| The Comments |
FLEXCIT's plan is to rejoin EFTA, to trade with the EU through the EEA. But later on, Brussels will be replaced with UNECE.
And of course products made in the UK for sale into the EU will have to comply with EU rules.
And yes many regulations and directives will still apply - doesn't seem to worry Norway.
Micky - this tolerant, multi cultural society you speak of - which I would like to be a member of too - doesn't seem to be working. Even Mrs Merkel admitted that in 2010. And a few months later the Germans were outraged by Erdogan telling Turks in Germany to 'integrate but not assimilate'. And now, basically, we are being blackmailed by Erdogan.
0
Like
|
I hadn't realised that the basis of the thread had changed from that of discussing the pros and cons of the UK leaving the EU, to that of the UK joining the EEA if it did, I must try to keep up. 
_______________________
I'm Spartacus, well why not?
0
Like
|
Almost losing the will to live now!!!😋
For those confused by all these acronyms here's some info re the latest one, UNECE.
http://www.unece.org/mission.html
Another program worth viewing of late is Andrew Neil's Sunday Politics program on BBC. Some relevant and searching questions put to both sides.
In terms of don't knows, how much of this is because the Govt have been unwilling to make any contingency for exit? With something so important does anyone consider this a dereliction of duty? Or will there be plans afoot behind the scene that none of us are aware of?
This message was last edited by ads on 22/05/2016.
This message was last edited by ads on 22/05/2016.
0
Like
|
teh exiters keep saying about how much we pay is too much and keep mentioning how Norway do
Norway pays a lot of money to be in the EEA (or whatever it will be called in the future) 340M€ how much would UK have to pay to follow the Norway model who still have to abide by EU dircectievs without a vote
So come on exiters what WILL UK do if the UK leaves the EU join the EEA like Norway or some other model
one of the major issues of leaving the EU is will the UK join the EEA or NOT those who do not see its importance well..............it is only one of MANY topics the exiters simply cannot provide a simple clear factual answer
so if teh UK exits and none of these decision have been made who will make them????
_______________________
“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge”
0
Like
|
ads wrote.
In terms of don't knows, how much of this is because the Govt have been unwilling to make any contingency for exit? With something so important does anyone consider this a dereliction of duty? Or will there be plans afoot behind the scene that none of us are aware of?
Actually I heard David Cameron say in the house (So it's in Hansard) a vote to leave the EU is just that LEAVE. No second vote, no compromise. It's out or in. I don't know what is complicated about that. Voters should think very hard about the seriousness of it.
This is the referendum question people will vote for:-
Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?
Remain a member of the European Union.
Leave the European Union.
Joining EFTA involves a form of membership of the EU so it's not going to happen. It's in or out with all the negative consequences for Britains future that will bring.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
0
Like
|
I think you misunderstand me Mickey. I'm referring to Govt contingency plans for leaving if that's what the democatic electors decide, based upon the fact that the Govt called for this referendum in the first place.
0
Like
|
Well I'm sure the civil servants have been beavering away with a list of what to do's that the public will learn about either after Brexit or in thirty years time if the UK stays.
Anyone who has been through a divorce can safely predict the outcome. Anger, recrimination and hard ball for the financial settlement. There are no positives there will be blood on the floor.
I have positioned my financial affairs for a Brexit. The risk to asset values is too much not to prepare for the worst but at the same time hope for the best. Most other people in business within Europe I speak to are doing the same.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
0
Like
|
|
I'm referring to Govt contingency plans for leaving
What are these contingency plans surleyteh voters need to know???
Joining EFTA (or EEA) involves a form of membership of the EU so it's not going to happen.
Where does it clearly state this????
What I don't get is people will vote to leave without any true knowledge of what will happen after an exit (much of it will be based falsley on immigration, nationalism, greed, and benefits) and leave all decisions to the govt whether that is to renogiatate all agreements (health, tax etc.), join EEA, impose visa reuqirements for any EU citizen to travel to the UK (and vice versa), or business issues such as import export duties, trade tariffs, or even form a new pact (union) with commonwealth countries or the USA etc etc etc - real democracy at work it will be like giving a signed blank cheque to someone or letting loose a dozen kids in a candy shop
vote exit we have no manifetso, no promises, no ideas but trust me I am a politician!!!!!
_______________________
“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge”
0
Like
|
Ads, I'm sure the government has been working on plans in case of the vote being leave. They have departments that plan for things like men from Mars landing on Hampstead Heath or someone putting radioactive isotopes in the drinking water.
You'll probably find a few little gnomes beavering away to plan for such a contingency as leaving the EU.
The government position is to remain in the EU. Why should they publish what they'll do if we leave before the referendum even happens? Bit like them saying at a General Election "If we lose then we wll do such and such whilst in opposition". No party does that.
And it looks like some recent "history" has passed people by. The Conservatives put it in their manifesto because Ukip were likely to take many seats off them if they didn't. The other parties had refused to do it and there was quite a public clamour for one. You must have read about it, it was in all the papers at the time.
0
Like
|
Thanks bobaol. I wonder if the sort of contingency that Mickeyfinn has identified in terms of positioning financial affairs has been undertaken by the Govt to minimise the short term risk in the event of Brexit, and what form would this take?
Here's another program on the EU debate from BBC Parliament channel, hosted by newsnight presenter Nick Watt which took place on May 17th at Chatham House. Both sides providing answers to questions from an audience that represented in/out and undecided camps.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b07dqkwl/eu-referendum-debate
Might help those who want more clarification, perhaps?
0
Like
|
Mickeyfinn,
Once again you deny that EU policies have led to mass migrations which is having a detrimental effect on the UK, putting yourself forward as an expert despite not living in the UK or having a vote in the referendum.
You laughingly say “Voting for brexit will reduce EU migration because the uk economy will go into terminal decline. No one will want to work there anymore so your problems will be solved. Except the British will pay a high price. Collapsing house prices, inflation, higher taxation and food prices.”
You then go on to quote from the Guardian, a leftie trash newspaper which is only bettered by the Morning Star.
Quite frankly suggesting that “No one will want to work there anymore” is insulting, patronising rubbish. Just shows how out of touch you are.
You criticise government policy in the last 20 years. Obviously you are not a Blairite as you would support him in the way he and his cronies deliberately socially engineered immigration to get vote. You do however admit that the EU is responsible for mass migration to the UK but resent any suggestion that this policy has affected the social structure and economy.
There is significant youth unemployment in the UK, one of the issues that you avoid. This is fuelled by the EU policy of freedom of movement.
I have pointed out to you how employers, under a Labour Government began to exploit cheaper Eastern European Labour and get rid of British workers who were more expensive. This has continued and organised immigration crime has increased to such an extent that the Human Trafficking Act was passed into law.
For those of you who did not read this story have a look at
http://striking-women.org/module/striking-out/gate-gourmet-dispute
It was a labour Government, with chancellor ‘prudence Brown’ who promised ‘no more boom and bust’ and ‘British jobs for British People’ who led us into the situation that we have today, whilst Osborne may be doing his best to resolve the situation, the solution in the view of many people is for the UK to take back control of our destiny.
Cameron has told us that we have a special relationship with Europe. I think not. All animals are equal but some are more equal than other
2
Like
|
MAIL ON SUNDAY COMMENT: Brexiteers' logic begins to crumble
Micky, how many times have you lambasted anyone who quotes the Daily / Sunday Mail?
Seems to me that it's ok if you think the story suits your opinion but it is a newspaper for low lifes when it doesn't.
What an incredible contrary person you are.
3
Like
|
The Mail does have a propensity to exaggerate quotes, as do many of the 'inners', whereas the 'outers' just tell it as they see it, there is nothing to exaggerate about when you are living in it. Micky and co don't realise that this is nothing like a political election, and with many of them not even having a vote they are unable further their cause, most folk that I speak to are still undecided, the pollsters simply position their guys where they will get the answer that they are looking for.
_______________________
I'm Spartacus, well why not?
0
Like
|
David Cameron’s closest friend in politics today breaks ranks to say Britain must leave the ‘arrogant and unaccountable’ EU.
In a shattering blow to the Prime Minister, Steve Hilton claims the UK is ‘literally ungovernable’ as a democracy while it remains in a club that has been ‘corruptly captured’ by a self-serving elite.
And in an attack on Project Fear, the former No 10 adviser dismisses claims by Mr Cameron, the IMF and the Bank of England that being in the EU makes us more secure.
In an exclusive Daily Mail article, Mr Hilton – who persuaded Mr Cameron to stand for Tory leader – also delivers a devastating assessment of the PM’s referendum deal.
He says Mr Cameron made only ‘modest’ demands of Brussels – and that even these were swatted contemptuously aside. He also warns that Brussels will take revenge on Britain for the referendum if it votes to stay, by imposing fresh diktats.
Mr Hilton concludes: ‘A decision to leave the EU is not without risk. But I believe it is the ideal and idealistic choice for our times: taking back power from arrogant, unaccountable, hubristic elites and putting it where it belongs – in people’s hands.’
His declaration for Brexit with exactly a month to go until polling day will send tremors through No 10.
Along with Michael Gove, he provided the intellectual heft behind Mr Cameron’s rise to power.
Both men now argue that the PM is wrong to urge voters to remain in what Mr Hilton condemns as the ‘grotesquely unaccountable’ Brussels club. The former policy guru’s intervention came as:
■ George Osborne sparked fresh accusations of scaremongering by claiming Britain would be tipped into a year-long ‘DIY recession’ if it leaves the EU;
■ Mr Cameron clashed with one of his senior ministers over his support for Turkish EU membership;
■ Rival camps in the referendum traded blows over the impact on the health service, with NHS boss Simon Stevens saying the organisation’s financial woes could be made even worse by Brexit.
Mr Hilton, who remains close to the Prime Minister, had previously declined to be drawn into what is already a bitter ‘blue on blue’ row. But today he claims the key issue for him is that Britain cannot make its own laws and control its own destiny from inside the EU.
Mr Hilton says Brussels directives have crept into every corner of Whitehall and that less than a third of the Government’s workload is the result of trying to fulfil its own promises and policies.
The rest is generated either by the ‘anti-market, innovation-stifling’ EU or a civil service dancing to the tune of Brussels, he says. Mr Hilton continues: ‘It’s become so complicated, so secretive, so impenetrable that it’s way beyond the ability of any British government to make it work to our advantage.
Sorry, this in the Mail on line today, I will go and cleanse my soul later today.
1
Like
|
taking back power from arrogant, unaccountable, hubristic elites and putting it where it belongs – in people’s hands.’
and giving power to the arrogant, unaccountable, hubristic elites of UK politciians - the unknown future of an indepedant UK in the hands of these politcians.
Wonder if that's what he means by in peoples hands as it wil l certainlynot be joe public who decides what the future of an exit will bring in relation to trade, travel, immigration, benfits, border control, taxes, public funding, NHS, business etc etc etc
_______________________
“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge”
1
Like
|
Is the latest assessment by Cameron and Osborne a fair and unbiased assessment or has this been skewed to the worst case scenario? Do the civil service have an obligation to provide assessments of worst and best case scenarios? Are exit campaigners being denied access to financial information upon which to make their own evaluation? Can anyone advise if the EU have the right to immediately alter the free trade arrangements should brexit occur or does a two year transition period apply in this regard?
0
Like
|
I shall continue to ignore all negative personal comments directed at me. They serve no purpose and indicate a lack of serious counter argument worth reading.
The French finance minister Michael Sapin warned today that Britain cannot keep the advantages of European Union membership outside the bloc. He also said a Brexit would have far reaching consequences for both the UK and Europe.
Finance ministers of the G7 meeting in Sendai went on further to warn a Brexit would have reaching financial consequences for markets across the world.
If Britain votes to leave the EU it's probably likely the shock waves within the EU will trigger as response similar to that when anyone deserts their friends or partners. It is likely to be entirely predictable and entirely negative for everyone concerned.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
0
Like
|
mickyfinn your re r ight not tp worry about people attacking you - it is a sign of them losing or a weakness
Seen this on the BBC website as of March
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35616946
could not copy picture of graph onto here but I have broken it down
|
|
Total
|
IN
|
OUT
|
IN
|
OUT
|
|
con
|
293
|
163
|
130
|
56%
|
44%
|
|
lab
|
222
|
215
|
7
|
97%
|
3%
|
|
snp
|
54
|
54
|
0
|
100%
|
0%
|
|
ld
|
8
|
8
|
0
|
100%
|
0%
|
|
dup
|
8
|
0
|
8
|
0%
|
100%
|
|
sf
|
4
|
4
|
0
|
100%
|
0%
|
|
sdlp
|
3
|
3
|
0
|
100%
|
0%
|
|
pc
|
3
|
3
|
0
|
100%
|
0%
|
|
Other
|
3
|
2
|
1
|
67%
|
33%
|
|
TOTALS
|
598
|
452
|
146
|
76%
|
24%
|
Mainly tories (and DUP) want out – makes you think what they are going to gain personally
Whatever the result the inners will still be in Govt and form the majority in parliament who support the EU – guess who will be dictating the decision making of what an exited UK will do with relations with the EU?
_______________________
“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge”
0
Like
|
I shall continue to ignore all negative personal comments directed at me. They serve no purpose and indicate a lack of serious counter argument worth reading.
The French finance minister Michael Sapin warned today that Britain cannot keep the advantages of European Union membership outside the bloc. He also said a Brexit would have far reaching consequences for both the UK and Europe.
Finance ministers of the G7 meeting in Sendai went on further to warn a Brexit would have reaching financial consequences for markets across the world.
If Britain votes to leave the EU it's probably likely the shock waves within the EU will trigger as response similar to that when anyone deserts their friends or partners. It is likely to be entirely predictable and entirely negative for everyone concerned.
I have no doubt that the UK leaving might effect other EU membership, and that has to be the last thing that these want, the UK to leave and take its money with it.
I have no doubt that markets across the world might feel a hit, but they will adjust, just like they adjusted when it all started.
I have no doubt shock waves will be felt, they will all be saying after a year or so ' Wow...England is doing okay now...Best we all think about leaving now '
Sorry Micky but if being predictable is our leaders telling us war could break out, 800,000 jobs lost, house prices falling, and every other negative thing happening to the UK then I suppose we are all doomed, as I said before....Someone has to wake up because this is happening right now with the UK while being in the best club going.
So you see....I know no more then any one else about what will happen.
0
Like
|