El Pinet

I would like to say for the record that I haven't had a go at the commitee. As I have said I have served on various types of committee and know its a thankless job.

Its just that meetings are held a we never get to hear about them or what is said. Its only when payment is required. Also it needs someone in charge of the EP web site to keep it updated.

It has since been updated I see. Lets hope the information supplied will be acted on by someone.

I have been negotiating to purchase a Quad. My solicitor has advised against purchase because there is no habitation certificate. He has pointed out that one of the possible consequences of no certificate is that there may be interruptions in the supply of services, and this may not be easily rectified. It seems like this is exactly what has happened and is happening at the moment with electricity and water.

Is there any end in sight for obtaining the certificates? It is such a shame as the properties and their location are otherwise absolutely perfect?

I haven't yet pulled the plug (pardon the pun) on my purchase but I think it is just too risky.

Hi scooby 1, Your solicitor is right there is disruption of the power and water. However if you intend to use it as a holiday home then there maybe no power when you go out. One day all the problems will be sorted, we have been waiting for five years for it to be sorted. Can you wait that long? 

On the other hand the prices have gone down and you could pick up a quad for 150000e or less but the feeling is once we get the COH then the value will go up. This is of course my opinion others may feel different.

Have a look at the other posting and you might get an idea of the problems at El Pinet.

The moment any of us are threatened with legal proceedings it should be to the nearest police station and an investigation into the use of the 'community money' sought.

Dear Sir /Madam,
One very short question. Is it legal for funds collected for
community use to be used to pay for personal energy and water usage or
a third party debt?

Thank you for getting in touch with the Department of European Residents.

The community funds are to be used for the community and not for personal or third party use. You have some information regarding the law regarding owners' communities (propiedad horizontal) at: http://www.residenteseuropeos.com/prophorizontal_en.php

Un saludo,
 

Hi all,

I agree with you Victor, if you use it you pay for it.

I have had an email from a friend at El Pinet. The apartments were cut of again on the 20th, yet he tells me that there is a villa that has been decked out with Christmas light which are left on untill about mid-night.  

Am I expected to pay for that. I say take me to court and I will fight you all the way. My payments into the community chest has been missused, which under the Propiedad Horizontal rules is illegal.  

I have a contract with the builder, he should be paying for the services going into the site. If any legal action is taken it should be against him.

It seems to me that the community are turning against each other, we should be united as a community not turning against each other as one day we will be living next door.

Dont make an enemy of me, if you do you will lose 

Well it looks like anywhere between 12% and 27% might be 'allowed to vote by the masters'. With luck, anywhere between 88% and 73% wont be paying that which the 'junta' should not be demanding. It really is time for the majority to start making serious issues.

When nobody pays and the water and electric is cut off for good, the residents have to move out and no-one can use their propery, what then? 

good question Ceejay, I really dont know the answer to that, but the ones with the greatest amount of money still tied up in El Pinet are SJ.

Isn't it in the interests of all owners' to try to keep the water and electric supplies running? Would the downfall of SJ be in our interests?  I very much doubt that.  I fear that I am throwing good money after bad because the efforts of those to keep things going are thwarted as we are not acting as a community.

I also agree that 60€ is a lot to pay each month when we are getting very little in return, but the alternative appears to be a total loss of our investment which I believe will be, by far, a much, much worse option.

Agree with what you are saying. Going back to when the €60 was ' agreed '...which was when I / we stopped paying {except when we visit) I know that  NO OBJECTIONS WERE RAISED BY RESIDENTS about it being unfair ETC. apparently it was a non resident Spaniard that proposed it. ...mmmmmmmmmmmm..Was he an SJ plant?  It is however worrying that trees are being sprayed at someones whim, there are thoughts of having people employed for various jobs, pool attendant, etc......A proper constitution needs to be drawn up with full agreement of all OWNERS about exactly what we expect. Personally, no more than is in the deeds.

QUESTIONS

Committee Meeting at El Pinet

10th June 2010

Hi all, Like a lot of people I stopped paying when the charge went up to 60e, as I believed that if I was not using the power or water then why should I pay for it.

However in November of this year we moved out to El Pinet. As I believe that nothing is free in this world, I started to contribute towards the sevices at El Pinet seeing that I was using it. Since then I have had no electric for 16 days and no water for about 7 days.

During my period here my power kept going off. When I checked the main circut breaker it was in the off postion. This was easily remedied by putting the switch back up. Then on the 21st Dec my water went off, I made the usual enquiries and discovered that I was the only apartment without water. After a couple of days I checked the cabinet where the stop cock is located. This cabinet was fitted with a padlock. Once I gained access I found that someone had turned the stop cock off to my apartment and had padlocked the access door shut. I ask myself who has access to these keys?    

It seems to me that someone has taken it upon themselves to be a vigilante. What next a linch mob!!

This is a malicious act to deliberately deny anyone of power and water. I hope that they are proud of their actions.

So be warned everyone if you're a non payer and come out here on holiday. the people that smile and nod to you in the morning may be stabbing you in the back in the evening. 

Hello Pat & Linda

Nothing surprises me with what goes on there. I don't imagine that important keys are availible to anyone only the selected few.

Have you asked any of the committee who has these keys. Does any of the committee read these postings. Maybe you could answer the question.....who has access to these keys?

I put on notice to all the bully boys on the El Pinet committee, you may not know who I am but I know exactly who each everyone of you are.  If you start to mess with residents in this manner, then you will have to suffer the consequences.

You threaten legal action for an unpopular 60E fee.  Even your own statements state that you are not acting legally as the site does not have CoH and therefore no-one should be living there anyway.  So how you propose to take legal action against non-payers for a site that no-one should be living on is beyond us.  If you passed a motion requiring all residents to have electricity meters installed to determine usage, then you would get a mandate from the majority of the residents.  It can be done, be it at a cost, but then it would unite us all in paying for our usage.  Community fees should not be used to pay electricity bills and your misuse of this money is a matter of record.  A permanent resident in a villa with air con and a pool should not be paying the same as a resident with an apartment that is used as a holiday home.  The feeling amongst the majority of us is the committee have some self interest in relation to this blanket fee and we demand that you address this issue as a matter of urgency.

Again, I warn you all, continue to mess with us and we will mess with you 

If you need access to a box and there is a lock on it, just get a 2lb hammer and whack it off. Nobody has the right to turn anything off.

OR   put on your own proper lock
 

Coach bolts and nuts that have been rounded would be really cheap and very inconvenient!!!!!

I have lived in Spain for many years and I have followed comments about El Pinet with interest, having purchased a weekend retreat there many years ago.  I have never stayed at the property overnight but have been to it several times a year. As you are all aware the site has no habitation certificates.  There is much talk from the committee about spanish law and taking to court owners who have not paid the 60E community fee.  My property is one of the ones that has never paid and this is because until a habitation certificate is isued it is illegal for anyone to stay at this site.  The 60E is required by the committee to fund the illegal actions of owners who are habitating the site.  The community fee is to look after and maintain the site, not as they request to fund cheap electricty for their personal use.  There is mention of a a debtors list.  If such a list does exist and my property and name is on it, then I will go to the local authorities and denounce the committee, as they are the ones who are acting illegally not me.  Furthermore, the advice I have from my solicitors is that the community charge is mandatory once the habitation certificates are issued and until this is done, the builder or the administrators are responsible for maintainance and any costs.  If you want to illegally live there and incur additional costs at the site then that is a matter for you.  Don't dare ask for those of us who are respecting spanish law to fund your illegal activities.

A further point of law that you may want to take into account is that the data protection act in Spain does not allow you to make lists of payers and non payers available for general release without the consent of anyone that is on it.  I will be taking this matter further with the relevant spanish authorities.

I to have been following comments on 'eyeonspain' and although I agree with some of the comments I feel I should now make my own comments! 

I have lived at El Pinet for a number of years.  During this time many  non-residents visit their properties using both water and electricity.  I know some of these non-residents DO PAY their community fees, but, I disagree with owners who come out and leave their properties for months on end leaving irrigation systems on, terrace lights on, and A/C on.  Many permanent residents have walked around the site and we hear A/C units running 24/7 with no one in the property.  This is why permanent residents are struggling to pay horrendous electricity and water bills.  Some non-residents pay their dues but others who rent out their properties for substantial rental fees do not pay their community fees and I wonder - do they pay their taxes on this income which is a law in Spain?

I pay all my taxes in Spain including Property tax (Suma). There was an incident not on this site, with a woman who failed to pay her property tax, moved back to England, then the Spanish Authorities located her and siezed her property in England to cover outstanding debts as guided by EU Law.

For the idiots who have put 'don't mess with us or we will mess with you' and also 'don't make an enemy of me because you will lose'.  Well I think Hitler made similar statements so I hope you will have better luck than him. 

Happy Sue year

Well, doesn't it get interesting! Meetings so most can't attend. (summer or winter) how convenient. Can not condone violence....just don't pay.

A couple of points.

Water  when supplied by 'mains' is about €1/m3. (1000 litres)  i.e pretty cheap. a/c on the other hand is not. How many residents use the a/c to heat? min 20p /hr/unit.

Water and electricity will be wasted particulaly if  'it'  is 'off' at a time people leave. I believe one flat suffered fire damage after the occupants left a tea towel on the cooker while the power was off. Taps will have been left on...even by children.

Nice to see more joining in.

oops sorry, forgot to ask dd. How many permanent residents are there?

oops sorry, forgot to ask dd. How many permanent residents are there?

Are there many non res visit during Nov / Dec?