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PERRYPOWER you are worse than Cameron peddling lies the BOE has an 80,000,000,000 War Chest thats 80 Billion or 80 Thousand millon in other words a S$%£$ load of dosh to see us through when the Euro currency fails which it will Zimbabwe was a cough this will be a MAN FLU in comparison you and your mate Mickey had better batten down the hatches pack your bags and hope we have you back
Love Hugh xx
As i said 90% of Brits are like me Poor but we have the Mass vote and we want change Cameron and his cronies have not delivered that he is merkels little Puppy dog woof woof
This message was last edited by hughjardon on 21/06/2016.
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Done the Spain thing Happier in the UK
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people who speak nonsense
The words of an expert.
Seriously though there is a big threat hanging over all of us. It will bite us in the backside sooner or later, in or out of the EU unless we get a grip of it.
This country is running a massive debt. This chancellor is in his second term and although he makes the right noises the debt is still increasing.
Quantative easing used to be called printing money, sooner or later it will cause the inflation that PerryP invisages. Out of the EU, when the crunch comes, with our independence, we may be able to ride the storm.
God help us if we are still in, the EU won't.
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This time, prior to an important vote, is known as the kissing babies and stroking dogs time by the Americans. The really dimmer inners still think that continuing shouting the odds will make a difference, well it won't, the weather will make more of a difference than their silly statistics
Roll on the 24th..
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I'm Spartacus, well why not?
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tteedd
Not at all likely. (Unless you are thinking of Switzerland, Iceland or Norway). The EU sells much more to us than we do to them. Germany does not want to lay of car workers and nor do Italy France or Holland wish to see their trade with the UK diminish.
I hope you're right, because trade benefits everyone. However, rules are rules, and theres no point thinking that we are exempt from rules, simply because we would like it to be that way. I think your point about the EU selling more to us than we sell to them in disingenuous. Yes, in outright numbers, its true. We sell something like 100b to them, and they sell something like 140b. I may have the numbers wrong (its been awhile since I read it), but when you look at the percentages, this is where it gets worrying. That 100b we sell to them represents something like 40% of our economy. The 140b they sell to us represents around 9% of theirs (again, not sure on the exact numbers, buts its what I seem to recall).
When you look at it this way, who bares more risk?
Another point is the geopolitical view, which the exiters seem to be conveniently ignoring. The EU will no doubt privately be formulating some onerous conditions, for the simple reason they want to make an example out of anyone that leaves. If you think Canada took 7 years to get a deal, what do you think the UK will get once we've stuck a finger in the EU's eye?
This isnt scaremongering, but rather politics, ie, the redistribution of wealth. They will see this as the perfect opportunity to bring services onto the continent, steal as much of the banking industry as they can back to Paris and Frankfurt, and run the Euro settlements in a place that actually uses Euros. That market is estimated to be huge (today I read around $1t).
Think too about companies like Airbus and what they get the UK to produce. I heard around UK 15,000 jobs will get moved to France. What knock on effect will this have to not only direct employment here, but to 3rd party companies that supply these. What will happen to the mortgages of all these people? What will happen if the BoE is forced to raise interest rates to defend a plummeting pound?
I dont know about you, but I have a mortgage, and I am very worried.
At least the way it is today (ie currently IN) seems pretty good to me, and with all the credible institutions suggesting financial armageddon if we leave, I dont see how we can responsibly put our childrens, and our childrens chuildrens futures in jeopardy.
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Vote Remain wiped the floor with Vote Hate tonight.
Project Hate couldn't even answer the simple question of how many immigrants they wanted to come to the UK. It is like their answer to every other question they are asked, they haven't got an answer.
They propose a Canadian or Australian Style points system to immigration that results in 200% of what the UK takes now per capita. They are just a bunch of liars or a bunch of fools who don't know what they are talking about. Beware of both types. Oh and don't forget their biggest backer financially is the BNP.
Vote for decency, vote for economic security. VOTE REMAIN.
This message was last edited by perrypower1 on 21/06/2016.
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Hi Rob
Nice to get thought out replies and reasoning on the thread rather than 2nd hand comments and abuse.
Yes about 40% (decreasing year on year) of our exports go to the EU.
They sell us £60b pa more than we sell them. The main benificiaries of this are Germany, France and Italy, I beleive. France and Germany both have elections in 2017 so will not want to do anything to harm exports in the interim.
Leaving tariffs as they are benefits the EU. It is just not realistic to start a trade war. None of us can be sure what will happen. The Danes seem to want a quick deal which might suit us but I expect at least one country will want to produce some sort of plan that keeps us tied to the EU.
It takes the EU a long term to make deals, if at all, as they have to pander to many nations and other countries do not like EU protectionism. Many countries have many more trade deals than the EU.
There is no way that airbus can drop the UK parts of it's consortium in the short term as it is bound up by contract. In the long term it would have to find new expertise in wing building. But there is no reason why it should want to especially if the UK becomes more competitive in the labour market than it already is.
I'm lucky, I will pay my mortgage off later this year. It is not BREXIT that I would worry about it is the national debt and the fact that the chancellor has been printing money. Sooner or later the economic situation will change. When it happened last time I was again lucky as inflation had increased house prices by nearly 100%. But I knew several people who could not pay the 12% that it went to at the top of the market and lost their house. The only protection is a fixed rate but long term fixed rates are hard to come by now.
I have looked carefully at the economic doomsayers. The treasury was the most honest but even that had the chancellors fingers on it. Most of the supposed experts were non of the kind, most had vested interests and were just expressing an opinion. Mind you of those who I consider to be well qualified in economics there were many who expect economic problems if only through uncertainty. The only economists I would take notice of are those with a long record of getting it right. I have approached out campaigners as to why they do not quote these people but found that many of these people have odd views that they (the outers) would not wish to be tarred with by the inners.
I was very much in favour of 'in' when I was young and voted that way in the '75 election so can see the attraction to young people. I could still be in favour of a US of E but it would be very different from the undemocratic, corrupt shambles we have at the moment. I am also concerned at the developing north south split in the EU and the rise of the far left and right.
I will be using all my years of study of the EEC/EU and experience and doing as you say, voting for the future of my grandchildren. I have to vote out.
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- The current population of Australia is 24,298,609 as of Tuesday, June 21, 2016, based on the latest United Nations estimates.
Perrypower1 makes another offensive comment in this forum.
Khan quotes the irrelevant statistic that Australia is now receiving twice the number of people that it did previously. It also has a population density of 8 people per square mile.
The out campaign simply states that the UK must have a level playing field for migration into the UK and unlike Cameron (and Blair) will not give a fictional figure.
The simple point is that the UK, as with Australia and almost every country in the world, including the EU countries that have put up borders due to being at breaking point with swarms of migrants, has a responsibility to manage migrants. All migrants. Which includes not having open borders for one group of countries and turning their back on the rest of the world, especially the Commonwealth which is 2.3 Billion people, About a third of the world's population.
We need skilled professionals for the NHS and industry, not unskilled economic migrants to feed the myth that British people will not do minimum pay jobs.
Those skilled people are best sourced from countries where the first language is English and are trained in a similar way to the UK.
Independence Day 23rd June
This message was last edited by MikeandHelen on 22/06/2016.
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21 Jun 2016 23:18
You see what I mean about abuse!
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1. After the government used taxpayers (my) money to fund their scare campaign I would council vote leave to take money from the devil if necessary.
2. The lady says she never enlisted with the BNP. But if the vote leave campaign thinks it is better for their image then give it back.
3. In doing so however they should demand that 'remain' should publish a full list of all their doners.
4. Some trade unions have been donating to remain even though they are aware that most of their members support out.
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The Turks seem very annoyed with Cameron.
They thought he was their champion in the EU.
Now they have seen him saying the opposite.
But we know what he is like. He will say whatever he thinks will get the result he wants.
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Well done Boris the cheers at wembley says it all reminded me of Churchill yes this will be the UKs Independence day we saved Europe before and we will again this will be the Catalyst for a greater Europe
Champagne on Ice well Cava anyway hey will I be able to still get my Cava at 2.99 from LIDL when we leave ?
Love Hugh xxx
This message was last edited by hughjardon on 22/06/2016.
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Done the Spain thing Happier in the UK
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Perrypower1 I have been reading some of your recent posts, and I am just wondering what part of the UK you come from.
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Which Churchill did he remind you of, the nodding dog in the insurance commercials?
I can imagine Boris on a zip wire fighting them on the beaches, and looking back at his finest hour of taking out the 'bendy bus' and promoting 'ping pong'. Otherwise the guy is a buffoon of the most privileged order of the Lord snooty brigade.
Just to add a little perspective to the 'old days', I had to add up my currency in dozens and twenty shillings, my junior school taught me about rudyard Kipling with a big map of the world on the wall and chunks of our red empire on it. The secondary schools in my area divided kids into the ones they thought were going to work in the pits, the ones for trades and the ones more academic could get a better education providing they were in the right school (all decided at age 11).
So in the words of 'monty Python', what have the EU ever done for us.
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Best wishes, Brian
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I've listened to a lot of the stuff on TV and other sources including this thread, but really learnt very little as a lot of the stats quoted by one side are contradicted by the other.
I watched part of the debate last night but changed channel after a while as it was all so predictable. I have to say that I thought that Boris's blundering bluster did not persuade me one bit - I think we have decidedly different tastes hughjardon  . Sadiq Khan seemed to win most of the exchanges with Boris I saw, although a few of his comments were a bit crass, not unlike perrypower1.
It seems to me that as a generalism if you live in London or are in a Public sector job, or middle management and above in a Plc you are likely to vote remain, whereas if you are self employed or run a small to medium sized business, or live in the provinces you are more likely to vote leave.
But what has struck me is the surprising number of retired and pensioners who are saying vote leave. This includes a large number of property owners living in Spain who you would have thought would vote stay to protect their status. I have to say I admire this as the referendum should not be about what is best for you, it's about what's best in the long term.
There's been a hint by a few that if we exit the EU the EU might collapse, which is thought to be why the USA want us to stay. For me that's a sobering thought, but on the other hand do we stay just to keep them afloat?
What I would like to see is the leave camp winning by whisker that's within the margin of error that provides enough ammunition for Cameron to re-negotiate a meaningful improvement in the EU structure and the absurd bureaucracy in Brussels to be dismantled and more powers and money returned to the democratically elected national governments.
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Don't argue with an idiot, he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.
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Talk about a Hollywood moment! We all saw the movie. We all know the sequel is coming out soon and you ain't the President of the USA Boris, although you are equally silly as the guy who wants the job. It was fringe worthy in the film, it was bonkers on TV in a live debate.
Project Hate, could also be called Project Shoulder Shrug because when asked a straight question they just waffle for 15 minutes without saying anything.
How many migrants are going to come to the UK next year if Leave win? Surely that is a simple enough question for a group who's main view point is reducing immigration. Don't bother to answer I know it will just be nonsense; but in truth it will be double what came this year and it will be double the year after that. So just to be clear, Vote Leave and net migration before we leave the UK will be to add 1,500,000 more people. Doesn't sound like the solution to issue to me.
Vote for decency, Vote economic security. VOTE REMAIN
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If we leave by a whisker, do we have a second referendum or something?
From what I gather leaving by a whisker means we leave for good.
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Best wishes, Brian
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Briando55, my guess is that if the vote was in favour of leave by a whisker that the powers that be in Brussels would be forced to re-think and Cameron would have a far stronger hand to make real improvements. There would probably be a fudge and a second referendum.
Equally you got to imagine that if the vote was the other way, a vote to remain by a whisker, he would say something to effect that he is "obliged to follow the voice of the people" without a comment to the EU.
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Don't argue with an idiot, he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.
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Windtaker, you asked which part of the UK Perrypower 1 comes from, well he posted quite a while ago that he lived close to me. As the Peak District National Park encompasses parts of Derbyshire, South and West Yorkshire, Cheshire, Greater Manchester and Staffordshire he has many options to select from, hopefully I will be lucky.
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I'm Spartacus, well why not?
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Yes perrypower1, vote for decency a thing that you have difficulty in showing in your posts.
You talk about project hate and abuse people whose opinions are different to you. In the opinion of many people the EU has become a self serving dictatorship led by Germany and many other countries have a significant percentage of people who do not agree with the way the EU is being run.
Nick Clegg is again on LBC telling lies integration about Immigration. Rubbish peddled by people like perrypower1.
The case for out is to take back control of our own country and destiny.
"Our crowded cluttered of continent of Europe" "The only solution is to deal with them sensibly" says Clegg about Immigration.. He is suggesting stopping immigration from outside the EU as a means of reducing net migration. What a stupid person this man is.
Simply, no swarms (remember who got in trouble for saying that) of migrants, managed migration, managed country. We do not need to be in a political union to trade says one caller.
Another one says Clegg is totally out of touch with real people. He says that Khan is being divisive in using the project hate mantra.
Why did the EU ignore the Dutch vote recently?
This message was last edited by MikeandHelen on 22/06/2016.
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