse, in fact, if you are el Presidente, or the new one still thinks you are.

Living in Spain is fustrating in many areas

Yes.....after 12 years here, I still can't get my mind around just how many public holidays they have, or what they all are. We just had two in October, for goodness sake. Am I the only one who was completely caught unawares today? Fortunately the ATMs and Hipersol don't observe these frivolous non-holidays (Heretics!)

Dear All,

so there you have it, we need to follow Justin's example and employ more technos!!!!

every street corner and every play area should have one!

we need them on the beaches, we need them in the parks we need them everywhere!

the need is growing.

anyone know a good cloning machine?

but how do we stop them leaving us in the lurch and opting for the hot tub life???????

sorry must not tease techno, otherwise he will delete or edit my posts.

A small point forgotten but quite important, in the tiny hamlet we stayed in we met a young English couple who had just bought a stone house and barns for £112,000.

They said it was for "investment" and had great plans for it, "reform" etc. which I take to mean renovation, plus improvement with central heating instead of log burners and more living space.

They have bought off a lady policeman's wife after their dream had failed and a death.

We also met other English on the hunt for similar, so perhaps the market is returning at least in France.

Perhaps Justin is right and it is in Spain also.

Though perhaps not on the coast.

Regards

Norman

Norman,

'tease' as you say all you like!

However, for an educated man which you obviously are, I cannot understand your vindictive nature towards anyone who has happened to do well for themselves in Spain?

You for one should now count yourself as being such, after all the property you purchased is sat in a very prime location, seeing as we've just had the Volvo World Match Play Championship held at Finca Cortesin in Casares.

Where is Casares... on the coast... Costa Del Sol to be precise!

Where is your property again... oh yes! Casares.

Hmm! Maybe you are the 'shrewd entrepreneur' that you constantly accuse me of being!!!!

Yes! I can foresee events such as these really putting this area on the map... not that it needs much more with Sotogrande and Marbella either side of it... oh! and let's not forget Gibraltar just down the road!

Yes! I can imagine that every golfer in the world would love to play on this new and prestigious course.

Yes! Tease all you like... We are very happy where we are... Hot Tub, Golf and all.

Is that a smug look on my face.... you bet it is!!!

Dear All,

sorry techno, I have little education to claim other than technical, but I do have enough to recognise your shrewdness, as demonstrated by your acquisitions.

three properties under your belt at 41 with two successful lets and a handsome euro employment to boot is huge financial success in my limited opinion.

my acknowledgement and good wishes are genuine, I hope to hear more of your success in the future.

how is that vindictive?????

it is good also to hear your shrewd view of the future prospects of the area chosen by me to invest my life savings in.

unfortunately as you well know those savings were lost in a fraud and there is no "investment".

why do you pretend otherwise, are you being VINDICTIVE by chance.

as you also well know if those savings are recovered I hope to join you in a small way and still yet look forward to taking up your offer to view your properties and benefit from your experience.

I am also encouraged by Pitby and her decision to move to the area and equally wish her well in her decision also.

But of course it all depends on recovery from the scam.

Keep the good news coming but no spin please.

Regards

Norman

Dear All,

It seems that the thread has died an unresolved death, why no news?

have things got better or are they worse?

did he come to Canterbury and enjoy the low rent and super fast new commuter train?

or has he done it and is now lost in Spain?

or is he still with us and enjoying the winter misery of snow, ice, frost and rain with the odd gale thrown in?

is he perhaps enjoying the winter bugs that seem more virulent this year, paying return visits just when you hope you have recovered?

It is not easy to be comforted by the thought that others must be suffering awfully, if their climate is not killing off the bugs as ours is supposed to do, when you are having your second dose of coughing and sneezing as you shiver with your boiler turned down to try to make your supplement last a little longer and perhaps even into the new year.

It is currently so grey and miserable that the lighting has to be on most of the day in the sunny south-east.

The only crumb of comfort is the thought that at least Techno has had to put his hot tub away for a few months.

Regards and Happy New Year

Norman

I expect the people who were given demolition notices just before Christmas think it's really, really bad. Can't imagine how anyone can cope in such a terrible situation, the authorities are a disgrace.

Happy New Year.

Poppyseed

Dear All,

I am inundated daily with emails promising to make me a millionaire if only I would accept their free offers and pay a fee to join.

Sometimes the "fee" is only "cost" or "carriage".

But what I would really like, and would even pay for, is a way to deal with the lunatic "jobsworth" petty officials who cause so much misery in their lucrative careers in "public service", most especially PLANNERS.

Answers please but no firearms.

Regards

Norman

yes, it really is that bad!after nine years here we cannot wait to go back to uk warts and all

weather is nice at times( but remember sahara rain,devastating winds,freeze in winter, fry in summer) but does not compensate for the following

injustice- very difficult to get one's rights, usually means a long, hard, stressful and financially depleting journey

cost of living-myth that its cheaper here, from fuel to electrical appliances it's dearer with less choice

corruption-misery of developers who are never bought to justice, no decent infrastructure,wrecking people's lives

appalling public services-correos,  where  the service is a shambles and they don't care what happens to our precious mail,lack of decent bus service,

poor treatment of animals

lack of enforcement of regulations, especially road laws eg. tailgating, speeding, use of mobiles, driving uk plated vehicles as residents with impunity

complicated taxes and punitive, unjust inheritance tax-all method advertised to lessen it are not suitable for the average ex pat

 crime may be lower on spain statistically, but is targeted at so called rich ex pats-i definitely do not feel safer here, with all its distraction scams, road bandits etc from whidh i have suffered.

attitude of ex pats-devious scams to obtain benefits and allowances to which they are not now entitled, brag about cheating the health system both here and in the uk, also do not pay income tax on their pensions from uk even though they must know their tax liability is here, while "mugs" like myself try to live in a decent legal way. i don't want to live alongside people like this.

yes, spain does welcome children and they enjoy family life, but just look how they puff away over their vulnerable children and drive along without putting seat belts on

advice often conflicting and confusing, especially relating to driving and tax matters -so called experts often do not agree.

constant upkeep of villas-forever filling in cracks, repairing.professional services very expensive

unless you are wealthy enough to pay for private help, you will have a hard time when you are older, or become physically disabled, needing physical help in the home. you should not rely on the goodwill of neighbours .  yes, i know all about cold, rainy, crime ridden uk and  i know i'll be better off there in every way-you have to live here to know that!