Is living in Spain really that bad now???

Traditions are changing in Spain. I hear Bull Fighting is now banned in some cities, and other cruel (traditional) blood sports also being reviewed. So bad traditions can change when enough people stand against them. Let's hope corruption/rough justice goes the same way one day?  If enough stand up against it then recovery could come sooner than later, and Spain will be a better place to live for all.

Fiests's and similar, great stuff.

Family values, moral education, community living, caring for your environment, being respectful to one another, appreciating the country's culture and splendour, fair (and accountable) government and justice system, tolerant and non corrupt society, decent social structure etc etc..........all basic requirements to  a happier life and values that we Europeans probably could all do with taking note of, no matter where we choose to reside.

As for Spain being that bad (reference the thread), it strikes me from the posters who have addressed this issue to date that Spain reflects more basic traditional values that we Brits could well take note of, that some of the British influence over there (don't want to make bold generalisations here in case I'm wrong) have introduced elements into the society that are not particularly endearing (putting it nicely!), that they are a welcoming people, relatively happy with their lot and fiercely proud of their country. But it also has some major failings that presumably arise from a relatively young democracy, but still need to be addressed for a civilised society to work well.

If I'm not moving away from the thread too much, I'm interested to follow through on Si's point about paying into the system over there. What is the reality out there right now? I thought that many foreign nationals were paying into the tax system? I'm asking out of curiosity, not making any judgments. How do the Spanish  regard the foreign nationals in the main? And how does this impact on the situation in Spain right now in terms of the thread topic? Is it really that bad now?

Most British people I know are paying into the system in fact they are paying ridiculous amounts monthly into the system. It is worth noting that the Spanish are enjoying the generous benefit system in the UK. If you know Spanish watch at how intelligent, capable young spanish people are living rent free and enjoying lots of free time in Edinburgh:

http://www.rtve.es/mediateca/videos/20091006/espanoles-mundo-edimburgo/600422.shtml

Personally, I don´t have a problem with this they are just taking advantage of the services that they feel entitled to but how many foreign people in Spain realise that they are entitled to help too?

Susan

Hi Susan,

I would say the Spanish benefits system is a lot more generous than the UK system.  We were both getting over 1000 euros per month in unemployment benefit whilst temporarily unemployed.  I wasn't entitled to the full 24 months of beneift, but qualified for 19 months worth and I still have 17 months to use up if I find myself on the dole again.  You only need to sign on once every 3 months as well.

So it's a nice cushion you get in Spain when you find yourself without a job, whereas Job Seekers Allowance in the UK is barely enough to survive on.

If I do find myself on the dole again in the future, I will definitely consider going off travelling for 3 months, courtesy of the Spanish taxpayer!!

David

Sanchez1

wow, that's a suprise!.  The UK is often criticised to for being over generous with benefits, so attracting large amounts of immigrants, but seems Spain is far more generous. I wonder how many take advantage of that?

Having never had the option to claim benefits such as child allowance, etc., maybe I should be looking at these benefits here in Spain - especially as we are now paying into the system!

Yet another bonus about being back in Europe!

But you have to remember that unike in the UK where potentially you can live forever on benefits, I believe that after two years of claiming you are no longer entitled to claim anymore.

Susan

 you do have to have been on a full employment contract in Spain to get any benefits.

As a large percentage of Ex pats and come to think of it local workers, are autonamous so they do not qualify for unemployment benefit.

It is also worth mentioning that when you sign on they do find work for you either gardening,tidying the streets etc....if you refuse this,they stop your benefits.......maybe that is something the UK could learn from Spain.

very few people are actually entitled to anything.........

Hi Susan,

Something they have just introduced is that when your 2 years are up, you can then claim 400 euros per month. Not sure how long that is for though.

I also heard they are changing the rules so that autonomos can claim dole as well.

David

 if they open it up to autonomos as well there will be a lot of estate agents in the dole queue..........there could be a few porkies on those claim sheets!!

If autonomos can claim then perhaps we should all claim together and go on a 3 month bender around Europe next summer!

Susan

georgia wrote

''It is also worth mentioning that when you sign on they do find work for you either gardening,tidying the streets etc....if you refuse this,they stop your benefits.......maybe that is something the UK could learn from Spain.''

yes, the UK certainly could. As long as the working conditions are fair then I see no excuse for refusing work, and would encourage many lazy so*s to get off their backsides.

I would be suprised if the autonomous in Spain start getting bebefit?. It would be so open to corruption, and the Spanish government want to keep that bonus for themselves and their chosen!!

 Hi Goodstich,

There are a team currently doing the gardens in front of my house, they work 3 days per week from 9am untill 2pm, the other 2 days they attend a college course, in this case in landscape gardening,

I think this a great scheme it gets the best out of the community whilst justifying benefit payments to us taxpayers,it also gives people a qualification for further use.

Mind you at the speed they are going at the moment by the time they get to one end of the gardens the palms they have trimmed will need doing again!!!

........sounds good. Probably get more output if they paid them per palm though!

It drives me mad seeing young healthy people just siiting around drinking cans of lager in the daytime. I think most of them could work if they had the incentive?

At last a Spanish perception of the British.........see http://www.eyeonspain.com/spain-magazine/spaniards-view.aspx if you are interested.

It's an honest take, and begs a few questions.

ads

can't really argue with her opinion and view. On the whole, we are a lazy lot with language. The only thing I would say is that if the UK made as much money out of Spain as Spain does out of the UK, or anything like as many Spanish visited or bought in the UK,  then I think some UK people in the UK would be more inclined to learn the lingo, if only to do more business?........or chat up the Spanish girls! 

Not an excuse, just an observation.

Even if the British used a phrase book occasionally it would demonstrate that they were willing to have a go.

We all have different abilities re language skills so I am aware that it is not always easy for some, especially those who are from an older generation, and I take your point Goodstich that its in business' interests to communicate with their customers ( and the fact that English is a universal language) , but it's making an effort that can make all the difference to the Spanish psyche I would have thought.

It can't be comfortable for the Spanish locals however to witness non integration en masse, if that is what is happening in the Costas. Back in the UK we don't like it when certain cultures appear less inclined to make that effort, so why should they not feel equally concerned?

I think many have taken for granted the fact that English is a universal language and have almost come to expect it of others. It's different when you are on holiday, but when you live in a country and still don't make that effort then that's when its not acceptable.

ads

quite agree. I think it's rude and unfriendly of anyone living in Spain not to at least try. Apart from that it would benefit those trying to learn even more than the nationals, so why on earth wouldn't anyone give it a go?  I've found the Spanish far more patient than say the French when it comes to an 'ello ello' sort of communication!!

John and I are both retired and in our 60s, so we don't find it easy learning another language.  We both learnt French at school, and I find that at times I mix up the languages so am talking "Franish" or "Sprench"!  However our local adult education centre provides free Spanish lessons twice a week for anyone on the padron, so we are gradually improving.  Certainly the locals in Jumilla are very patient and helpful when we try to speak in Spanish, which is good as very few people here speak English!

Sue

Tony and I are 57 and 61, resepectively, and we have spent the past 5 years trying to learn Spanish. I am doing quite well (I think) but Tony finds it really hard...probably because he found ENGLISH really hard at school.  Because he is so worried about 'making a fool of himself' he lets me do all the talking when it comes to HAVING to speak Spanish and, much to my annoyance, he often catches parts of the converstion that I miss!  I reckon it's because I am concentrating so hard on what is being said, whereas he can realax and just listen.  That's my excuse, anyway.

BUT, I am determined that I'll be fluent in Spanish one day...however long it takes, because I just love the language (and the people of Spain).  Next month we will be driving to Almoradi to spend our first winter there and, hopefully many more winters, and we are really looking forward to meeting some of the people we have 'met' and read about on eye-on-spain.

Sue and John...we love Jumilla (nearly bought there once) and it would be great to meet you sometime whilst we're nearby...and anyone else in the area this winter.