| The Comments |
** EDITED - Against forum rules **
This message was last edited by eos_moderators on 3/14/2017 12:34:00 PM.
1
Like
|
Poly Toynbee
Who the L else?
0
Like
|
Bloomberg
Why not go out where we came in?
Adios
Tteedd
0
Like
|
It's a telling clue that outers on this site dismiss any organisation or individual that contradicts their own perspective without any counter ideas. I actually take note of many people and organisations that hold an opposite view to mine that have some credibility and that are well argued. I do that to educate myself of the arguments on both sides. Not to have my own view simply reinforced.
Everyone's point of view has value in this debate as long as it’s not simply obtained by blind prejudices and ignorance.
The essential problem with Brexit is those intellectual ideas and the justification for the UK to leave the EU are largely missing from the political arguments.
Politicians of all colours just go blindly on quoting a majority of a million people as their justification for implementing and inflicting possibly the greatest catastrophe the UK has ever suffered since WW11. Do many of that million majority still believe the campaign rhetoric? I suggest not.
Patrick Minford is the only academic who came up with any halfway rational for Brexit. However his previous track record makes it unwise to accept his assertions as gospel main stream thinking.
It’s all in the lap of the EU now. They hold all the playing cards. That cliff edge looks much closer now.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
1
Like
|
All this talk of Brexit being a cliff edge for Britain ignores the other side of the coin, it is a funding cliff edge for the EU. Excluding Germany, Britain’s contribution is more than the total net contribution of the 26 other EU states combined. Guido will repeat this: add up the debits and credits of every member state from France to Poland bar Germany and it comes to a figure less than Britain’s EU contribution. Britain’s exit will be a massive budget hit to the EU…
2
Like
|
All this pontificating by the exit and remain camps, and their reasons are drawn into focus by Jarvi's message. The eu might have an upper hand (slightly) in the bargaining, but if they are too harsh with trading agreements post Brexit, the EU has almost as much to lose as the UK is almost certain to lose. it will be interesting what the final arrangement will be.
2
Like
|
Perrypower1 if you want people to take what you have got to say serious ...... if I was you I would start by removing Tony Blair's picture from your posts no self respecting Remoner would associate them self with such a person.?
This message was last edited by windtalker on 14/03/2017.
4
Like
|
** EDITED - off thread **
This message was last edited by GarySFBCN on 14/03/2017.
This message was last edited by eos_moderators on 3/14/2017 4:18:00 PM.
0
Like
|
roberto - the EU has almost as much to lose as the UK
In the short terms I agree. However in the long term Britain will lose far more. Even with trade tariffs of around 4% the real cost to the UK will be trying to export into the EU outside the current legal framework and regulation requirements. Britain will have to retain all EU regulations and laws to comply. If they are outside the customs union it will be even more difficult. Delays alone at EU frontiers will be a nightmare.
A transitional agreement of many years to remain in the single market and customs union is the only sensible option.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
0
Like
|
Northern Ireland politicians now want a referendum vote on union with Ireland after the election that increased support for Sinn Fein.
However the Prime Minister has rejected Sinn Fein’s call for a referendum on joining Northern Ireland with the Republic “as soon as possible”.
Michelle O’Neill, the republican party’s leader, said on Monday that Brexit would be a “disaster” for the province and that a referendum on a united Ireland could be one way of bypassing its effects.
Responding to the call on Tuesday Theresa May told the House of Commons: “The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland has looked at this issue. It is not right to have a border poll at this stage.
Brexit has unleashed a can of worms for retaining Britain's Unionist desires. Brexit costs are going to be enormous for the future of the nation but everyone who voted to leave knew that didn't they?.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
0
Like
|
I feel all this talk that Theresa May says exit MEANS exit is a tactical move on her part, she is playing poker with the negotiations, if she does this, any negotiation made could be easier for her to get, as the EU will be looking at her attitude as being of no compromise, so anything she gives to them will be considered a victory for the EU. Its a case of tricks and counter tricks. What the press is telling us is most likely totally different to reality.
Mickey, if you are right, the UK has two years to negotiate something that is of viable use. The clock starts ticking shortly.
1
Like
|
Mickey i dont think everyone who voted to leave considered the political and financial implications, or even understood what an exit vote was likely to mean, and also it was never made clear to possible remain voters that there were any possible benefits to voting to stay. I feel that both sides gave very feeble reasons for voting on either direction, and in the end a few people who didnt realise the implications swelled the leave vote to the point it just overtook the remain camp. If the true facts had been given to all the electorate the result might have been very different.
0
Like
|
Leave campaigners cleverly pulled the wool over the UK electorate’s eyes when they claimed “Our trade relations with the rest of the world remain unchanged” (Lord Lawson, 29 February 2016). This is, of course, utterly untrue. They claimed that membership in the World Trade Organization (WTO) and “continuing” trade agreements would protect the post-Brexit UK. However, the terms of the UK’s membership in the WTO, and all other “mixed” trade agreements (trade treaties concluded by both the EU and its member states) could be in jeopardy if the UK tries to exit without first securing a successful transitional agreement with the European Union.
_______________________
God Has a Dream: A Vision of Hope for Our Time
0
Like
|
Mickyfinn it would be good if Ireland became one... but that would not change anything great Britain would still get the blame for everything they got wrong.
This message was last edited by windtalker on 14/03/2017.
0
Like
|
If Northern Ireland joined the republic there would be many obstacles to be overcome, the power sharing agreement until recent events seemed to be working towards a better Northern Ireland, maybe the future will help, and it would be nice to see. The difference with Northern Ireland i think would be reunification for them and a renewed agreement with a united Ireland, as the UK already has a close friendship with the south. It would quite possibly be a good result for the Irish, and maybe improve ties with the UK. Fingers crossed.
0
Like
|
NICOLA Sturgeon’s independence dream was already badly floundering today as Spain joined Brussels in brutally laughing off her flagship claim that Scotland can stay in the bloc by breaking up the UK
In yet another devastating body blow to the SNP chief’s hopes of winning a second referendum, Madrid’s foreign minister bluntly told her Edinburgh will be “at the back of the queue” if it attempts to rejoin the club.
The bruising diplomatic snub came just hours after the excitement surrounding her announcement of another vote on independence, made amid much fanfare, came crashing down as eurocrats delivered a withering assessment of Scotland’s European hopes
0
Like
|
MORE and more people are losing faith in the European project and are being wooed by far-right populists because the EU has failed, former French foreign minister, Hubert Védrine said.
Mr Védrine, former top aide to the late Socialist president François Mitterrand, added Europeans were growing increasingly “disillusioned” with the crumbling EU project and anti-Brussels nationalists were “riding on that wave of discontent” and garnering support.
He said: “Some member states feel let down by the Brussels bloc, and feel that the EU has too many rules and regulations.
“They have become allergic to all the red tape.
1
Like
|
Jarvi, Nicola Sturgeon as i said previously has a poisionous method of diplomacy, and thinks she can manipulate the situation to her demands. If you look at what she is demanding, it is just an end to the means, which is if she forces a membership of the EU for Scotland, with her twisted logic it will enable her to get Independence for Scotland from the UK. In truth this is all she is interested in, she is pushing Independence as Patriotism. If she truly had any Patriotic tendencies she would actually be pushing for the best result for her constituents in the prevailing political wind.
0
Like
|
robert
If she really wanted independence then she would be lobbying for total independence from both the UK and the EU. She is just trying to make a name for herself and the Scottish people will see through her IF it ever comes to a vote on semi-independence
1
Like
|
Jarvi your last comment about Nicola Sturgeon was spot on
1
Like
|