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and why are you so sure that TM will come back with something?
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Because I know she will, or as she puts it No deal is better than a bad deal.
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But again, good or bad it's her interpretation...not yours or mine. And. She is at heart, a Remainer.
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On BBC now
In a wide-ranging interview, Lord Heseltine questioned how Theresa May could campaign to remain in the EU as home secretary but "within a few weeks" of becoming PM, insist "Brexit means Brexit".
The prime minister, he added, had seemed to change her mind on the issue, suggesting "this lady was for turning".
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Courtesy of the Economist re free movement:
"No EU member other than Britain has said it wants to stop the free movement of people, but the principle has been eroded in several respects, starting with limits on welfare-benefit entitlements. Germany, the Netherlands and others have won several cases in the European Court of Justice, establishing that people from poorer east European countries are not entitled to claim immediate welfare benefits in richer EU members which often exceed median wages at home.
The EU’s “posted workers” directive prevents central and east Europeans from undercutting domestic wages and working conditions in richer countries. But it allows them to pay welfare contributions in their home countries, which has been controversial in France, in particular.
Some countries are trying to make it harder for would-be workers to come in without a job offer. Countries outside the EU but in the European Economic Area (EEA) can also in theory limit free movement, even though in principle they are bound to offer it. Liechtenstein, which is part of the EEA, sets quotas on the number of outsiders it allows to live and work there. Switzerland, which voted to restrict immigration from the EU in a referendum three years ago, has had to climb down, but it is at least being allowed to advertise jobs to Swiss people first.
The idea of free movement of labour was conceived at a time when living standards within the EU were more homogeneous than they are today. At the time nobody could have predicted the amount of movement triggered by the lifting of controls on east European countries. The sending countries do not necessarily welcome the outflow, either: although anxious to protect the interests of their nationals abroad, they realise that a brain drain of highly qualified workers may not be in their best interests.
In the proposal for continental partnerships by the Bruegel think-tank mentioned in the introduction to this report, the free movement of labour is not seen as a necessary part of a single market. The report also points out that, whereas the single market has lifted almost all restrictions on the movement of goods and capital, it is far from complete for services. The provision of services and mobility of labour, some economists note, tend to go together. And free movement is more essential for the euro zone than for the wider EU since it can be a partial substitute for the loss of currency flexibility.
Brexit may mean that no country in the EU or the EEA will challenge the free movement of people in Europe in the near future. Besides, the numbers coming in from outside and moving around inside may drop for a while. But all politicians want to be able to respond to public opinion, so the principle may start to fray at the edges. It could even become yet another example of the variable geometry that Brussels purists hate so much. "
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Jarvi
I am going on as it is a possibility some think it is a small or zero others think it is a real option
So you are saying 52% of the voters will be unhappy and rebel against the tories
Yet 48% exiters would be quite content and may support the tories
Yes TM is saying one thing but she might come back with something else and might just think it is best for the country
Remember she and many other MPs are remainers at heart
We shall see soon enough and nobody can say either way what will or won't be agreed
There are many other things on the table which will not be lined by either side
Bit the responses of the brexiters on freedom of movement shows the real true colours of the brexiters and that it is the only thing they can substatiate their vote on but let's not go there sgain
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“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge”
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Tadd
Its not just the Brits that are unhappy about the free movement rule, many other countries think/know its a mistake. There is nothing wrong with movement of people, its the free part that is wrong. I know we need Europeans to maintain many of our services or industries, and most of us Brexiters do not expect people to be sent home, however the system should not allow them to have any benefits whether in work or not as they haven't paid anything in. If you have watched the BBC programme Fugitives you would have seen major criminals such as Murderers and Drug dealers being allowed into our country without any checks, the same also applies to Brit criminals moving abroad in Europe. BTW I don'think TM was ever a true remainer. If you remember she only took sides very late on in the process after pressure from the media, I think she was doing a self preservation exercise so she wouldn't get binned by DC.
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Freedom of movement allows citizens of the European Union (EU) to move to, live in, and in certain circumstances access the welfare system of the EU country to which they have moved. Freedom of movement is one of the founding principles of the EU.
Cant see where this means movement for every other country in the world....Which we have.
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baz, nothing to do with Brexit. Please write to your MP
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Freedom of movement is an integral part of the equation as things currently stand with regards to access to the single market and therefore it will be interesting to see how this is addressed by the EU bureaucrats during the upcoming negotiations...
Whether they reform it with some balancing mechanism ( differentials) to make it more "palatable" to those member states that recognise the less homogeneous realities between the member states than when it was first conceived ( as reported by The Economist) and how it results in the "irregular" patterns of movement that have led to discontent across Europe ( not to mention the impact on economies through a brain drain) will be interesting to witness.
As previously identified the Treaty with Canada recognised this reality, so rather than yet another "sticking plaster" to heal the wound, why not treat it at source?
Those who keep making reference or implication to this being linked to some form of racism or unfair intolerance are failing to comprehend the homogeneous nature of the changing face of the EU which has expanded at a rapid pace, without taking effective measures to counter the inevitable impacts ( both social and economic) that have sadly arisen as a consequence of intransigence to change rigid and inflexibile rules.
This message was last edited by ads on 25/03/2017.
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baz, nothing to do with Brexit. Please write to your MP
perrypower1. It has everything to do with Brexit, in case you hadn't noticed free movement, and the uncontrolled way it's been abused has been one of the main reasons that many UK folk wanted stopped, hence the large vote for out.
Probably very hard for some to understand but had the UK government taken notice of what has happened with this, the so called free movement system, then many folk might not have voted out.
More then one person on this forum has spoken about the uncontrolled free movement knowing full well it's nothing to do with Brexit, I trust you have reminded them to write to their own MP also.
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I wonder if the SNP will explain in detail to the Scottish people before a vote on independence is called exactly what freedom of EU bloc movement in tails and how the SNP is going to fund the Scottish NHS /DSS/Education in a independent Scotland without the subsidies they currently enjoy from the UK that they have chosen to leave the SNP politician s. seem to be evasive when asked these question perhaps Mrs T May should only grant a new referendum providing the SNP gives a valid business plan on how they propose to run a independent Scotland.
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Jarvi
I travell a lot in Europe and and all the people I have met do not have a problem with freedom of movement maybe we are talking to different people. Teh one excpetion is in Spain whee they do have probelm with many expats and a lot simply berak thenm into 2 f=groups good brist and bad brits (at leats in my socisl circle)
Windtalker
You are assuming an indepependant Scotland will keep the same system they currnelty have in the UK they may change and be more in line with say Spain. As for a business plan then as long as they do something better than the UK has done over the last 8 montsh or so they will be in better shape to advise their citizens. they may be able to offer soem businesses that wish to leave the UK a place to to relect - a great opportunity to attract business from uK
Scotland will do what is best for teh Scottish not the UK and good luck to them.
_______________________
“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge”
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Tadd
I doubt you,ve been to Hungary or Kos by what you have said.
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EU President Donald Tusk has warned that the European Union could break down completely after Brexit, at a summit to mark the organisation's 60th anniversary.
Tusk called for leadership to steer Europe out of crisis at the special summit in Rome, which is being held today to mark the anniversary of the bloc's founding treaties.
'Prove today that you are the leaders of Europe, that you can care for this great legacy we inherited from the heroes of European integration 60 years ago,' former Polish prime minister Tusk said in a speech.
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The EU has a responsibility to see that it's members are being catered for fairly and progressively. It's not good enough to keep adding layer after layer of administration that seeks to develop some kind of super state and self important status.
If they had been listenening and applying the common sense measures that they should be doing, the UK wouldnt have left.
Regardless of what we say on here about what's going to happen, if the EU had been worth its salt so far, it would have been far more successful in keeping our citizens on board.
They are losing one of their jewels, and it's just beginning to dawn on them now. It's a shame, but that's the price of fish sometimes.
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Best wishes, Brian
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“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge”
Tadd, I think you should read your own postscript, why on earth do you think there are so many citizens voting for anti EU parties across the board in Europe, just because they are not yet the majority means nothing to the future.
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Tadd1966 your reply to my post seems to suggest that the SNP would have to introduced a private NHS /DSS/Education and the Likes to make a independent Scotland work within the EU ....if that's the case l love to see them trying to convince the Scottish people that privatization is the best way forward... .it is true what you say the UK DSS /NHS is over generous but if any political party tried to take this away ...then that would lead to that party's downfall.
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We have heard of the pains of Brexit in this thread, the separation of Scotland is a kind of joxit. What's the Difference?
The negotiations about separation of the NHS and the prisons and the currency and the education. Then if Scotland do keep the Euro membership, the self same negotiations plus how much they have to pay them to be a member.
They cant cope with all that surely, uk is struggling, Scotland has no chance on its own.
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Best wishes, Brian
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Hugh_man
Not enough votes to win or take them out if the eu
It might change but I doubt it
There are many who support the eu even in the uk where the majority to leave was slim
_______________________
“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge”
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